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The '''Travellers' pub''' is the place to ask questions when you're confused, lost, afraid, tired, annoyed, thoughtful, or helpful. Please check the [[Wikitravel:FAQ|FAQ]] and [[Wikitravel:Help|Help]] page before asking a question, though, since that may save your time and others'.  
 
The '''Travellers' pub''' is the place to ask questions when you're confused, lost, afraid, tired, annoyed, thoughtful, or helpful. Please check the [[Wikitravel:FAQ|FAQ]] and [[Wikitravel:Help|Help]] page before asking a question, though, since that may save your time and others'.  
  
 
Please add new questions '''at the bottom''' of the page and sign your post by appending four tildes (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>) to it, but otherwise [[Wikitravel:plunge forward|plunge forward]]!
 
Please add new questions '''at the bottom''' of the page and sign your post by appending four tildes (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>) to it, but otherwise [[Wikitravel:plunge forward|plunge forward]]!
  
{{disclaimerbox|If you have a question or suggestion about a particular article, try [[Wikitravel:using talk pages|using talk pages]] to keep the discussion specific to that article.
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You can find Archived discussions here: '''[[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/Archives|Travellers´pub Archives]]'''.
  
If you are having a problem that you think has to do with the [http://wikipedia.sourceforge.net/ Mediawiki software], please post that on the [[:shared:Wikitravel Shared:Technical requests|Technical requests]] page on [[:shared:Main Page|Wikitravel Shared]] instead.
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{{disclaimerbox|*If you have a question or suggestion about a ''particular'' article, try [[Wikitravel:using talk pages|using talk pages]] to keep the discussion specific to ''that'' article.
  
If you want to celebrate a significant contribution to Wikitravel by yourself or others, [[Wikitravel:Celebrate a contribution]] may be the place you are looking for.
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*If you are having a problem that you think has to do with the [https://mediawiki.org/ MediaWiki software], please post that on the [[:shared:Wikitravel Shared:Technical requests|Technical requests]] page on [[:shared:Main Page|Wikitravel Shared]] instead.
  
}}
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*If you want to celebrate a significant contribution to Wikitravel by yourself or others, [[Wikitravel:Celebrate a contribution]] may be the place you are looking for.}}
 
 
<big>'''Please sweep the pub'''</big>
 
 
 
Keeping the Pub clean is a group effort. If we have too many conversations on this page, it will get too noisy and hard to read. If you see an old conversation (i.e. '''three months''' after the last comment in that discussion) that could or should be moved to a [[Wikitravel:using talk pages|talk page]], please do so, and note there that it has been swept in from the pub.
 
 
 
* A question regarding a destination article should be swept to the article discussion page
 
* A discussion regarding a policy or the subject of an expedition can be swept to the policy or expedition discussion page
 
* A simple question asked by a user can be swept to that user's talk page, but consider if the documentation needs a quick update to make it clearer for the next user with the same question.
 
* A pointer to a discussion going on elsewhere, such as a notice of a star nomination or or a request to comment on another talk page, can be removed when it is two months old.  Any discussion that occurred in the pub can be swept to to where the main discussion took place.
 
 
 
Any discussions that do not fall into any of these categories, and are not of any special importance for posterity, should be archived to '''[[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/Archives]]''' and removed from here. If you are not sure where to put a discussion, let it be—better to spend your efforts on those that you do know where to place.
 
 
 
{{WikitravelDoc|collaboration}}
 
  
 
[[ca:Wikitravel:Bar dels viatgers]]
 
[[ca:Wikitravel:Bar dels viatgers]]
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[[it:Wikitravel:Bar dei viaggiatori]]
 
[[it:Wikitravel:Bar dei viaggiatori]]
 
[[ja:Wikitravel:旅人の居酒屋]]
 
[[ja:Wikitravel:旅人の居酒屋]]
[[ko:Wikitravel:Travellers' pub]]
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[[ko:Wikitravel:사랑방]]
 
[[nl:Wikitravel:Reizigerscafé]]
 
[[nl:Wikitravel:Reizigerscafé]]
 
[[pl:Wikitravel:Pub podróżnika]]
 
[[pl:Wikitravel:Pub podróżnika]]
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[[zh:Wikitravel:旅行者茶馆]]
 
[[zh:Wikitravel:旅行者茶馆]]
 
[[wts:Wikitravel Shared:Travellers' pub]]
 
[[wts:Wikitravel Shared:Travellers' pub]]
----
 
 
== OpenID still not working==
 
Also, login on en: using OpenID from fr: and URL ''fr:user:joelf'' doesn't seem to work either. Thanks for your help. joelf
 
:Take a look at [[:wts:Tech:Upgrade_to_MediaWiki_1.17#1.17_UPGRADE_BUG_REPORTS]].  --[[User:Peterfitzgerald|Peter]] <small><sup>[[User_talk:Peterfitzgerald|Talk]]</sup></small> 14:44, 18 June 2012 (EDT)
 
::Still not working yesterday. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 15:57, 18 October 2012 (EDT)
 
:::We will disable. Not a needed function at this time.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 19:30, 18 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
==[[Archaeological sites]] and [[Old Towns]]==
 
Started a page about [[archaeological sites]] and [[Old Towns]]. Contributions and cross-links are welcome. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 08:58, 10 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
: New articles: [[Christian buildings, sites and events]] and [[Muslim buildings, sites and events]]. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 10:39, 10 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:: These should link to existing articles such as [[Holy Land]] and [[UNESCO World Heritage List]]. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 20:52, 12 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
==Right to vanish policy==
 
I feel that we lack a right to vanish policy. The meatball version is to be found [http://meatballwiki.org/wiki/RightToVanish here]. The Wikipedia version is [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Courtesy_vanishing here]. Suggestion: import the current Wikipedia version. [[User:Riggwelter|Riggwelter]] 09:45, 12 September 2012 (EDT)
 
:*'''Support''' --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 21:16, 23 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
== Many more administrators needed? ==
 
 
It's been more than a year since the last Administrator, [[User:Ikan Kekek]], was nominated.
 
 
If you believe a Wikitraveller — including yourself — should have [[Wikitravel:Administrators|administrative status]] please verify that they meet the guidelines for becoming an administrator and then add them to the nominations section at [[Wikitravel:Administrator nominations]]
 
 
Nominations should also include a sentence or two outlining the nominee's relevant experience and understanding of Wikitravel's policies. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 21:24, 23 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
: The main reason for this problem is that nearly all the current admins have left to start another project. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 22:01, 23 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::W. Frank is correct -- qualified admins are needed now, and to guide this project going forward. This is an excellent fresh start for Wikitravel :) --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 20:29, 24 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
== Massive spamming ==
 
 
Can the techies improve the captcha or something to cut down on the amount of spam? I've been deleting several pages a day for some time & over a dozen today, and I am not the only admin doing it, but there are lots more. Most involve accounts apparently registered only to spam. Is there a way to prevent spambot registrations? [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 01:24, 24 September 2012 (EDT)
 
:Captcha is at its highest level (recaptcha, actually). We're exploring new ways to combat spam accounts, including the Abuse Filter extension. If you notice patterns in the spammers, please let me know. Whether it's coming from a common IP range, always posting the same exact content, similar usernames, etc -- if there's a pattern we can write a rule around, we can set up blocks.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 20:34, 24 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:: One obvious pattern is the dozens of pages with long strings of digits as page names, all with the same content, created by one user. [[Special:Contributions/Русская_месть]]
 
:: Another is use of the <nowiki><br></nowiki> tag, not needed on a wiki but found in many pages whose pattern is "Hello, I'm Bozo McGuffin from Camelot.<nowiki><br><br></nowiki> See my blog:" then some rubbish link. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 23:33, 24 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:: Thinking about it, if there was a way to prohibit new users from posting links -- for example just reject any edit to a new user page that includes a link -- that would eliminate most spam. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 23:51, 24 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::: [[User:Пиздец неруси!]] is spamming. Block immediately. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 07:42, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::::Yes, he has vandalized hundreds of articles. Blocking him before he vandalizes a few hundred more articles might be a nice idea... <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 08:25, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
If you feel strongly about this, as I do, then why not suggest other Wikitravellers — including yourself — for [[Wikitravel:Administrators|Administrator status]]?
 
 
Please verify that they (you?) meet the guidelines for becoming an administrator and then add them to the nominations section at [[Wikitravel:Administrator nominations]]. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 09:17, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:FYI, we have placed some filters, as well as scripted the mass deletion of the vandalism over the last 2 days. It's not a big deal in the end, just a minor annoyance. Vandalizing a wiki... pointless. Thank you all for you help.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 14:54, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::That's great news! --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 15:09, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
This account [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Special:Contributions/%D0%A1%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BD_-_%D0%BD%D0%B0%D1%88%D0%B5_%D0%B7%D0%BD%D0%B0%D0%BC%D1%8F_%D0%B1%D0%BE%D0%B5%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B5!&limit=500&target=%D0%A1%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BD+-+%D0%BD%D0%B0%D1%88%D0%B5+%D0%B7%D0%BD%D0%B0%D0%BC%D1%8F+%D0%B1%D0%BE%D0%B5%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B5!] has vandalised thousands of pages. On the software side of things, can making more than "X number of edits in X amount of time" by a new user/IP address be blocked? [[User:AHeneen|AHeneen]] 03:33, 26 September 2012 (EDT) PS:The name translates (Google Translate) as "Stalin-our shared combat". Wonder if it has something to do with those Pro-Communist/Russian nationalist people we've had to deal with on the Russia & Tiraspol pages?
 
 
:PPS:Looks like several vandalism bots might be those people.  За Родину!= For the Motherland!  Слава России!!!=Glory to Russia!  Слава Родине!=Glory to the motherland!  Пиздец неруси!=Nerusi f***ed!  Русская месть=Русская месть  Возмездие= Retaliation Месть русских=Revenge of the Russian That's all the Cyrillic user names that appear in the block log going back through the 14th.
 
 
:The red box being put on pages corresponds with the [http://wikitravel.org/ru/%D0%A3%D1%87%D0%B0%D1%81%D1%82%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BA:%D0%A0%D1%83%D1%81%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9 page of the user] that has taken over the Russian WT merging former Soviet countries into the "Russia" page. User page translates to: "Слава России! GLORY OF RUSSIA! Glory to the great heroes of the Russian land! Honor, praise, honor and eternal glory to the victorious people! Kudos to you, brave,    GLORY, fearless!        Eternal glory SINGS TO YOU PEOPLE. Valiantly lived,    Death is broken,        MEMORIES OF YOU WILL NEVER DIE! WE - RUSSIAN, God with us!"  Clearly some delusional apparatchik well-versed in Russian nationalist, revisionist history. Can Cyrillic characters be blocked from new user names? Any other ways to deal with this? Seems to me like the people who gave us the headache over on the Russia/Tiraspol pages were likely from Transnistria (which corresponds to the Tiraspol edits & the fact that Transnistria remains stuck in the 1980s with the Communist party in charge). Any way to automatically block (or put restrictions on editing capability) of Moldovan IP addresses? Possible to also add Ukraine, too, because Transnistria borders it and it's possible telecom services might come from Ukraine due to the conflict between Moldova/Transnistria.[[User:AHeneen|AHeneen]] 04:22, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
: Can we make it impossible to register an account on en with a non-ASCII name? There have been at least two accounts with Russian names used for vandalism. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 03:45, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::I see the vandalism and your heroic efforts. I think both those restrictions are on the table and good ideas.  Thanks for your heroic efforts in reverting. We'll have to see about a mass revert via username. If the Abuse Filter can handle the x edits/x time restriction, that might do it. Even if we set it to 50/hour, it would have helped here tremendously.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 03:56, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
I would strongly deprecate any blocking based on geographical area or Cyrillic alphabet names. We do not want the innocent to suffer because of the guilty. Number of edits allowable per minute (if technically feasible) would not penalise the innocent newbie so much, but set much lower limits eg 1 edit per 2 minutes for 1st 7 days  of a new account, then 1 edit per 1 minute for next 7 days, then 2 edits per 1 minute for next 28 days, then 3 edits per 1 minute for next 90 days, subject to manual override on appeal. -- <strike>[[Special:Contributions/89.242.187.211|89.242.187.211]]</strike> [[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 04:36, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:I agree with Frank, we shouldn't discriminate against a certain area or language. Anyways, the vandal could switch to ASCII names, so there's not much point in blocking non-ASCII names. But I'm fine with an edits per minute limit. <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 10:23, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:: I am taking out anywhere from two to twenty spam pages every time I visit, and that is just the obvious stuff. I'm not even looking at the dozens that are probably spam, the ones with a three-line intro to a "user" and some irrelevant link. Nor am I patrolling edits other than new pages and some things on my watchlist. I am doing far more deletions now than I used to when there was a whole crew of editors, but I'm also seeing more problems I do not have time for and much less patrolling by other admins.
 
 
:: If IB want to keep this site alive despite the massive defection of editors, something must be done quite urgently. Either find many new editors or have IB employees doing extensive patrolling. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 23:48, 14 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::: And the spammers are getting craftier. I believe [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk:Dajamer&diff=prev&oldid=1941189 this one] created several different "Black Hat" user names to vandalise dozens of pages and then went back using his "White hat" user account to "repair" the damage - but also added a tailored external link to a travel guide each time, hoping it would not be noticed in the pag3 "restoration"!
 
:::IBadmins are doing extensive patrolling Monday to Friday but there are patterns in this spamming which could be used to automate reversions.
 
:::Meanwhile, I would hope that we might see some more [[Wikitravel:Administrator_nominations|Administrator nominations here...]] --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 10:08, 15 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::::Thank for that alert, guys -- were you in fact seeing that spam piling up on the weekend? We do expect to see less of that as more admins are starting to peck away at night and weekends. We also are in the process of implementing a number of filters that keep vandalism and spam more at bay, but there is only so much Captcha and filtering can do versus NEW pages; no system is going to be able to tell what is a "good" new page and what is not, because there's very little commonality with which to write a rule that prevents them without potentially preventing "good" new pages from being created.
 
 
::::The good news is, new content continues to be added to WT at a fantastic rate. This site is doing great, and you two are part of the reason. If you have ideas for spam remediation, I am more than happy to implement them!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:24, 18 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:::::I do have one lead that you might want to check out - but since I suspect it might be against (your implicit) policy to mention the source here, I will email you about it. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 18:44, 18 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
===Abuse filter===
 
The abuse filter names are singularly unhelpful (they appear to be named after things like Stephen King novels and the like).  When a user gets a message like "A brief description of the abuse rule which your action matched is: Lethal Weapon", that doesn't help them make more constructive edits, because it doesn't explain what the problem was.  [[User:LtPowers|LtPowers]] 16:47, 25 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
===Legal action?===
 
User [[User:IBlegal]] has made some imprecise and obnoxious threats and IB has actually sued some users and there are countersuits[https://blog.wikimedia.org/2012/09/05/wikimedia-foundation-seeks-declaratory-relief-in-response-to-legal-threats-from-internet-brands/].
 
 
Would it not be a better use of legal dep't time to go after the spammers who are actively and persistently damaging the site? I took out 24 rubbish pages today, 19 yesterday, and I'm just doing the obvious ones. Unchecked, these bozos will destroy WT.
 
 
Also, going after spammers would be much better politically, doing something that might help all the other wiki sites out there rather than appearing petulant and aggressive. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 06:09, 13 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:You're not wrong! --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 15:01, 13 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::That was literally months ago. We've moved on.
 
::FYI legal has nothing whatsoever to do with spam. Spam is handled here, by people like you & me. Some of it we can handle technically, a lot of it manually. This is how it is everywhere. It's a neverending battle, but we do very well at it. I saw your edits over the weekend and recently, Pashley, and you're doing an amazing job! For instance: the life of the [http://wikitravel.org/en/Special:Undelete/Various_Knobs_and_pulls_for_door knob and door] page was... about 3 hours? That's fantastic!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 16:05, 13 November 2012 (EST)
 
:::That's great news if it really is true that Internet Brands have reached an out of court settlement with the Wikimedia foundation and the former contributors to this site that it sued, IBobi. Where can we see the press release and ''then'' move on? --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 16:23, 13 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::: Good question! [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 08:02, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
Yes, I know that currently "legal has nothing whatsoever to do with spam"; I am suggesting that they should. There are laws in place that make misuse of other people's computers a criminal offense and/or grounds for a lawsuit in many jurisdictions. The site logs have IP addresses for where this rubbish comes from. The spam itself has URLs for advertised pages. I'm both cynical and biased, so my opinion of IB's legal department is remarkably low, but I imagine they could do this. It might even be profitable if they nail the right spammers. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 08:13, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
:Again, you're not wrong!
 
:Although, the hard case spammers can use proxy servers and internet cafe's to try and attempt to circumvent these lawsuits, it would be a relatively trivial programming task to block IP edits (as opposed to edits by registered users) from each proxy or IP address as it becomes known for abuse. In this case I would suggest also blocking edits by registered users from each black-listed proxy or IP address until an editor using a black-listed proxy or IP address has made a certain number of good edits - say 15 - so that privacy obsessed and registered "good" editors are not handicapped in any way.
 
:Thanks for continuing your spam removal, Pashley! --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 10:15, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
::Ideally I agree with all of this. Internet companies have explored many avenues for actually tracking down spammers who blast their sites. The sad reality is they continue to make enough money doing this that they can afford to employ armies of people in between themselves and the site, masking IPs, and generally making themselves untouchable to anything short of the FBI; and if they're outside the US? No idea. Interpol? We always do as Frank suggested, blocking obvious spam user accounts permanently while also blocking the IP address they come from for a shorter amount of time. It's the best that can be done, and it works. The amount and type of spam we had three months ago was night and day compared to now. As we continue to add admins, it will get even better.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 13:46, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::: You think the current situation is "better"? Wow! To me, it seems an almost complete disaster.
 
::: Checking recent changes, I find I have nuked 57 garbage pages in the last four days. I am ''only'' checking main article space and only taking out really obvious spam. There are certainly dozens I am missing; I would not be surprised if it were hundreds.
 
::: Moreover, I generally just nuke the page leaving it to others to block the bogus users. I quite often see the page reappear in my watchlist with new spam, indicating that no-one is doing those blocks. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 14:07, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:::::It's definitely better; the measure is not how many spam pages appear, it's how long do they live on the site for. If a spammer/spambot creates a page, we delete the page, block the spam account and block the IP they used, the same spammer can then create the same page using a new account and IP. That's why you may see that happening after you nuke a page; it isn't the same IP or account, it's the same spammer. If I could delete *people* I would ;)
 
:::::By the same token, if you do happen to see the same page reappear after being created by the same user/IP, please let me know. We can always use more tips on how to get it done best. Whenever possible, I use the following technique:
 
:::::1. Locate spam edit. 2. Block user/IP. 3. Protect the spam page to be editable admins only (in the hopes that it won't be able to be recreated). 4. Delete the spam page.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 14:16, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
::::::You talk a good game but, as my neighbours sometimes say in Glasgow [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk%3AIBAlex&action=historysubmit&diff=1952468&oldid=1952345 you seem to be all mouth and nae troosers!].
 
::::::IB: "As we continue to add admins" but [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk%3AIBAlex&action=historysubmit&diff=1953924&oldid=1953816]
 
 
Good luck. I took out a dozen rubbish pages today, but I feel like I'm almost alone both as a contributor & as an admin. There are masses of admin work being left undone &mdash; patrolling in general, in particular catching the bogus user pages I mentioned above, blocking the bogus users for pages I've deleted (one spambot whose drivel I removed refilled the page eight times before I got bored & removed it from my watchlist; it is probably still active), appointing new admins (see troosers just above), ...
 
 
My editing work now is on other wikis where there's a reasonable community to interact with and admin things actually get done. I'll keep the account here and pop in from time to time to see what's doing, but for now I'm done with even trying to fix the spam problem. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 17:16, 29 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:''Bon voyage'', Sandy!
 
:The dwindling '''real''' community on Wikitravel (as opposed to some PR-speak or Orwellian new definition) certainly have appreciated your erudite contributions and dogged persistence to the bitter end here.
 
 
:I'll probably linger on (at least until fired by IBobi or one of his minions) since I hate seeing a good project destroyed by boneheaded stupidity and inaction. I'll message you privately via one of your other projects (since e-mailing is still disabled here) if there is anything cosmic that needs your urgent attention. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 19:35, 29 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:::Very sorry to hear that. In general, this *is* how spam gets removed. I and the other admins here at IB are constantly removing the spam that gets through the Captcha, Spam Blacklist, and Abuse Filters that we are also constantly updating. There will always be people trying to spam the site, and we'll always be here removing it. It's simply not possible to stop it all on the front end, so blocking and deleting is the order of the day. It's a fact of life, and any site that encourages anyone to edit it will have to deal.
 
:::You've been a very valuable admin here, Sandy, and I hope you'll reconsider & stay. Any suggestions you have will be heeded; in particular, if there are persistent spambots, we can block them at the IP level, or even rages of IPs -- there's no reason to continually remove the same content.
 
:::Either way, we'll be seeing you around, and thank you :) --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] 19:52, 29 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::: Pashley, it's sad to see you giving up. Please know, that everybody here '''highly appreciates your contributions''' and your '''administrative efforts'''. Spam is going to be always happening on sites where the content is generated by users. Actually, right now IB notices way less spam than it used to be. There are more people keeping an eye on the site plus we set up a bunch of abuse filters that help us significantly.
 
:::We would like to  see you here often. Please know that you are always welcomed on Wikitravel! Cheers! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 19:54, 29 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
== Help! ==
 
 
I'm trying to remove vandalism on the page [[Midwest (United States of America)]]. But I can't, and I get the message:
 
 
This action has been automatically identified as harmful, and therefore disallowed. If you believe your edit was constructive, please inform an administrator of what you were trying to do. A brief description of the abuse rule which your action matched is: Link spamming by anonymous or recently-registered users
 
 
Why is reverting vandalism harmful?! (unsigned by [http://wikitravel.org/en/Special:Contributions/204.45.134.109 204.45.134.109])
 
 
:Hi there, It may be that your edit included a link, which is something the system looks for from newly registered or anonymous IP editors (since they are often sources of spam). Sorry about that, it's a protection that helps keep Wikitravel's pages clean and spam-free. I recommend registering an account, and after you've become recognized by the community and the system, your edits can be properly attributed to you, etc. Welcome aboard!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 15:42, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:Also, I have made that revert!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 15:58, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::Ok, I've made an account and I'm trying to revert vandalism on the page [[Mombasa]], but I cant, and I still get the same message! Im only trying to help wikitravel. [[User:Ÿ;;!!!|Ÿ;;!!!]] 09:31, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:::I'm sorry, I realize you're helping by editing the page back to where it was before. Please keep making constructive edits -- we're happy to have you!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 03:07, 27 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
== MVGreenland ==
 
 
User [http://wikitravel.org/en/Special:Contributions/MVGreenland MVGreenland] has been contributing many listings and photos (see WS). What do you think of these contributions? Touting?--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 14:34, 27 September 2012 (EDT)
 
  
:Someone needs to review all the photos to ensure the licensing is correct...someone over on WT Shared needs to check these. Make sure to click the link to the photo. At first I clicked the link to the user stream and saw all the photos were copyrighted. However, when I clicked on the link to the photo ([http://wikitravel.org/shared/File:Raining_Qaqortoq.jpeg on WTS] and [http://www.flickr.com/photos/ilovegreenland/4929429831/ on flickr]) I noticed it was licensed CC-SA 2.5 on WTS & CC-A 2.0 on flickr. As far as edits go, I went through the most recent 100 edits and didn't see anything that goes against our policies. There were a couple photos of businesses added (1-2 hotels & a bookshop), but none of the wording in hotel listings this user has added sound like touting. IMO, the user seems like a very helpful contributor to our Greenland pages. [[User:AHeneen|AHeneen]] 00:24, 28 September 2012 (EDT)
+
== Business Listings: How Much is too Much? ==
  
::Thanks for that -- I generally felt the same way, as did IBcash, about the tone of his edits. Skirting the line perhaps but nothing worse than other business owners do.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 01:29, 28 September 2012 (EDT)
+
Earlier today, a bus company that operates New Zealand's largest passenger transport network with daily services from Auckland to many towns and cities in the Waikato region made an account, and proceeded to add their listing to a WHOLE BUNCH of pages, which looked like spam from my end. Should we allow companies to add their listings to more than a certain number of pages? Yes? No? If we do, what could be the ramifications? What could potential questions, comments, and or snide remarks could arise?  -- <small>—The [[Project:Using_talk_pages#Talk_page_formatting|preceding]] comment was added by [[User: Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User_talk: Tonikar|talk]] [[Special:Contributions/Tonikar|contribs]]) </small>
  
== Selection of Destination of the Month and Off the Beaten Path for Main Page ==
+
: Good question. But I think their listing should only be added to the city where their headquarters is located (and maybe to small cities and towns where they are the only choice to get into). Just imagine if we allow this bus operator to add all its lines to Wikitravel articles, we will soon see chain restaurants, hotels, and other business add listings to all places where they operate (actually, we've seen quite a few cases like this before), which will soon turn Wikitravel to a yellow page. Plus our policy about [[Wikitravel:Don't tout#Don't list the same place many times|touting]] is pretty clear about this: ''...businesses should be listed in only one article for the town or district in which the business operates... ''.  --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 04:21, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
  
Hey current editors! We have changed the Destination of the Month and Off the Beaten Path sections of the Main Page for October. However, we would value your input and suggestions in the [[Wikitravel:Destination of the Month candidates|Destination of the Month candidates page]] for following months. Please check it out! [[User:IBcash|IBcash]] 15:38, 2 October 2012 (EDT)
+
::I agree with Binbin, we'd better stick to our [[Wikitravel:Don't tout#Don't list the same place many times|touting]] policy. The risk of having chains adding their listings everywhere is too high (and we're not the Yellow Pages, aren't we?). [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:24, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
  
:Obviously I'd like to feature a New Zealand destination - but first I need to get one to Star status! --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 07:50, 3 October 2012 (EDT)
+
:::If you are in New Zealand without a car, it is likely that you will use Intercity to get around. I think that there is only one other operator (Naked Bus) with a smaller national network and some regional operators (Atomic etc) and for a few destinations trains. So I think that it is fine to mention them in the get in section. However we don't need the full details about WiFi etc in every article. I would prefer that some information was added about the services to a particular destination - e.g. "X has two coaches per day from Auckland via Hamilton and one from Wellington via Napier. Coaches stop outside the post office." [[User:AlasdairW|AlasdairW]] ([[User talk:AlasdairW|talk]]) 10:55, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
  
::Albuquerque has been already featured in the past as a Destination of the Month. <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 17:01, 3 October 2012 (EDT)
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::::AlasdairW, and Binbin bring up good points. This could be a slippery slope, but on this one occasion since they are one of the few transportation services listed on our site in some areas it seems relevant and helpful. Would it be okay if they specified amenities for travelers per each location? [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 9:27, 17 March 2017 (PST)
  
::: You're right! It slipped past me. Thanks! Since we changed it early because we didn't have one in September, we could keep it there until the 15th (the actual time when the OTBP would change) and then change it. What do you think? Any suggestions for another October OTBP? [[User:IBcash|IBcash]] 13:59, 4 October 2012 (EDT)
+
:::::I agree that we should stick with our policy, have the business listed once, probably best the country article, and there list some specific amenities if that adds value. In our [[Wikitravel:External links|external links]] policy it says clearly what not to list to, so if we make an exception for one business, soon more will follow. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 12:40, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
  
::::Thanks guys.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 19:55, 16 October 2012 (EDT)
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::::::Would it be good to review our policy, and add an addendum for the amount of posts that a company has added/ can add? Also, should we be reviewing these on a case by case basis; especially if we think it could be helpful for the traveler? Like AlasdairW, had said that it is likely you will come across this company's transportation system in NZ if travelling without a car... [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 1:42, 17 March 2017 (PST)
  
:::::Hello! Are there any suggestions for the '''Destination of the Month''' and '''Off the Beaten Path''' for '''December'''. Please let us know your ideas [[Wikitravel:Destination of the Month candidates|here]]. Thank you! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 19:04, 27 November 2012 (EST)
+
I'm torn on this one too. First, I love Alasdair's point that a business should take the time, if they are going to try this, to make EACH listing specifically relevant to that page. If they don't want to take the time to point out the relevancy of their business to that particular destination (and they ought to be encouraged by us to do so), they should not have the privilege of being listed here.  
  
== References/footnotes/quoting ==
+
Second, I am at a loss to find something wrong with listing a business on multiple pages, if those pages do not contain any (or a very small number) similar options. In this case, if you are considering traveling to a small town in NZ that is only served by this bus company, we ought to provide details as to how to catch a bus into/out of there if we have them. What is the harm? Now, if this is, say, New York City, where there are interminable bus and other transportation options for getting in and out, I would say that allowing companies to list all of them would be disastrous for Wikitravel, and of limited to zero use for the traveler. And don't even get me started on chain restaurants!
  
Hello everyone,
+
So perhaps there is a middle ground? Where there are many existing options, disallow the listing; where there are none or very few, allow them; and when allowed, the listing must be customized to that destination. And when we see a company engaging in this behavior, we ought to make contact with them as soon as possible, guide them, and have them provide a proposed list of everywhere they are intending to add their listing, as well as the specifics of how they will customize their listing to the page, BEFORE they spam it out everywhere publicly. How's that sound? [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 19:29, 22 March 2017 (EDT)
  
Being an experienced Wikipedia editor, but very, '''very''' new to Wikitravel editing (though a somewhat frequent reader of), I - on my very first intended edit - ran into a question.<br />
+
: I agree. In principle, listing on multiple pages is not allowed , except where similar choices are limited and/or there're none or only a few similar listings (we do have this "something is better than nothing" policy). Yes, a prior communication with the companies who want to put their listings on multiple page sounds even better so that on one hand they can do it properly with our help, on the other we can kind of make sure things don't go out of control. I think we can start with this bus operator in NZ. What do you guys think?  --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 01:40, 23 March 2017 (EDT)
In the [[Slovakia#By_car|By car]]-section of the [[Slovakia]] travel guide, I would like to have quoted a part of the [http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/travel-and-living-abroad/travel-advice-by-country/europe/slovakia UK Foreign & Commonwealth Office travel advice for Slovakia]: "''The standard of driving is not high and can be aggressive. Specifically, beware of oncoming cars overtaking on your side of the road (particularly on bends and hills).''" In my view it sums it up very brilliantly (having being a driving tourist in Slovakia on several occasions) and I think, that sourcing it would only make it all the more authoritative in this case. While being a reader of Wikitravel I have never pondered over the "lack" of quotes, but I have now looked into both a number of articles as well as various parts of the [[Wikitravel:Manual of style]], the [[Wikitravel:External links]] (could be it had something - it didn't) and [[Wikitravel:Welcome, Wikipedians]]/[[Wikitravel:Cooperating with Wikipedia]]/[[shared:How to re-use Wikipedia content]] (Wikipedia is rather anal about quoting and sourcing). Basically I came up empty-handed in all cases. I even found [[Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:Reflist]] indicating that I'm not the only one with this "predicament". So my question is:<br />
 
How do I quote and reference it?
 
I'm inclined to just insert a statement such as:
 
:As the UK Foreign & Commonwealth Office put it in their [http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/travel-and-living-abroad/travel-advice-by-country/europe/slovakia travel advice for Slovakia]: "The standard of driving is not high and can be aggressive. Specifically, beware of oncoming cars overtaking on your side of the road (particularly on bends and hills)."
 
But I would rather do it in the right manner, in case I have missed something very obvious :). In kind regards, Henrik/[[User:Heb|Heb]] 04:01, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
 
::You could go the short quote route (under the fair dealing copyright provisions) providing a link to the source (that might quickly become outdated) but it might be better just to put that in your own words - especially if you've personal experience of driving in Slovakia. That would mean one less external link - [[Wikitravel:External_links|which we prefer]]. We normally don't reference material here and unless we're (rarely) using a direct quote, don't usually source either. Enjoy your new-found freedom and plunge forward Henrik!--[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 07:55, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
 
  
== SVG-files? ==
+
Just curious if this is the issue which led to postings about my businesses Izu Hike and Fuji Bike Tour being anonymously removed with no comments on the talk pages of any of the locations where I added the postings. I did customize the posts to be appropriate to the locations where I posted. I'm a sole proprietor who offers biking and hiking tours in numerous little towns in Izu and the Fuji Five Lakes areas. The pages for the Izu cities don't have any info on hiking tours so it made sense to me to provide info on the tours my business offers on each city's page. If I didn't do that, how would someone who visits one of those cities' pages know they could go for a guided hike? I think your readers will miss out on a lot of relevant info if postings can only be made on one general page for a country or region rather than on multiple specific location pages. People who want to hike in Matsuzaki or Ito or Shimoda are not going to go to a page on Japan looking for hiking info about those little towns. In any case, whatever you decide, it'd be nice to get the benefit of the doubt that a person with good intentions might be behind posts and provide info in the talk pages about why posts were deleted, if you're not already doing that consistently. I took the time to make several posts and all were deleted without any info in the talk pages about why. Not sure if that was you admin folks or someone else. Thanks for your attention to this question. [[User:Elforestero|Elforestero]] ([[User talk:Elforestero|talk]]) 20:59, 18 September 2018 (EDT)Elforestero
 +
: Hey [[User:Elforestero|Elforestero]]! Thanks for reaching out in the pub. Not sure what happened as I've only been on Wiktiravel for a few months but I think it depends. We get a lot of hiking and bike our listings to the point where it gets too much and starts to saturate the content. Because of that, we naturally just take it down as it starts to appear "ad-like" or "spammy". If there's something extremely unique about your tour of if there is no other tour listed, I think it'll be fine to post. But in addition to adhering to our [[Wikitravel:Don't tout#Don't list the same place many times|touting policy]], we do ask you to keep the posting to a minimum (i.e. posting it on select pages that make absolute sense) and write the post in an original way where it's not word for word from your other marketing materials that can also be found online. Hope this better answers your question [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 10:23, 19 September 2018 (EDT)
  
Okay, another question from newbie Dane, but please bare with me...<br />
+
== Map Based wikitravel ==
I wanted to update the S-train-map in the [[Copenhagen#Get_around|Get around]]-section of the [[Copenhagen]] travel guide. The one currently there is from 2009, and there has been two changes since then. Because I am slightly lazy, I thought of using the [http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:S-train_diagram_(dec_2011).svg map from Wikimedia Commons], which as far as I read [[shared:Tech:Enable InstantCommons]] should be fairly easy. Unfortunately the simple <nowiki>[[Image:S-train diagram (dec 2011).svg|thumb|420px|Map of S-trains and Metro in the Copenhagen area, with districts marked in the background]]</nowiki> didn't work - and neither did replacing Image: with File:. So I tried including a .png-file from Wikimedia Commons and that actually did work :)<br />
 
Then I did a [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Special%3ASearch&redirs=1&search=svg&fulltext=Search&ns6=1&redirs=1&title=Special%3ASearch&advanced=1&fulltext=Advanced+search search for .svg-files on Wikitravel] and there seems to be a lot of them. But none of them works. So I'm guessing there is an issue with SVG-files somewhere. I tried with SVG-files on Wikimedia Commons and there have no problems. What do I do? In kind regards, Henrik/[[User:Heb|Heb]] 04:28, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
 
  
:I'm afraid this is beyond my knowledge - but I can confirm it's a real problem - I had to substitute a png file for an svg file in [[Template:Busy|this template]], Henrik. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 17:16, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
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Hello!
  
::I will have tech look into this! Thank you, --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:30, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
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I wish to introduce a map based wikitravelish website impressionmap.org
  
:::OK -- we're seeing that they do in fact work (you have to click all the way through to the actual file, not the thumbnail), they just won't produce thumbnails.
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I'm an avid reader and planned all trips based on info here. A big thanks first! However, articles are organized by meaningless place names (it's the only choice though), and it's not straightforward to figure out which place is where. Thus, planning bigger trips involves going back and forth between here and Google Maps, taking a long time.
  
:::Can you tell me how you're uploading them, and where, step by step, i.e. 1) Go this page 2) Edit 3) Upload this file or reference this file 4) Error?--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:50, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
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It may be better to organize info by map itself and attach it to the map as snippets which will appear or disappear based on zoom level. More info and links can be added as popups. So I made the aforementioned website. You can zoom in to Amherst, MA or NYC (worse option as not much info is added) to see how it works. By the way, the website doesn't seem to work on IE and renders a bit ugly on browsers released before March 2017
  
::::Looks like this may be fixed; thumbnails should slowly repopulate as the cache rebuilds over time. Let me know if this is still not working as expected.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 20:16, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
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Asking for advice and opinions! If you would, edit it as well!
  
 +
Hopefully this is the right place to do such introduction. No bad intention, just wish to make travel info presentation more intuitive and trip planning easier
 +
[[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] ([[User talk:Wkenmomo|talk]]) 14:16, 1 June 2017 (EDT)
  
== Travel news ==
+
: Sorry for such a late response! We appreciate your time spent on Wikitravel -- especially for adding edits to the Liaocheng page. We hope to see more thoughtful edits like the ones you have provided. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 01:50, 06 June 2017 (PST)
Hello! I would like to call to action all the administrators and contributors on WT.
 
For a long time [[Travel news]] have been outdated. It is time to change it and keep the Travel Alerts and Current and upcoming events up-to-date. To achieve that, '''I need your help'''. Who is willing to offer his/her help? Thank you! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 15:54, 29 October 2012 (EDT)
 
:I think many of us are waiting for some straight answers [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Wikitravel:Travellers%27_pub&oldid=1954973#Clarification here] before we decide whether it's worth the effort in doing anything other than curating the articles that have already been written, Aleksandra. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 19:56, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
::It's a pity to hear that, Frank, because I really believe in Wikitravel and I would like to make the site as much updated as possible. I know that with '''yours''' and '''community''' support it will be easier and better. [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 20:27, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
==Edit war: [[Stay safe]] section in [[Stockholm]]==
+
:: Hey [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]]! I finally got a chance to check out the website you had created, and I think its pretty cool! I like that it sums up exactly where I may want to travel if I want to shop, or find out more about American history! I was wondering -- and you kind of explained already-- but your purpose for creating a map that works as so? How would this help benefit Wikitravel users? Thanks! --[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 012:39, 07 June 2017 (PST)
The [[stay safe]] section in [[Stockholm]] (and to some extent [[Sweden]]) is frequently subject to edit conflicts, many of them pushing the opinion that Stockholm would be a dangerous city. Can you give some advice how to solve this disagreement? Thanks in advance. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 09:45, 6 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
:Hello Blist! Thank you for notifying me. I checked it out and I saw that the user with the IP address 84.217.118.107 has made just one change in the [[stay safe]] section in [[Stockholm]]. However, I have already contacted him asking to avoid edit wars on [[Stockholm]] page and discuss all the changes he is planning to do on the [[Talk:Stockholm| discussion page]].
+
::: Hey [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]], sorry for the late reply. Why I create it is that I want a more direct way of accessing geo info. I used to read here, search on Google Map, write what it is about and save it in my maps to compare with others. A great hassle and Google maps aren't designed for this. My purpose is to make designing "optimized" trips easier and I really hope to plan my next trip to Canada intuitively and effortlessly. Do wikitravel need a dynamic map? Wikitravel is welcome to host this map and embed it to the right zoom and boundary. The map is itself editable.[[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] ([[User talk:Wkenmomo|talk]]) 13:45, 10 June 2017 (EDT)
:I am also watching this page so I will keep an eye on this issue. Cheers! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 13:04, 6 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
::The best solution is always to discuss the changes you both are making, using the Discussion page for that article. Sometimes it can be difficult to get an IP user to engage in this way. Try leaving a detailed note in the Edit Summary asking him/her to talk to you.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 14:43, 6 November 2012 (EST)
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::::[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]], [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] I think it would be a great idea to include links to Wikimapia. I'm working on US Hwy 2 between Monroe and Stephens Pass.  Here is an example of what you get for [[Skykomish_(Washington)]] [http://wikimapia.org/#lang=en&lat=47.710000&lon=-121.360000&z=13&m=b&search=Skykomish].  We could actually provide links to WikiTravel on the WikiMapia page.  Ideas? [[User:Kgrr|Kgrr]] ([[User talk:Kgrr|talk]]) 08:46, 9 July 2017 (EDT)
 +
::::Hello there, [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]], is there any way to zoom in/out the map and natively move around the places not having to type the place's name each time? --[[User:Fordaemdur|Fordaemdur]] ([[User talk:Fordaemdur|talk]]) 10:29, 21 August 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::Hey [[User:Fordaemdur|Fordaemdur]]! Just a heads up, the map I think you're referring was a suggestion and not an official project. I just checked the map though and I think you can zoom in and out by scrolling. I'm using a mouse to scroll in and out on a Windows desktop so not sure if it will work the same on a trackpad of a laptop. [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 10:28, 22 August 2018 (EDT)
  
::: POV-pushing continues, by first-time unregistered users. Can anything more be done? Please contribute to [[Talk:Stockholm]]. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 07:06, 26 November 2012 (EST)
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==Please make suggestions for WT homepage content==
 +
Hello! We'd like Wikitravel users to help us decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for February by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Monday January 29th. We will announce the winning topics Tuesday the 30th. Thank you![[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 14:11, 22 January 2018 (EST)
  
== Travel booking tool! ==
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:For Destination of the Month, what about [[Mexico]], since the largest underwater cave was discovered there very recently? Interesting location for sure! Mexican cuisine is also nice. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 09:42, 23 January 2018 (EST)
Soon, Wikitravellers will have the ability not only to browse and edit travel topics right here on the world's largest and best free travel wiki, but also to *book* travel from the very same page.  
 
  
Wikitravel has partnered with Orbitz to bring you a tool that will give you air and hotel booking options on each destination page in our travel guide. If you log in to your Wikitravel account, you will need to go to your *preferences* in order to turn on this booking tool -- you will not see it at all unless you turn it on.
+
::Maybe for "Off the Beaten Path" you could try Prachuap Khiri Khan in Thailand. This place is a paradise, and not at all expensive. Regrettably, more and more tourists are coming here, so go there before it becomes another Phuket or similar. [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 04:04, 24 January 2018 (EST)
  
We've worked with the Wikitravel community over the past 2 years to determine exactly what the look and feel of the tool ought to be; please let us know any feedback you have, and we'll make every effort to accommodate changes! Thank you, --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 14:34, 19 November 2012 (EST)
+
:::I second [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] idea of Mexico (and Mexican cuisine). Another option could be Venice (it's Carnival time). For OTBP you could try some small town/village around Europe (there are dozens of them). [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:27, 26 January 2018 (EST)
  
:I think this is a great idea for monetising the site!
+
::::Hey everyone, these are all great ideas! Still need suggestions for Language of the Month and Landmark of the Month. Shall I extend the voting until tomorrow the 31st?[[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 10:38, 30 January 2018 (EST)
:I also like the way that none of our registered editors will probably ever notice this. After all, you're not wrong when you continually point out that there are millions of visitors to this site who never bother to register and will automatically get a chance to make bookings.
 
:So as not to weaken the credibility of the ads, it's even more important to give more people effective janitor tools!
 
:However, I still think that you should clarify in writing the community established policies you have changed. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 15:05, 19 November 2012 (EST)
 
::I've switched on the display of Orbitz but still I never see it. What pages is it actually working on, please?
 
::Also, Wikitravel has been slow to the point of being unusable today from this Pacific Rim country - the competing Wikimedia site loads more than 100 times faster on identical pages like [[North Korea]]. More than 20 times in succession I get the "Sorry! We could not process your edit due to a loss of session data" message. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 04:07, 22 November 2012 (EST)
 
:::Did I miss an important announcement? I still don't see the display of Orbitz travel information but now the option to switch it on has disappeared completely from my preferences. What gives? --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 02:54, 30 November 2012 (EST)
 
::::At this time, the tool is only available if you are not logged in. We will restore functionality to those who wish to use it while logged in soon.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] 14:07, 30 November 2012 (EST)
 
Thanks for your prompt response.
 
  
I assume you are still having technical problems since I have just seen the Orbitz tool appear for the first time '''while logged in''' and with my preferences flag '''not''' set to "Show Orbitz Search", as this screenshot clearly shows if you click on it to enlarge: [[Image:WikitravelScreenshot20121201Orbitz-Displays-while-logged-in.png|150px|Screenshot a few moments after IBobi's assertion]] Please feel free to email me if you need help.
+
::::: I always vote for Mexican cuisine. For language, I would probably throw in Swahili. [[User:IBJoel|IBJoel]] ([[User talk:IBJoel|talk]])[[User:IBJoel|IBJoel]] ([[User talk:IBJoel|talk]]) 11:08, 30 January 2018 (EST)
  
With [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Wikitravel:Travellers%27_pub&curid=76403&diff=1961629&oldid=1961571 this edit] you removed another user's comments. Unless there are exceptional reasons, this is frowned upon, so I assume the excision was accidental, yes? --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 15:10, 30 November 2012 (EST)
+
::::::For Landmark of the month maybe we can do Mỹ Sơn in Vietnam, they're ruins of old Hindu Temples. [[User:IBThomas|IBThomas]] ([[User talk:IBThomas|talk]]) 12:31, 30 January 2018 (EST)
  
:Alice- you have to go to your web browser's options and '''clear cache''' . Then the Orbitz Widget will not show again. I hope it helps. [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 15:27, 30 November 2012 (EST)
+
:::::::Hi everyone! Thank you for your wonderful suggestions this past week. Here are the winners for the home page content for February. Destination of the Month: Mexico, Off the Beaten Path: Prachuap Khiri Khan, Cuisine of the Month: Mexican, Language of the Month: Swahili, and Landmark of the Month: Mỹ Sơn. (Boy was Mexico popular!). We hope to make this a regular thing for the monthly home page content. An announcement will be made here on the Pub during the last week of the month asking for user's ideas on what the Wikitravel home page should feature. Thanks again to those who participated![[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 11:39, 31 January 2018 (EST)
  
==[[Southwest (United States of America)]]==
+
::::::::Great choices! Probably too late now, but since the Winter Olympics are taking place in [[Pyeongchang]] from Feb 9-25, maybe we should highlight this location too this month? Only just realised that this is happening this month. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 07:53, 2 February 2018 (EST)
What happened to this page? Its text is now on [[Southwest United States]] but that page doesn't contain the history. <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 22:00, 31 October 2012 (EDT)
 
:Bizarre! You might want to check the logs. (IBadmins have recently promoted - without any community discussion or warning - a number of admins that, unlike yourself, have a very limited understanding of the policies and procedures of the English Wikitravel. Equally it might be some new spammer trickery.) --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 00:57, 1 November 2012 (EDT)
 
::Fixed; no biggie. Just re-saved from earlier edit. Happens with MW database on occasion.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 04:58, 1 November 2012 (EDT)
 
:::Thanks for your very rapid response.
 
:::I have deleted the contents & re-directed: [[Southwest (United States of America)]] since it's a breach of our Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike licence to duplicate a page without duplicating the attribution history.
 
:::I'm still baffled as to how (on the face of it) an IP editor managed to duplicate an article and then delete the original (and its edit history) and all without leaving a trace in the logs. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 00:36, 4 November 2012 (EDT)
 
  
::::Without doing extensive research, I'm not sure that's how it went down. Looked to me like a DB error that was easily corrected. At any rate, after verifying that the "new" page redirects also redirected to the "old" page, I went ahead and deleted the "new" page, as it consisted of nothing more than dupe content, which is confusing. We don't want people contributing on one location and not the other, which is just what would happen.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 15:52, 5 November 2012 (EST)
+
== Bangkok Hotels ==
  
===Database error===
+
I just checked the "Bangkok" section of Wikitravel, and I saw in the "Hotels" section, a number of hotel listings.
What is this database error? There are many pages missing including [[Ocean City]], [[Sydney/Bondi Beach]], [[Afrikaans phrasebook]]. <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 18:27, 5 November 2012 (EST)
+
Mainly upmarket ones.
:We're looking into what causes this. Obviously we do not want to wait until a knowledgeable editor like yourself discovers pages that are unusable. Did you find these by browsing to them or by some other method?--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:39, 5 November 2012 (EST)
+
I believe that these should have been placed in individual District articles,
 +
Also, they're somewhat touty.
 +
Should I remove them?  
 +
[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 03:55, 24 January 2018 (EST)
  
==[[Wikitravel:Geocoding]] is also broken==
+
:Hello [[User:Avemario|Avemario]], you are correct, those listings should be moved to the respective district articles. If you feel a listing is pure advertising you can remove it, otherwise maybe adjust it a little if it is a good location to have mentioned. Just make sure you specify in the summary field of your edit what you are doing. Thanks as always! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 04:46, 25 January 2018 (EST)
The article above states: "''It's possible to encode information about the latitude and longitude of a destination into the destination guide itself. This information will then be used to make special HTML tags to show that the page is related to those lat/long coordinates;"..."A "Map" link will also be added to the "Toolbox" in the left pane, which will take users to a Google, Yahoo, or Microsoft map of the location.''"
 
  
I've added the relevant template to our [[Nelson (New Zealand)]] article but the "Map" link was '''not''' added to the "Toolbox" in the left pane! --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 20:37, 6 November 2012 (EST)
+
::OK, will do. Just give me a couple of days as it is a holiday weekend here. [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 01:32, 26 January 2018 (EST)
  
:Hmm. Research shows that there have been problems with this template interfering with formatting. And not being terribly useful besides. We'll have to look into this one. Do you see an example where it is working?--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 13:35, 7 November 2012 (EST)
+
:::OK, all sorted now. [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 02:20, 29 January 2018 (EST)
 +
::::Thank you! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 07:33, 4 February 2018 (EST)
  
::I can't find any page where it is '''not''' currently broken - sorry.
+
==Home Page Content Voting for March 2018==
 +
Hi All! We'd like Wikitravel users to help us decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for March by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Wednesday, February 28th. We will announce the winning topics on the Pub Thursday, March 1st. Thank you![[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 11:35, 20 February 2018 (EST)
  
::It's not terribly useful to save the few keystrokes needed to key "Nelson, New Zealand" into the on-line mapping provider of your choice but
+
:Destination of the Month could be [[Florence]], early spring is one of the best moments to visit the city (and [[Previous_Destinations_of_the_month|as far as I can see]] it has never been chosen before). Off the Beaten Path: [[Ronda]] in Spain. We could choose Cuisine and Language of a specific region: after all many of our phrasebook pages have sections about ordering food and drink. What do you think?  [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 06:07, 23 February 2018 (EST)
:#it would enhance the advertising click revenue of Internet Brands to have our relevant article page (with advertising by default) show up on users geocode-enabled smartphones according to their GPS location
 
:#it's '''''very''''' useful to find out of the way places (often in third world countries) where names are often incompletely found or differently spelt on maps. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 17:01, 7 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
==ISBN book references are also broken==
+
::I just got a message from someone about an Indonesian food delivery where I live, just looking at the pictures makes me hungry, for Cuisine I would suggest Indonesian! Off the Beaten Path [[Papua New Guinea]]? Destination of the Month I like Giulio´s suggestion [[Florence]]. Landmark of the Month the Abbey at [[Mont Saint Michel]]? Such a special place. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 10:10, 23 February 2018 (EST)
As can be seen if you click on any of the ISBN numbers (in blue) in this section: http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Philippines&oldid=1951302#Books
 
  
You are taken to the special page but, although the search box is correctly pre-populated the "Go" search button no longer works. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 16:26, 7 November 2012 (EST)
+
:::Indonesian cuisine! Good suggestion! [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:36, 24 February 2018 (EST)
  
:Hmm. I'll queue it; no guarantees on timing as this is the first I've seen of this functionality.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:00, 7 November 2012 (EST)
+
::::Landmark of the Month: the Botanical Garden in [[Padua]]. It's the oldest in the world, established in 1545, recently renovated and (sadly) often overlooked. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 11:45, 26 February 2018 (EST)
  
::Appears to be working as designed. It's generating the AMAZON and B&N, etc. links at the bottom of the page. The input box is just to refresh the page and generate those links. Let me know if you have info to the contrary.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:12, 7 November 2012 (EST)
+
::::I second the call for Indonesian cuisine! Or Pakistani, alternatively. [[User:IBJoel|IBJoel]] ([[User talk:IBJoel|talk]]) [[Special:Contributions/98.158.206.112|98.158.206.112]] 11:43, 1 March 2018 (EST)
  
==Clarification==
+
:::::Need a tie breaker for OTBP and Landmark please![[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 15:53, 1 March 2018 (EST)
Because of the recent [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk:Pratyeka&diff=prev&oldid=1949763 misunderstanding] of our policies by a long-standing Wikipedia admin, I have clarified and re-emphasised [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Wikitravel%3AExternal_links&action=historysubmit&diff=1950083&oldid=1896765 our specific policies on linking to (or promoting) other travel sites that use wiki editing software here]. I doubt that many will read it in advance, but at least the clarified policy is now there to be quoted in explanation after a redaction or deletion. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 00:36, 4 November 2012 (EDT)
 
  
'''UPDATE''': My clarifications have now been deleted (twice).
+
::::::Thank you all for the wonderful suggestions! Here are the winners: Destination of the Month, Florence, Off the Beaten Path, Ronda in Spain, Cuisine of the Month, Javanese/Indonesian, Language of the Month, Indonesian, and Landmark of the Month, Abbey at Mont Saint Michel. Agreed with OTBP and Landmark options? Ran out of time so I chose these. Thank you again for posting, be ready for wonderful suggestions for the April home page![[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 17:41, 1 March 2018 (EST)
  
So we are now back to the hypocrytical situation of having one policy actively enforced and promulgated (at least by some IBadmins) without ever having that policy enunciated on any policy page that I am aware of. I think I'll change my user name to ''George Orwell''. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 18:48, 5 November 2012 (EST)
+
==April 2018 suggestions for WT Homepage content!==
 +
A little bit to the game to this but each month the content of our homepage changes. We'd like Wikitravel users to help decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for April by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Wednesday, April 4th. We will announce the winning topics on the Pub Thursday, April 5th. Thank you!
 +
:Botswana! [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 17:02, 3 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::Ooh! That can be an interesting one. Anyone else have suggestions for Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month?
  
:1. WT editors are not to make changes to policies unilaterally. That is why the changes were reverted (at the request of another non-IB editor). 2. The policy in question doesn't really need a change. It's being interpreted internally in a way that it hasn't been interpreted before, due to a situation that has not arisen before. And it's almost entirely in the past. Thus there is no reason to amend policy, both because as it stands it is being applied consistently, and because the situation requiring that interpretation was unique and has now passed. It's time to move forward.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 19:06, 5 November 2012 (EST)
+
:::What about Greek cuisine for the Cuisine topic? Off the Beaten Path a nice hidden place in [[Greece]] as well, like [[Zakynthos]]. Why not Greek as the Language of the Month then, and the Corinth Canal as the Landmark of the Month? Keeping it all in one country, long time since I have been there but a lovely country to visit! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 04:50, 4 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::::Botswana would be great! Also choosing a greek island for OTBP: Zakynthos is good but we may choose some other island ([[Ithaca (Greece)|Ithaca]]?) [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 11:12, 4 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::::::Wow! Great suggestions, Adzas and GiulioC! I think having those spots from Greece as OTBP, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month are all lovely idea as some people may not have heard of them or never been... like me! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 11:52, 4 April 2018 (EDT)IB_hill
 +
:::: I was thinking a city in Japan though, like [[Nara]] (with the nice cherry season), but Botswana is a great pick too! Keeping it all in one country sounds like a very good idea. I like it. Greek cuisine for the Cuisine topic, Greek as the Language of the Month, Off the Beaten Path a nice hidden place in [[Greece]]. Good idea! I'm for it.     --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 04:01, 5 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::I´ve seen pictures of these cherry blossoms in Japan, beautiful! Which months can that usually be seen, we can still use [[Nara]] next time? Beautiful! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 06:01, 7 April 2018 (EDT)
  
::1) I don't think you can have it both ways. Either you genuinely do not think '''We do not allow (and will attempt to strenuously police and expunge) external links to, or promotion of, ''travel'' websites that are not primary sources - this policy ''includes other wikis'', whether Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 licensed or not''' has been our policy for a long time or <s>I'm a Dutchman</s> the policy in question has always existed and doesn't really need a change. Instead it's being interpreted internally in a way that it hasn't been interpreted before, due to a situation that has not arisen before. That interpretation needs to be made explicit and prominent to avoid edit wars.
+
==Wikitravel Software Update Coming Next Week==
::2) I do think it completely Orwellian and counter productive not to explicitly warn people that they should not include links to or use the ''naughty names'' of other travel wikis in text - particularly those that have recently started operating from Wikimedia servers. Since I am not an admin I really do need an explicit policy to link to in a terse but precise and authoritative way when I excise ''naughty names or links'' if the (often ''bona fide'' but ignorant-of-our-policy-that-can-not-speak-its-name) editor is not to be left puzzled, frustrated and annoyed by my (to him, incomprehensible) edits. An example of this is where an article discussion section dating back to July 2006 was removed to the [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk%3AIBAlex&action=historysubmit&diff=1951308&oldid=1950874 genuine puzzlement of an IP contributor]. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 16:51, 7 November 2012 (EST)
+
Hello all Wikitravellers!
 +
This is one of your admins on Wikitravel. Just sending an update that our site will be expecting a upgrade sometime next week. Should anyone come across any issues, please e-mail admin@wikitravel(dot)org or message me on my talk page. [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 20:21, 6 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
On a related but different topic, I really find it objectionable that no official announcements are being made about new admin appointments.
+
== Vandalism on WT today ==
  
It is bad enough that folks are [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk%3AIBMaarten&action=historysubmit&diff=1954335&oldid=1954333 arbitrarily being made an admin on the English language version of Wikitravel, without the usual experience+nomination+discussion process but secret appointments] are really not my idea of "moving on".
+
If you happen to see a strange looking page on WT today, please let us know. Don't be alarmed, it's just a vandal. Our Legal team are in the process of tracing the related IPs and will be alerting local law enforcement immediately. Thank you, [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 15:22, 10 April 2018 (EDT)
  
If this character is '''not''' an admin, I really deprecate that this [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Special%3AActiveUsers&limit=50&username=IB naming loophole] has not been plugged weeks ago as I suggested! --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 16:11, 15 November 2012 (EST)
+
==WT Software Upgrade Happening Now!==
 +
Hi everyone! Heads up that as of Wednesday, April 11th at 12:05pm PST, the site will be down and ready for upgrade! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 15:05, 11 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
:Unfortunately there's no way I know of to prevent that yet. But since we watch all new user creation, we'll catch it if it happens. Sometimes users are appointed internally as admins. No biggie. I was such a user, and look how great I've turned out :) --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 16:21, 15 November 2012 (EST)
+
:Hi, IB hill,
 +
:Due to the software upgrade this time, we have some bugs on ja:WT. We can't display some of our pages correctly, with a internal error message instead. Here is an example:
  
::Has [[User_talk:IBMaarten|IBMaarten]] arbitrarily been made an admin, on the English language version of Wikitravel, without the usual experience + nomination + discussion process but as a secret appointment?? Yes or No, please. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 16:35, 15 November 2012 (EST)
+
[[email protected]] /ja/%E7%A5%AD%E3%82%84%E3%82%A4%E3%83%99%E3%83%B3%E3%83%88/4%E6%9C%88 Error from line 158 of /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/extensions/Breadcrumb.php: Call to undefined method User::getSkin()
  
:::I thought I explained it? And the edit that made him an admin was clear: he's administering the Dutch site, and also working on EN. There's nothing secret, Frank. Rejoice: and welcome the new admin!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 16:50, 15 November 2012 (EST)
+
  Backtrace:
::::No, we have still not had any announcement from you, any other IBadmin or a properly appointed admin, never mind on the proper pages and you have still not answered with a "Yes".
 
::::Neither was his admin status on the English language version of Wikitravel showing at: http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Special%3AActiveUsers&limit=50&username=IB at the time I posed the question above and at the time I make this edit.(I've taken a screenshot which I can post if you doubt my veracity).
 
:::::We're not mind readers, you know and you really are abusing all of our policies and processes now. As for there being nothing secret, that really is a lie as Alice makes clear above.
 
:::::Would you now make clear (with a properly formatted diff) what exactly was "the edit that made him an admin", please?
 
:::::And for the avoidance of doubt, I personally have no objection in principle to admins from other language versions being rapidly promoted to admin status on the EN Wikitravel. But there should be a clear announcement on the proper page(s) each time this happens and you urgently need to revise all those policy pages that you currently keep flouting. To do anything less is to destroy any chance of re-building the community that has been decimated by your autocratic and thoroughly whimsical decisions, never mind poisoning the wholehearted welcome that would otherwise be given to new (and sorely needed) wielders of the mop. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 18:30, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
::::::I believe you can view [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Special%3ALog&type=rights&user=&page=&year=&month=-1&tagfilter=&hide_patrol_log=1 this page?] Sorry you're unhappy Frank. We're promoting anyone who gets the required community support in the required time period, and shows the best qualities to help the community move forward. Thank you, --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:46, 15 November 2012 (EST)
+
#0 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/extensions/Breadcrumb.php(64): BreadcrumbLinks(array, Title)
 +
#1 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/includes/Setup.php(855): setupBreadcrumb()
 +
#2 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/includes/WebStart.php(114): require_once(string)
 +
#3 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/index.php(55): require(string)
 +
#4 {main}
  
:::::::That User rights log is not a page that can be added to anyone's watchlist and neither do I know of a way to find out what pages internally link to it. Do you seriously expect editors to load that page every few hours to find out what admin has been appointed on the English language version of Wikitravel most recently?
+
:This error seems to happen all the sub pages which contains slash mark ("/") on the title (Such as "[[Tokyo/Chiyoda]]")
:::::::I note that you have still not dealt with the most pressing point: '''Explicit Clarification in writing''', on the English language version of Wikitravel, in the obvious places of the new policies and, if they are of only a temporary nature, their expected date of expiry. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 18:59, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
==Is "formatting according to our [[MoS]]" edit warring?==
+
:In addition, I couldn't write on your talk page, because it is totally protected (That's why I wrote my message here) [[User:Shoestring|Shoestring]] ([[User talk:Shoestring|talk]]) 08:14, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
Perhaps appropriately, given its subject matter, [[Wikitravel talk:Edit war|this policy page]] has been constructed by individual editors plunging forward and writing stuff that seemed blindingly obvious to them.
+
::Hey Shoestring!
 +
::Thanks for bringing this to our attention! I'm sending a report for you right now. Apologies that you couldn't talk on my talk page (you should be able to now). Will be moving our messages over there. Please keep me posted with any other issues. I plan to check on the Japan page today to see if I come across anything and will talk to you there. Thanks again! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 13:20, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::Oh and also if you can let me know what device and browser you're using. That'll be much appreciated! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 13:25, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::: It should be working now! Please let me know if there's anything else JA WT needs. Thanks for letting us know! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 18:23, 12 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
Rather refreshingly, a brand new IBadmin [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk%3ASingapore.Alice&action=historysubmit&diff=1956425&oldid=1956420 has queried] whether making persistent changes to article formatting is "''something that needs to be '''discussed first within the community'''. I'm referring to this [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Wikitravel%3AEdit_war&action=historysubmit&diff=1956416&oldid=1516343] change.''"
+
== Traveller of the Month ==
  
Does anybody else think that (for example) when more knowledgeable editors continuously and relentlessly change formatting that does not conform to our [[Manual of Style]] (without good reason) - such as changing "150 Pesos" to the more correct "₱150" - this is edit warring?
+
I do note that the Traveller of the Month page is defective.
 +
I did try to post this on the edit page there, but it will not allow me.
 +
Although it is an old page, maybe you can either correct it or delete it.
 +
Obviously I would prefer the former, as I use it to prove to people that it is a totally credible website.
 +
Your call..................
  
Who else thinks that in cases of controversy, the style manual should '''not''' trump? --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 15:05, 19 November 2012 (EST)
+
[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 04:02, 14 April 2018 (EDT)
  
:Edit warring is edit warring, regardless of whether one of the parties is "right" and the other party is "wrong".
+
I might add that the Thai Phrasebook has a similar problem!
  
:If two people are changing the article formatting back and forth, the correct thing to do is to follow the procedure discussed in [[Wikitravel:Edit war]].  [[User:JYolkowski|JYolkowski]] 22:11, 21 November 2012 (EST)
+
[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 08:08, 16 April 2018 (EDT)
::Replied to you at [[Wikitravel_talk:Edit_war]] since I'm rather baffled by your imputed suggestion that we should scrap at least one of our five [[Wikitravel:Policies_and_guidelines#General_policy| foundation policies]] that: "Text and images should follow style guidelines. With rare exception, text and images should follow our Manual of style. Exceptions should gain wide consensus; in cases of controversy, the style manual trumps."  --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 22:47, 21 November 2012 (EST)
 
::The quote you included contains the words "With rare exception."  That's why you need to discuss with the other party instead of edit warring with them to see whether it makes sense for this to be such an exception.  Cheers, [[User:JYolkowski|JYolkowski]] 19:06, 23 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
==[[Wikitravel:Requested articles]]==
+
:Hi Avemario, thanks for letting us know! The [[Traveller of the Month September 2015 - Avemario]] page can only be edited by admin, the page is protected. Is there anything you wanted to have changed? The [[Thai phrasebook]] seems ok to me, I can edit it, can you get in at all or just not save your edit? [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 11:02, 16 April 2018 (EDT)
I boldly started [[Wikitravel:Requested articles]] for listing links to articles that would be useful, but do not yet exist. Would it be useful for the development of Wikitravel? /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 13:14, 22 November 2012 (EST)
+
:: Hey [[User:Avemario|Avemario]]! Wanted to introduce myself as one of the newer admins and jump in to this thread. Seems like [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] beat me to answering your questions! Please let us know what you would like to correct or change for your [[Traveller of the Month September 2015 - Avemario]] page. I can also correct the [[Thai phrasebook]] as well. We also had a software upgrade last week and have been running QA. However, there may still be little bugs that pop out. If you notice anything, please feel free to reach out and let us know the issue + browser & operating system you're using! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 12:00, 16 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
:Why not? --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 14:27, 22 November 2012 (EST)
+
:::Hillary, the banner on the Traveller of the month page is extending at the bottom to cover the text. Also, it is time we re-started the Traveller of the Month back up again -- and maybe rename it Wikitraveller of the month? [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 20:04, 16 April 2018 (EDT)
  
=="add listing" defect==
+
::::Hi!
[http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Wikitravel:Accommodation_listings&diff=next&oldid=1251767#Listing_order For a long while] we have had a policy of [[listing]]s being [[alphabet]]ically ordered unless there is a good reason not to.
+
::::Thanx for your answers, both Adzas (who I know already), and IB hill.
  
Unfortunately this is consistently and automatically buggered by the "add listing" option that appears in blue to the right of our standard section headings of "See", "Do", "Buy", "Eat", "Drink" and "Sleep" that always adds the new listing to the bottom of that particular section.
+
::::I am using Firefox on a laptop computer.
  
Is it time to change the listing order policy or recode the robot so that it understands alphabetic order? --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 16:34, 24 November 2012 (EST)
+
::::The problem is that, with the "Traveller of the Month", the discussion start is up under the pic!
 +
::::What I can read starts with "our gratitude by featuring them........"
  
==[[Colombia]]n pesos==
+
::::With the Thai Phrasebook, everything can be read, but the writing is scrunched up against the pic.
There are many countries around the world that use the name "dollar" and the symbol "$" for their currency. Our [[$|usual policy]] is that<br />
 
''Prices should be listed with the currency symbol that travellers will encounter, specifically the local formatting. The currency symbol should always be prefixed. Travellers should be able to assume that symbols used for multiple currencies (like $ or £) apply to the local currency. Do ''not'' use currency codes like "USD", "EUR", or "GBP" if the symbol is established.
 
  
* $100 in [[Detroit]], not US$100, 100 USD or 100 dollars
+
::::I have checked a few other Thai Province websites, but they are normal.
* $100 in [[Vancouver]], not CAD$100, 100 CAD or 100 dollars
 
* $100 in [[Wellington]], not NZD$100, 100 NZD or 100 dollars
 
* $100 in [[Canberra]], not AUD$100, 100 AUD or 100 dollars''<br />
 
  
and I propose no change in respect of this.
+
::::So I leave it up to you to sort this out.
  
However, the currency of Colombia poses special dangers of inconsistency and confusion as exemplified in our [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Cartagena_%28Colombia%29&action=historysubmit&diff=1959307&oldid=1957758 Cartagena (Colombia)] article.
+
::::[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 06:28, 17 April 2018 (EDT)
  
Colombia is unusual in having an officially recognised currency symbol of "$" that (unlike Singapore, etc) is '''not''' actually used on their banknotes - where, instead, "pesos" is printed. Since prices in the tourist industry in Colombia are also often quoted in US$, <u>I propose that we use "'''pesos'''" instead of either the $ symbol or COP for Colombia currency.</u>
+
::::: Hey AveMario! Gotcha. I submitted a report for you just now and hopefully we will get that fixed for you quickly! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 11:58, 17 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
This is somewhat analogous to the "Baht or ฿" situation adjudicated at [[Wikitravel_talk:Currency]] but differs in that I propose using the plural "'''pesos'''" rather than "peso" since
+
==Pages Currently Under Evaluation==
#the peso is so minute as to be almost never encountered in the singular
+
Heads up that as of 4/18/18, we're currently putting pages about Khlong Lat Mayom Floating Market, Wat Chan, and Dusun Glondok under evaluation as we're working on determining if it adheres to the site's [[Wikitravel:policies and guidelines|policies and guidelines]] and [[Wikitravel:Manual of style|style]]. If anyone has any thoughts or know anything about these sights and destinations, please reply down below here. Would love to make this a collaborative effort on Wikitravel! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 19:27, 18 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
#that is the word (in Spanish) that appears on Colombian Banknotes: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colombian_peso
 
  
Does anyone disagree with my proposal?  
+
:Hi! The first two of these three appear to be Thai, but I cannot find them on Wikitravel! The third is in Indonesia and I can find it. Can you please give me more info about these above two? If they are Thai, I should be able to resolve it.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 03:48, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
  
Discuss at [[Wikitravel_talk:Currency#Colombian_pesos]] rather than here, please! --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 15:21, 26 November 2012 (EST)
+
::I can´t find the first two mentioned articles, but my first thought would be that a market should not have its own article. It can be described in the article of where it is located. Dusun Glondok I can´t find much information about online, it seems to be a little village? The writer of the article should specify where exactly it is and if there are any tourist attractions so more information can be added or rewritten. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 09:48, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::update - I found the floating market info, on [[User:TAMONWAN|Tamonwan user page]]. I removed the first paragraph as this was copied from another website and I removed the [[Wikitravel:External links|external links]] for now. For the rest I would move the original info to a location article and then remove it from the user page. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 09:57, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::: Hello hello! I realized I left my computer without adding the pages. The Thai content about Khlong Lat Mayom Floating Market and Wat Chan are posted on [[User:TAMONWAN|Tamonwan user page]] and on [[User:Jeechnps|Jeechnps user page]]. I'm curious to know what you guys think about the content and how we could better blend the info with the site. Seems like you're a Thai expert, Avemario! If you get the chance, maybe you can check it out? [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 11:55, 19 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
:Nobody has raised any objections so I will now make the necessary policy change. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 18:44, 30 November 2012 (EST)
+
::::OK............
  
 +
::::The Floating Market is in Thonburi in Bangkok,and is already listed there. I have updated the opening hours, but (personally) I do not ::::think that we need all the info that the Tamonwan page provides.
 +
::::After all, do we need a travel website, or a multi page book for each destination?
 +
::::I think that too much info on a place tends to be a distraction from the rest of the area. As it is, if someone wants to go there, if they ::::are in a hotel nearby, or go to a Travel Agent, they will get all the detailed stuff and can make their choice.
  
== Las Vegas ==
+
::::We do not need Wikitravel "overcrowded".
  
First of all, I want to apologize if this is the wrong place to post this, but right now I am so frustrated that my head is spinning.
+
::::And the same with Wat Chan,which is a Buddhist Temple (Wat) in Ban Chan (Chan Town)
  
When I was originally planning our family vacation to Las Vegas I used the WikiTravel website as a source of research for shows, attractions and places to stay. As a first time visitor to Las Vegas, the website seemed to be a prime resource providing a lot of useful information.  
+
::::This is in Chiang Mai Province, some 150Km North West towards Pai (which is on Wikitravel).
 +
::::Chiang Mai has many attractions, and we need again to be careful we do not make the attraction into a book!
 +
::::It seems from what I can read online that this place has only one decent hotel, run by Karen (Christian refugees from Myanmar, so it is an ::::out of the way place to get involved in this culture. There is transport to here from Chiang Mai in yellow songteows apparently (2 bench ::::pickup trucks).
 +
::::It seems that there are also minibuses from both Chiang Mai, and Pai.  
  
We have since returned to Las Vegas several times and I absolutely love this destination and am planning to return many more times.
+
::::I would be inclined to only put a short article on the Chiang Mai website, just describing what it is, that there is a hotel, and how to ::::get there.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 06:41, 20 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::Hey Avemario! Appreciate you taking the time to have a deeper look and thanks for adding the floating market in Thonburi on the [[Bangkok/Thonburi]] page. And completely agree with your suggestions. I'll have a look on their pages again and see what I can do. Thanks! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 12:04, 20 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
In anticipation of my return to Sin City in a few months I was going through my Vegas bookmarks and I noticed the Wikitravel entry. I remembered reading a few of the entertainment/shows entries and I realized that a few things didn't jive with what I had experienced in real life.  
+
::::::Above is very helpful, great as always Avemario! I do think it is important to find out why those users are adding all this info on their user pages. As mentioned, we have had school projects before, we used to let them work on their user pages as long as all that info is moved or removed in a short period of time, either to an existing article or a new article. If the users in question don´t communicate with us and the info is not according to our guidelines (either an article already exists or the info does not justify an article etc) we should move/remove it as soon as possible. As the Travellers Pub still does not seem to appear in Recent Changes, new users may not see our discussion, so we should check on their talk pages (the messages I left so far no reaction yet as far as I can see). Great though, I´ve learnt a lot about those locations in the past days, that´s what it is all about I think. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 06:34, 21 April 2018 (EDT)
  
When I went back to the website to confirm my suspicions - Sure enough, there they were!
+
== Nong Prue ==
Numerous inaccuries, for example:
 
  
Blue Man Group at the Venetian (they have since moved their show to the Monte Carlo)
+
I have noticed an article about this place in Kanchanaburi Province in Thailand. The information is minimal, and a VERY thorough check of the internet shows virtually no information at all worthy of tourists.Personally, I would delete the article.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 06:53, 21 April 2018 (EDT)
Bette Midler at Caesars Palace (her residency ended Jan. 2010)
 
Lance Burton at the Monte Carlo (his residency ended in Sept. 2010)
 
Fab Four Live at the V Theater in Planet Hollywood (the correct title of the show is Beatleshow!)
 
Viva Elvis at the Aria (closed in August)
 
Human Nature at the Imperial Palace (ended their residency in November, and the Imperial Palace is now know as the Quad)
 
  
nowhere did it mention the residencies of:
+
:And I just had a really serious look at it,and found virtually nothing at all on the internet, other that there is also a Nong Prue in Pattaya. :I still think it needs deleting - there is little info justifying moving it to the Kanchanaburi page.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User :talk:Avemario|talk]]) 07:59, 22 April 2018 (EDT)
Elton at Caesars Palace (his residency has since ended but was current at the time)
 
Shania Twain at Caesars Palace
 
Celine Dion at Caesars Palace
 
Rod Stewart at Caesars Palace
 
Tim McGraw and Faith Hill at the Venetian
 
these are the most glaring ommissions
 
  
in addition:
+
::And as much as I hate being the pain in the arse which I am - I just noticed an article on Jom Jang, which is in Nong Khai Province in ::Thailand.There is virtually no info in this article, which was added many years ago, and it is only a few Km from Nong Khai City.I think it ::should be deleted, and the info moved to the Nong Khai page.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 06:18, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
  
Comedy Shows had only 2 listings (2 listings?!?!? I couldn't believe this! Carrot Top and Sin City Comedy (the venue has since changed) are the only 2 comedy shows in ALL of Las Vegas???)
+
:::And yet again......................... Ban Rong in Lamphang Province has absolutely no info about the place. So why not remove it [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 07:04, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
not listed were: Brad Garrett's Comedy Club, Louie Anderson, George Wallace, Big Al's Comedy Club, The Improv at Harrah's, Wolf's Comedy Den, Riviera Comedy Club etc. etc.
 
  
Tribute Shows did not list:
+
::::Once more................ Ban Muang Kut is a place put in by advertisers who want to promote the place. Not wanted on Wikitravel.
Frank Marino's Divas Las Vegas, MJ Live, Legends in Concert, Purple Reign: A Tribute to Prince, Dancing Queen, The Australian Bee Gees, Trent Carlini's the King, The Rat Pack is Back (there are currently over 4 Frank Sinatra and/or Rat Pack shows playing) etc. etc.
+
::::The trip should be a place to go on the Chiang Mai page. [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 07:04, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
  
Magic Shows did not list:
+
:::::Hey Avemario! Thanks for bringing this up- truly appreciate your Thai knowledge! I will have a look over it and see if there's a place for all the articles you just mentioned. If anyone else has any suggestions, please post it here![[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 12:13, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Jan Rouven, Mike Hammer, Nathan Burton, Seth Grabel, The Amazing Jonathon etc. etc.
 
  
Impressionist/impersonation shows did not list:
+
::::::We always say that any location that can be visited by a traveller, no matter how remote, can be listed here. [[Jom Jang]] for example, maybe a small place but the article does have some content, for the off the beaten path traveller maybe worth to visit after reading the little information that we have there. It is even mentioned in the [[Nong Khai]] article. I would leave this for sure. Ban Rong I can´t find an article for. Completely empty articles I would remove yes, but other places maybe we can promote on the Main Page, ask for help so editors who know the location can add info. The smallest unknown places can be the most beautiful or interesting places to explore. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 10:04, 24 April 2018 (EDT)
Gordie Brown and veteran impersonator Rich Little!
 
  
You get the picture! The number of ommissions and innaccuracies was-and-is mind-boggling!  
+
:::::::Hi Adzas!
Considering that Wikitravel's Main Page proclaims that it is a "complete, up-to-date and reliable worldwide travel guide" this is unfathomable!
+
:::::::Thanx for your feedback!
  
At this point I decided to take it upon myself and sign up as a Wikitravel editor with the intention of becoming a "Las Vegas entertainment editor" of sorts and doing a thorough update of the "See" section (that's kind of funny actually).
+
:::::::But I still stick by with what I have written.  I have never heard of any of these places I posted until I did a detailed search (and I know that I can find many more similar ones - I just did not want to overload!)And as you are aware, I know Thailand thoroughly, having visited virtually every Province! (and still do to keep things up to date)
  
Anyway ...  
+
:::::::If I (or most other persons want to see what is in Thailand, we visit the Provincial City page - after all, the Capital of the Province has the same name as the Province. And we read the "do" or other pages.  
  
I spent over a week researching and documenting the current shows as well as the concerts and special events (I'll get to this in a moment) ... and this is no mean feat ...
+
:::::::If the destination is "big" as Hua Hin is in Prachuap Khiri Khan Province, and Koh Samui in Surat Thani Province, then of course they need a separate article.
To verify information required me to consult the venue's website, the performer's website, the authorized ticket agent's website and in some cases some entertainment revue sites. (I subscribe to dozens of Las Vegas tourism and entertainment guides and websites.)
 
  
Once I had compiled all the information, I went about adding the new entries to the appropriate categories and correcting any inaccuracies.  
+
:::::::But these small places need to be in the Provincial (City) article I think, as many more people will get to read about them.
  
Once I was finished editing all the regular Las Vegas shows, I decided to tackle the concert listings knowing that this would be a very "hands on" endeavour requiring me to make edits on almost a daily basis.  
+
:::::::And Muang Kut, which is an elephant place should really be moved to Chiang Mai, as there are several elephant places already there.
  
I created a sub-heading titled "Concerts/Special Events" with 2 sub-headings under that titled "1 Night Only" and "Limited Engagement". I then started to populate the lists in chronological order based on all the information I had.  
+
:::::::And also, I now cannot find Ban Rong. Maybe Management removed it, but it is not in the Province page. [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 03:54, 25 April 2018 (EDT)
  
Halfway through listing the events for December I see a notice at the top of my screen saying that "there was a conflict with some of my listings etc. etc". Upon checking my User talk page I see a message that says this:
+
::::::::Hello again! Apologies for the delayed response about this- I got tied up and just got to looking over this. Totally understand your point, Avemario. It was the same for me when I did a search about these places- there wasn't too much info and I had to do some serious digging. For [[Ban Muang Kut]], I agree it should be moved to [[Chiang Mai]] as the information on that page can easily be added in the "Do" section and "Elephants". As for [[Jom Jang]] and [[Nong Prue]], I feel like there's a bit of a grey area with these place even though they are significantly a lot smaller. For [[Jom Jang]], the village has a uniqueness with its population being mostly local women farmers and community project. For [[Nong Prue]], I'm torn between just adding the information to the [[Kanchanaburi]] page or leave it as it's own because it quite a distance away from the province and it could have some potential. But you're right about how the information is too minimal. I also can't find Ban Rong either so I'm not sure if that page got deleted. Love these discussions! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 16:49, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
"I had to delete your contribution on Las Vegas page because we do not post one time events/ attractions in destination articles. Best, IBAlex 20:19, 30 November 2012 (EST)"
 
  
I could not believe what I was seeing!
+
::::::And once more................ Hellfire Pass is 72Km out of Kanchanaburi, Srinakarin Dam is 54Km, and these are just two places distant from Kanchanaburi City which are listed in the Kanchanaburi article. Nong Prue is quite close to Srinakarin Dam. (Do not confuse it with the Nong Prue in Pattaya (Chon Buri Province), which is some 250Km to the south)
 +
So again, I think it should be moved.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 19:10, 26 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::::(and again, remember that the name of the Province is the same as that of the Capital City of the Province, so these places above are within Kanchanaburi Province!(same as England, where the Capital of Derbyshire is Derby, of Yorkshire is York etc).[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 05:48, 27 April 2018 (EDT)
  
To omit "1 night only" or "limited engagement" concerts/special events from a Las Vegas entertainment listings is a travesty! Las Vegas is truly the entertainment capital of the world and to ignore this by not including these listings is doing the reader a huge dis-service. I personally, would book travel based on several of these events alone and I know this to be true for many others. There has to be an exception made for Vegas ... the concerts, shows and special events are what Las Vegas is all about! That in itself is what makes Las Vegas a travel destination! You can't apply standard rules as there is no place on the planet like this!
+
==Vote for May 2018 Homepage!==
 +
Hey guys! This April will be coming to an end in 4 days... whoa! That means it's time to vote for the next feature on our homepage for May! This month we featured Botswana as "Destination Of The Month" with a huge emphasis on Greek for all the other categories. What do you guys want to see? Let us know by commenting down below! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 16:19, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
:A location in Japan where you can see the beautiful blossom, like Binbin suggested last month. For the rest let me think a bit more. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 09:43, 27 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::[[Bora Bora]]! Just because I have been there long time ago and it is true paradise, blue waters, soft sand, coconut trees etc... [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 04:17, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::Ooh [[Bora Bora]] sounds lovely! Maybe that can be the "Destination Of The Month" as a precursor to summer with an emphasis on Japan culture for the other categories? [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 16:59, 30 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
::::Traditionally, we should be using destinations that will be popular places to travel in the months after when they are posted, so that people who are planning trips can make use of them. So, we should put Japanese cherry blossoms (which happen in April) on the DOTM in, say, January, if we can. It is useful to think ahead as far as what people are planning 3-4 months out. Right now I would think about late summer and fall travel. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 17:05, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::yes, you´re right, I thought the blossom could still be seen in May but that´s not the case. [[Brasil]] is a nice location for summer holidays. Landmark: the statue in Rio (Christ the Redeemer). [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 18:36, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
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::::::''we should be using destinations that will be popular places to travel in the months after when they are posted''... Then we should think about [[Russia]]: the FIFA World Cup is taking place over there between June and July. Brazil is another good option as well as other south american places (maybe [[Uruguay]] as OTBP?). [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 02:38, 1 May 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::::Great point Giulio! Time to start working on our World Cup article again soon too! Let´s learn some Russian then as language of the month! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 05:02, 1 May 2018 (EDT)
 +
::::::::I vote for Igbo as "Language of the month" [[Special:Contributions/98.158.206.105|98.158.206.105]] 12:24, 1 May 2018 (EDT)IBJoel
 +
:::::::::Wow! Lots of great suggestions guys! Maybe [[Bora Bora]] for Destination of the Month, Christ the Redeemer as Landmark, [[Uruguay]] as OTBP, French Polynesia as Cuisine Of The Month, Igbo for Language Of The Month. Thanks guys! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 15:32, 1 May 2018 (EDT)IB_hill
 +
::::::::::Homepage has been updated! Thanks for voting everyone! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 11:18, 2 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
This is a partial list of the concerts and special events for the month of December:
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==GDPR Compliance Announcement==
Aerosmith & Cheap Trick, ZZ Top, Megadeth, The Eagles, Red Hot Chili Peppers, The Black Keys, Pitbull, The Killers, The O'Jays, Jerry Seinfeld, the Wayans Brothers, The Eagles, Jeff Dunham, UFC 155, The Ultimate Fighter Finale, The National Rodeo Finals, American Country Awards, Three Dog Night, Restless Heart, Mannheim Steamroller, Trans-Siberian Orchestra, Train, Ron White, Bill Engvall, Dennis Miller & Bill O'Reilly, Journey & Loverboy, Merle Haggard, Lonestar, Manny Pacquiao vs Juan Manuel Márquez, Charlie Daniels Band, The Oak Ridge Boys, Randy Travis, LeAnn Rimes, 3 Doors Down & Daughtry, Moody Blues, Tanya Tucker, Travis Tritt, The Tragically Hip, Trace Adkins, Social Distortion, Dave Koz and many many more.
+
Hi everyone!
  
So now, in addition to all the concert/special event listings being deleted, so are all my show updates and inclusions. All of my work is now GONE! Wiped out in one fell swoop by an all-knowing, all-mighty admin. Hours and hours of work down the toilet!
+
Starting on or before May 25th, 2018, Wikitravel will become GDPR compliant in accordance with the EU GDPR regulation.
  
So, as of right now according to the Las Vegas WikiTravel page: Bette Midler, Lance Burton and Viva Elvis are still performing, while Shania Twain, Rod Stewart, Tim McGraw & Faith Hill and Celine Dion are not. Carrot Top and Sin City Comedy are the only 2 comedy shows in town. Dozens and dozens of shows and venues do not exist and there are no concerts playing in town at all whatsoever.
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If you are visiting this forum from an EU IP address, you will see a pop-up overlay that looks like this:
  
It's a shame.
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[[File:GDPR page for WT.png|GDPR Notice from IB]]
  
: I restored your edits; IMHO the deletion was bad judgement by an inexperienced admin. On the other hand, she had a point; WT is a travel guide; some of your listings may be too short-term to bother with and should be deleted as unmaintainable. Dicussion should go on the article's talk page. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 20:03, 1 December 2012 (EST)
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After clicking "I Agree," this message should not appear again (unless you clear your browser cookies). You can learn more about this on [https://www.eugdpr.org this page]. Thank you. [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 14:32, 21 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
I have committed myself to maintaining the short term edits. By tomorrow morning the concert listings dated December 1 will have been deleted. And so on and so on. I can appreciate how short-term listings might be termed "unmaintainable" by conventional thinking ... but ... Las Vegas is far from being a "conventional" travel destination. Thank you  [[User:Briank58|Briank58]] 20:17, 1 December 2012 (EST)
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==Slow servers?==
 +
My impression is that this site loads slowly. Have you had server issues? /[[User:Burbur|Burbur]] ([[User talk:Burbur|talk]]) 16:26, 21 May 2018 (EDT)
 +
:Hey Burbur! Not that I know of but I can go check that for you. Can you please let me know what operating system and browser you're using so I can investigate? Thanks! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 16:48, 21 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
:: I use Windows 10 and Mozilla Firefox. /[[User:Burbur|Burbur]] ([[User talk:Burbur|talk]]) 19:09, 31 May 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::Can you give us some more details with your user experience? What issues you think is going on with the server? [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 19:18, 31 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
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::::Seems to be fine now. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 16:42, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
  
 +
==Vote for June 2018 Homepage!==
 +
Still some time left, before today´s changes. The [[World Cup 2018]] article is ready to go, anyone else getting excited for the upcoming event? As language of the Month Russian would be a great help I guess, for those making it over to [[Russia]], but also because it´s such an interesting language to learn (yes, I made an attempt many years ago). Landmark of the Month, the Church of the Saviour on Spilled Blood in [[St. Petersburg]]. For Off the Beaten Path I´m going to think a bit more. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 05:00, 1 June 2018 (EDT)
 +
:Sounds like a great idea [[User:Adzas|Adzas]]! Will update by end of today. Does anyone else have any other preferences or thoughts? [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 14:42, 4 June 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
::Homepage has been updated! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 10:47, 7 June 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
:::By the way, [[User:IB hill|IB hill]], if you write the four tildes, you do not need to write your username, because the system automatically replaces the tildes with your username. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 16:54, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
  
:Briank58- thank you for your notice. I would gladly address this problem. I am here to help users and I am open to any suggestions and discussions.  
+
==Travel guide block==
:Please know that your contribution on Las Vegas page is highly appreciated. I am glad to see that you understand that Wikitravel does not support short-time listings (especially 1 day listings) because it is difficult to maintain them. We do worry that when users post short-time listings on the site, they will not remove them once the listings become outdated. And this clearly is not beneficial for the site and the users... In this way, the site risks of becoming eventually cluttered with those outdated listings. That is why I removed your listings, leaving a message on your Talk Page to let you know that I did not mean anything bad. I was simply following the conventions.
+
I know and understand why Wikitravellers are not allowed to use the name of a competing travel guide on this website. For example, I'd like to say that I'm mainly a contributor to Wiki but am now signed up on Wikitravel as well. Any thoughts? Just asking, I don't mind if you don't want to change. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 16:28, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
:However, when I see that you are willing to upkeep the listings and remove some of them on daily basis, I am fine with keeping them there. Again, your contribution is extremely valuable to Las Vegas site, thank you for that. Warm regards, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 13:32, 3 December 2012 (EST)
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:Also, I'd look forward to becoming a regular contributor to WT. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 21:04, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
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::Welcome! We would love for your to contribute more here :) But we do not allow references to 3rd party travel guides, sorry. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 13:28, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
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:::Thank you for your response. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 18:17, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::: Why is that? /[[User:Burbur|Burbur]] ([[User talk:Burbur|talk]]) 17:30, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
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::::: Hey [[User:Burbur|Burbur]]! You can have a read [https://wikitravel.org/en/Wikitravel:External_links#Avoid_links_to_other_travel_guides here] to better answer your question. [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 17:50, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
 +
Longtime Wiki policy to ensure that Wikitravel remains a primary source, for travelers, by travelers, and not a link farm. Experience has shown that once you start allowing references to one guide, everyone thinks they can link whatever they want. So we just say no references or links to other travel guides, and it has worked out very nicely. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 17:51, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
  
== Why are the Orbitz ads appearing on non-logged in users? ==
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==Vote for the July 2018 Homepage!==
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I know it's really early, but it's better to start the nominating process early than to start late, so I think we may as well start now. I nominate the following with the idea of a [[Southwest (United States of America)|Southwest]] theme:
  
''Disclaimer: I wrote the following without knowing that the feature was supposed to be opt-in''
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*DOTM: [[Tucson]]
: Case in point: [[Buenos Aires]], [[Hong Kong]], [[Paris]], and many other cities now have Orbitz banners in the header and the 'Get In' and 'Sleep' sections.
 
  
: I understand the need for more funding, but nobody will ever say "Oh, how convenient, now I can buy plane tickets while in the middle of reading a Wikitravel article". On its current state is useless at the best, and obtrusive at its worst.
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*OTBP: [[Monument Valley]]
  
: Sometimes this is extremely ridiculous: just look at the article on [[Orania]].
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*Language of the Month: [[Spanish phrasebook]]
  
For those reasons I think anyway that having it as an opt-out is a terrible idea. [[Special:Contributions/190.189.234.13|190.189.234.13]] 22:57, 1 December 2012 (EST)
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*Landmark of the Month: not sure
:The announcement is in the section above at [[#Travel booking tool!]]. <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 23:41, 1 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
::I know. But according to that announcement,
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*Cuisine of the Month: not sure
:::If you log in to your Wikitravel account, you will need to go to your *preferences* in order to turn on this booking tool -- you will not see it at all unless you turn it on.
 
::These ads are appearing to me as a non-logged-in user, and the only way I found to disable them is
 
to log-in into an account, clearly making it opt-out.
 
::Was that change intentional? In that case it's a horrible decision IMO. [[Special:Contributions/190.189.234.13|190.189.234.13]] 11:37, 2 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
:This was discussed about a year ago and is one of the reasons why it is so quiet here. However ignoring question of whether a booking engine should be there, I find the implementation poor.
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What do the others think? [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 23:14, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
:I tried the booking banner from the [[Aberdeen]] page, trying to find a flight to there from Manchester. The article said that there were direct flights, so that was what I was expecting to be offered, but I was only offered a flight via Amsterdam, requiring an overnight stay and costing $407 return. But at Orbitz's own site, I was offered direct flights on the same dates for $184 return. There is also no easy way of finding out who Orbitz is, or of changing the currency from dollars.  
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:Thanks for submitting your suggestions! We'll definitely circle back to this when the time gets closer. :) [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 18:19, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
:Trying it on [[Orania]] gave the suggestion of Alexandria, which is a long distance away - the booking engine must know the correct airport for every page that it appears on.
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:: [[Grand Canyon]] is a good landmark candidate. /[[User:Burbur|Burbur]] ([[User talk:Burbur|talk]]) 17:31, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
:It would be better to have the booking banner on the right hand side, above the adverts. This also gives the possibility of getting local bus and train companies to offer booking. I doubt that I will be looking to book a flight here, but a way of booking the bus from the airport would be useful. [[User:AlasdairW|AlasdairW]] 18:18, 3 December 2012 (EST)
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:::Thanks for submitting your votes early! Can't believe the first month of summer flew by fast. Please share your thoughts for what our homepage in July should be. Would love to get everyone's opinions! :) [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 13:15, 29 June 2018 (EDT)
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::::What about a location in [[New England]] to prepare for autumn (I know, summer goes way too fast!), like [[Vermont]]? OBP somewhere in [[Alaska]], Landmark of the Month: Chief Johnson Totem Pole in [[Ketchikan]]. Lovely memories...
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:::::I like the [[Grand Canyon]] as landmark and I too think that an autumn location where you can enjoy foliage would be great ([[New England]] or [[Japan]]). [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 04:18, 30 June 2018 (EDT)
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:::::: A location in [[New England]] or [[Japan]] will definitely be great. Speaking of autumn location, [[Jiuzhaigou]] would be great too: great views, rich colors, cool weather. Planning another trip :-).
 +
:::::::[[Jiuzhaigou]] sounds like an amazing location, would be great to feature that! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 04:58, 1 July 2018 (EDT)
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:::::::: All sound like great ideas! Maybe we can push the autumn idea to next month and do the Southwest theme that has been suggested for July? Also think it's a good idea to add [[Grand Canyon]] as Landmark of the Month. For Cuisine Of The Month, I think talking about New Mexico will be cool to top off the Southwest theme altogether. We can definitely revisit the autumn idea next month when the season gets closer and enjoy summer. :) [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 14:38, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
  
::Hi Alasdair -- I am looking into why the results are different. I tried the same search and got the same results you did. We're still working the kinks out and hope it can be a very useful tool indeed for our Wikitravelers. Please let me know if you see anything else that is suboptimal. Cheers, --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] 19:02, 7 December 2012 (EST)
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==Updated [[DOTM]] and [[VFD]] pages==
  
==New administrators nomination==
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Those pages were out of date, so I have been archiving old nominations and bringing it all up-to-date. Just wanted the administrators and other editors to know this and that I'm not trying to cause problems. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 22:37, 17 July 2018 (EDT)
We have a new nomination for the administrator on Wikitravel. Please have a look at [[Wikitravel:Administrator nominations|Administrator nominations]]. Best, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 20:34, 3 December 2012 (EST)
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:Thanks for bringing this to our attention. I'll take a closer look when I get a chance. [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 10:06, 18 July 2018 (EDT)
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::By the way, the information there about having the schedule go on for six months (which of course we don't do anymore) was not something I wrote, that was written many years ago when the website was set up, I think. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 19:22, 5 August 2018 (EDT)
  
== Town of Rochester, New York ==
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==Vote for Aug 2018 Homepage==
 +
August is coming up in just a few days. Anyone have suggestions on what should be on the homepage? Comment below down here![[User: IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User_talk: IB hill|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/IB hill|contribs]])
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:Hey, last month we were talking about a location for autumn and a few names came up ([[Vermont]], [[New England]], [[Japan]], [[Jiuzhaigou]]). All of these (maybe someone here knows more specific locations in the US and Japan) could be DOM. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 03:43, 28 July 2018 (EDT)
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::I agree with Giulio, a nice autumn location would be great. Depending on what we choose we can base the food, landmark, language on that too! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 14:40, 28 July 2018 (EDT)
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::: A location for autumn sounds great! For food, isn't autumn best for sea food? Language can be decided after that.    --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 01:39, 29 July 2018 (EDT)
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:::: All great suggestions! Maybe we can do either [[Japan]] or [[Jiuzhaigou]] since we did a US destination for last month. [[Jiuzhaigou]] might be a more interesting choice as some people might not know too much about it! <small>—The preceding comment was added by [[User: IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User_talk: IB hill|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/IB hill|contribs]]) </small>
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:::::I think [[Japan]] sounds excellent for next month's theme when you consider how Japan has its own cuisine, language, and surely plenty of landmarks (such as Samurai-type forts with Japanese architecture) and of course Mt. Fuji. Probably better climate for the time of year than the Southwest in July, as well (although the elevation of somewhere like the rim of the [[Grand Canyon]] brings the temperature to a reasonable level). [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 13:00, 30 July 2018 (EDT)
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::::::I love the idea of Japan. Plenty of good leaf viewing there in fall. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 14:26, 30 July 2018 (EDT)
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:::::: Ok! Let's do [[Japan]] then and stick with that theme where we can have cuisine and language be Japanese. Does anyone have any suggestions for OTBP? Maybe we can do one of the islands such as [[Hokkaido]] or [[Kyushu]]? [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 12:49, 31 July 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::::Talking about [[Hokkaido]], while I was on that article I noticed a picture of the "Goko Five Lakes" in [[Shiretoko National Park]], a national park on Hokkaido Island. [[Shiretoko National Park|Shiretoko Park]] is a usable article, so it seems like a good OTBP possibility except for the [[Shiretoko_National_Park#Stay_safe|bears]] that live there, which are of course going to be a danger. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 13:04, 31 July 2018 (EDT)
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::::::::I just want to go to [[Japan]] now! I also started to read about the National Parks in the [[Hokkaido]] article, maybe to narrow it down a little for OBP we should pick one of those articles? Bears, sounds exciting! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 16:29, 31 July 2018 (EDT)
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::::::: Ooh, let's do that then. Thanks guys! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 18:24, 31 July 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::::: The [[Shiretoko National Park]] looks great! It'd be a good OTBP! [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 03:15, 1 August 2018 (EDT)
  
There is Town of Rochester (Ulster County) [http://www.ulstertourism.info/] in New York State which is different from the larger, more familiar City of Rochester (Monroe County) in New York State. How would I add (name) the Town of Rochester here? The two Rochesters are over a hundred miles apart, not related at all. [[User:Gamweb|gamweb]] 18:10, 8 December 2012 (EST)
 
* Reference: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rochester,_Ulster_County,_New_York] Wikipedia
 
  
: Hi Gamweb! Thank you for your message. The best way is to create a page for Town of Rochester from the scratch since it doesn't exist here. Please have a look [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Town_of_Rochester&action=edit&redlink=1]. You would need to select the best template and just [[ Wikitravel: Plunge forward| plunge forward]]. Don't worry if you don't know how to fill out all the sections- someone will be along to help with it later! Once the page is created, we would need to create a '''Disambiguation Page''', similar to [[Boston (disambiguation)| this one]] so that nobody will get confused with the destination. Please let me know if there is anything else i can help with. Greetings, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 13:42, 10 December 2012 (EST)
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==Vote for Sept 2018 Homepage==
 +
The last month of summer is officially halfway over! This means it's a good time to start thinking what we want to see on the homepage for the first month of fall. If anyone has suggestions, please comment below! :) [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 10:54, 16 August 2018 (EDT)
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::In response to [[User:IB hill|IB hill]], I think a [[New England]] theme would work well. -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 15:44, 21 August 2018 (EDT)
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::: Thanks [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] for sharing your thoughts! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 14:29, 22 August 2018 (EDT) 
 +
:::: I think [[Hartford]] would probably be a good DOTM, and [[Burlington (Vermont)|Burlington]] for OTBP are definitely possibilities, since they are at usable status and have quite a lot of content. For a landmark, [[Niagara Falls (New York)|the United States side of the Niagara Falls]] looks like a pretty good article, and has 2 static maps. I'm not so sure about cuisine of the month or language of the month, although since French can be found close to New England in southern Canada, perhaps [[French phrasebook|French]] would be a good choice.
 +
:::: At some point in the near future I might take a look at my DOTM and OTBP selections and make formatting-type edits where needed, so the articles look good when they're featured. -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 14:02, 22 August 2018 (EDT)
 +
::::: I was actually thinking about another autumn location, since last month we were discussing between New England and Japan (and we ended up choosing the latter) this time we could choose New England. I don't know [[Hartford]] nor [[Burlington (Vermont)|Burlington]] as suggested by [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]], so to me they're both good. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 04:59, 23 August 2018 (EDT)
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::::::Yes, I was suggesting Hartford and Burlington in line with the New England theme. -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 14:53, 23 August 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::::So I've done some work on the Hartford and Burlington articles. Here's Hartford before my recent edits [https://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Hartford&oldid=2496711] and here's how it looks as of this comment [https://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Hartford&oldid=2559684]. Mostly just formatting fixes, etc., but every little bit helps.
 +
:::::::Then on the Burlington article, it looked like this [https://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Burlington_(Vermont)&oldid=2482417] and as of this comment it looks like this [https://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Burlington_(Vermont)&oldid=2559697]. Again, pretty insignificant changes on the surface. Just wanted to let others know when considering what to feature next month that these are now formatted quite well. -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 14:21, 24 August 2018 (EDT)
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:::::::::What about [[Sighisoara]] as OBP, or [[Transylvania]] in general, a great Halloween destination to visit the said birthplace of Dracula. Or [[Bran]] with as landmark of the month Bran Castle. Just to get into the mysterious mood of Halloween..... [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 04:29, 30 August 2018 (EDT)
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::::::::::We're going into September, not October, though. -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 22:10, 27 August 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::::::::Correct [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) but we always try to plan ahead a few months with our articles so travellers can still book accordingly. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 03:59, 28 August 2018 (EDT)
 +
::::::::::::[[Transylvania]]! I like it! [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 03:21, 30 August 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::::::::::Hey guys! Thanks for your input for September's DOTM and OTBP. I'll go ahead and put [[Hartford]] and [[Burlington (Vermont)|Burlington]] on the calendar. We can save [[Sigisoara]] and [[Transylavnia]] for October. :) [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 16:21, 30 August 2018 (EDT)
  
::There is already a disambiguation page at [[Rochester]]. I would suggest [[Rochester_(Ulster_County)]] might be best, county names are often used when there is more than one place of the same name in a state / country. But it worth asking "what do people say locally?", when buying a bus ticket to the town from the other side of the state, as this may suggest a better name. [[User:AlasdairW|AlasdairW]] 18:47, 10 December 2012 (EST)
+
==Question about Main Page==
 +
Hi! I am new here as an editor, though I have been reading this website for years and I have just looked at the main page. The strange thing is that I see it full-size, but it fits the left half of my computer screen. Is there any way to change the resolution of the main page to fit individual screens? --[[User:Fordaemdur|Fordaemdur]] ([[User talk:Fordaemdur|talk]]) 10:31, 21 August 2018 (EDT)
 +
:[[User:Fordaemdur|Fordaemdur]], not sure what might be the issue but can you please let us know what browser and operating system you're using? Also, please send over any screen shots that may help our tech team look into the situation to admin(dot)wikitravel.com. Thanks! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 10:12, 22 August 2018 (EDT)
  
:::Nice!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] 18:49, 10 December 2012 (EST)
+
== Hyphen/dash formatting ==
  
== [[Wikitravel:Requested articles| Requested articles]]==
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Just wanted to check, since I couldn't find this in Wikitravel policy: it's considered best to use an mdash (that is, "<nowiki>&mdash;</nowiki>") instead of "-" or "--", right? Just wanted to check because I have been changing hyphens to mdahes in a couple articles. For example, see this link [https://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Burlington_%28Vermont%29&type=revision&diff=2559453&oldid=2482417] to see what I mean by this. -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 15:17, 22 August 2018 (EDT)
User Blist has recently created a [[Wikitravel:Requested articles| page]] with a list of requested articles that still don't exist on Wikitravel. Please [[Wikitravel: Plunge_forward| plunge forward]] and help us grow! Looking forward to your contributions! Best, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 18:13, 11 December 2012 (EST)
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:Hey [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]]! So sorry for the delayed response... I thought I replied! I think your judgement is correct as I took a look at some of our star articles and they all have "&mdash". I'm assuming people might have forgotten about the style over time but it's always good to bring it back :) {{Unsigned|IB hill}}
 +
::Thanks. It's not the biggest formatting issue in the world but still one that I'll do in future for articles that are DOTMs, etc. -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 11:54, 29 August 2018 (EDT)
  
== New Page - Kerhonkson ==
+
== Technical Issues with logging in ==
 +
Hi everyone. There is a current issue with users not being able to log in. Just wanted to announce that we are well aware of it and will take care of it ASAP. Apologies for any inconveniences. [[Special:Contributions/98.158.206.108|98.158.206.108]] 09:47, 23 August 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
:The issue has been fixed. Thanks for your patience! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 13:55, 23 August 2018 (EDT)
 +
::I never even had a problem! :) Thanks for mentioning this anyway, though. -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 14:53, 23 August 2018 (EDT)
  
I just created new page for [[Kerhonkson]], New York. It's been a while since I made a new page. Please look it over to see what's missing. (Auxiliary wikilinks) [[User:Gamweb|gamweb]] 22:48, 12 December 2012 (EST)
+
==Main page overlap ==
: Great job! Thank you! I needed to change the headline "Go next" to "Get out" because that's still the proper name Wikitravel uses for this section. We would be changing this headline soon throughout all the articles. I'm looking forward to more contributions from you. Thank you again! Cheers! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 15:10, 13 December 2012 (EST)
 
::Sorry about that. I was working in "parallel" with another travel site at the same time (enough said). [[User:Gamweb|gamweb]] 16:04, 13 December 2012 (EST)
 
:::No worries. Thank you! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 16:35, 13 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
== Tourism In Zambia - Explore Zambia Tourism ==
+
I've noticed for quite a while now that the travel news, phrasebook/picture of the month, and the DOTM slideshow all overlap over each other. I should have mentioned this earlier. -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 12:40, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
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:Hey [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]]!
 +
:We are well aware of this issue and have been in contact with the tech team to work on it. Can you let me know what browser and operating :system you're using? For my computer, it's only the "Language Of the Month" picture bleeding into the "Destination of the Month". [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 12:52, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
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::I'm using Chrome as the browser and Windows 10. -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 13:11, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
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:::Hmm good to know. If you can, please send over screenshots to [email protected](dot)com. Would appreciate if I can get a better understanding of what you're seeing. Thanks! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 13:14, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
 +
::::Could I perhaps upload the screenshot to this website? -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 15:41, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
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:::::I'm also using Chrome and Windows 10 but I don't see anything unusual on my screen? [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 05:37, 1 September 2018 (EDT)
  
Explore Zambia Tourism is an on-line website with a global platform, that uses a completely flexible approach from facilitating information about Zambia's tourism industry on the Explore Zambia Tourism website, to creating websites, research, consultancy and tailor-made advice for yourself or your organisation. Heard of the Smart Traveler, Smart Provider concept! They created it.
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==Vote for October 2018 Homepage==
 +
Halloween month is less than two weeks away! We had [[Sighisoara]], [[Transylvania]], and [[Bran]] mentioned already. Does anyone have any other suggestions they want to see on the homepage for October 2018? [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 18:00, 18 September 2018 (EDT)
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:I think these are really good options! But I'll think about some other places just to have some more ideas... if we want to have some weird, eerie place for Halloween, have you ever heard about the "Park of the monsters" in [[Bomarzo]], [[Italy]]? [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 04:00, 20 September 2018 (EDT)
  
Explore Zambia, famous for its iconic Victoria Falls, rich heritage, wildlife and beautiful landscape. Zambia is not only the perfect stage for new and exciting events but is also a destination for all seasons. Enjoy stunning waterfront views and other commanding views across the country, distinct identity and cultural traditions coalescing to form one unity, real communities where you can live like a local, explore heritage sites, and hidden wildlife gems found within the unspoiled lands. From adventure to safaris, no matter your age or ability there is always something for you to enjoy.
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:I still like the idea of [[Transylvania]]. Maybe the Castle in [[Bran]] as the Landmark of the month, and Giulio's “Park of monsters” sounds like a great OBP destination, it is something new, I’ve never heard of it. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 03:52, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
  
​Find information and great ideas on things to see and do in Zambia. Plan your business and leisure trip to Zambia with great deals on accommodation, services and travel advice. Explore Zambia Tourism!
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::In all, there are about six different ones, right? There’s also cuisine and language. Apart from pumpkins, I can’t think of much related to October 31 in those fields. So what should we do with those? -- [[User:SelfieCity|Selfie City]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 14:38, 22 September 2018 (EDT)
  
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:::  Those place are all very nice, but I still hope to see [[Jiuzhaigou]] [https://en.jiuzhai.com/], maybe as the OBP of this month? I've been there in an October holiday. Really nice at this time of the year, the view, the weather. Enjoy this beautiful season! Cheers!      --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 23:52, 22 September 2018 (EDT)

Latest revision as of 03:56, 23 September 2018

The Travellers' pub is the place to ask questions when you're confused, lost, afraid, tired, annoyed, thoughtful, or helpful. Please check the FAQ and Help page before asking a question, though, since that may save your time and others'.

Please add new questions at the bottom of the page and sign your post by appending four tildes (~~~~) to it, but otherwise plunge forward!

You can find Archived discussions here: Travellers´pub Archives.

  • If you have a question or suggestion about a particular article, try using talk pages to keep the discussion specific to that article.

Business Listings: How Much is too Much?[edit]

Earlier today, a bus company that operates New Zealand's largest passenger transport network with daily services from Auckland to many towns and cities in the Waikato region made an account, and proceeded to add their listing to a WHOLE BUNCH of pages, which looked like spam from my end. Should we allow companies to add their listings to more than a certain number of pages? Yes? No? If we do, what could be the ramifications? What could potential questions, comments, and or snide remarks could arise? -- —The preceding comment was added by Tonikar (talkcontribs)

Good question. But I think their listing should only be added to the city where their headquarters is located (and maybe to small cities and towns where they are the only choice to get into). Just imagine if we allow this bus operator to add all its lines to Wikitravel articles, we will soon see chain restaurants, hotels, and other business add listings to all places where they operate (actually, we've seen quite a few cases like this before), which will soon turn Wikitravel to a yellow page. Plus our policy about touting is pretty clear about this: ...businesses should be listed in only one article for the town or district in which the business operates... . --Binbin (talk) 04:21, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
I agree with Binbin, we'd better stick to our touting policy. The risk of having chains adding their listings everywhere is too high (and we're not the Yellow Pages, aren't we?). GiulioC (talk) 05:24, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
If you are in New Zealand without a car, it is likely that you will use Intercity to get around. I think that there is only one other operator (Naked Bus) with a smaller national network and some regional operators (Atomic etc) and for a few destinations trains. So I think that it is fine to mention them in the get in section. However we don't need the full details about WiFi etc in every article. I would prefer that some information was added about the services to a particular destination - e.g. "X has two coaches per day from Auckland via Hamilton and one from Wellington via Napier. Coaches stop outside the post office." AlasdairW (talk) 10:55, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
AlasdairW, and Binbin bring up good points. This could be a slippery slope, but on this one occasion since they are one of the few transportation services listed on our site in some areas it seems relevant and helpful. Would it be okay if they specified amenities for travelers per each location? Tonikar (talk) 9:27, 17 March 2017 (PST)
I agree that we should stick with our policy, have the business listed once, probably best the country article, and there list some specific amenities if that adds value. In our external links policy it says clearly what not to list to, so if we make an exception for one business, soon more will follow. Adzas (talk) 12:40, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
Would it be good to review our policy, and add an addendum for the amount of posts that a company has added/ can add? Also, should we be reviewing these on a case by case basis; especially if we think it could be helpful for the traveler? Like AlasdairW, had said that it is likely you will come across this company's transportation system in NZ if travelling without a car... Tonikar (talk) 1:42, 17 March 2017 (PST)

I'm torn on this one too. First, I love Alasdair's point that a business should take the time, if they are going to try this, to make EACH listing specifically relevant to that page. If they don't want to take the time to point out the relevancy of their business to that particular destination (and they ought to be encouraged by us to do so), they should not have the privilege of being listed here.

Second, I am at a loss to find something wrong with listing a business on multiple pages, if those pages do not contain any (or a very small number) similar options. In this case, if you are considering traveling to a small town in NZ that is only served by this bus company, we ought to provide details as to how to catch a bus into/out of there if we have them. What is the harm? Now, if this is, say, New York City, where there are interminable bus and other transportation options for getting in and out, I would say that allowing companies to list all of them would be disastrous for Wikitravel, and of limited to zero use for the traveler. And don't even get me started on chain restaurants!

So perhaps there is a middle ground? Where there are many existing options, disallow the listing; where there are none or very few, allow them; and when allowed, the listing must be customized to that destination. And when we see a company engaging in this behavior, we ought to make contact with them as soon as possible, guide them, and have them provide a proposed list of everywhere they are intending to add their listing, as well as the specifics of how they will customize their listing to the page, BEFORE they spam it out everywhere publicly. How's that sound? IBobi (talk) 19:29, 22 March 2017 (EDT)

I agree. In principle, listing on multiple pages is not allowed , except where similar choices are limited and/or there're none or only a few similar listings (we do have this "something is better than nothing" policy). Yes, a prior communication with the companies who want to put their listings on multiple page sounds even better so that on one hand they can do it properly with our help, on the other we can kind of make sure things don't go out of control. I think we can start with this bus operator in NZ. What do you guys think? --Binbin (talk) 01:40, 23 March 2017 (EDT)

Just curious if this is the issue which led to postings about my businesses Izu Hike and Fuji Bike Tour being anonymously removed with no comments on the talk pages of any of the locations where I added the postings. I did customize the posts to be appropriate to the locations where I posted. I'm a sole proprietor who offers biking and hiking tours in numerous little towns in Izu and the Fuji Five Lakes areas. The pages for the Izu cities don't have any info on hiking tours so it made sense to me to provide info on the tours my business offers on each city's page. If I didn't do that, how would someone who visits one of those cities' pages know they could go for a guided hike? I think your readers will miss out on a lot of relevant info if postings can only be made on one general page for a country or region rather than on multiple specific location pages. People who want to hike in Matsuzaki or Ito or Shimoda are not going to go to a page on Japan looking for hiking info about those little towns. In any case, whatever you decide, it'd be nice to get the benefit of the doubt that a person with good intentions might be behind posts and provide info in the talk pages about why posts were deleted, if you're not already doing that consistently. I took the time to make several posts and all were deleted without any info in the talk pages about why. Not sure if that was you admin folks or someone else. Thanks for your attention to this question. Elforestero (talk) 20:59, 18 September 2018 (EDT)Elforestero

Hey Elforestero! Thanks for reaching out in the pub. Not sure what happened as I've only been on Wiktiravel for a few months but I think it depends. We get a lot of hiking and bike our listings to the point where it gets too much and starts to saturate the content. Because of that, we naturally just take it down as it starts to appear "ad-like" or "spammy". If there's something extremely unique about your tour of if there is no other tour listed, I think it'll be fine to post. But in addition to adhering to our touting policy, we do ask you to keep the posting to a minimum (i.e. posting it on select pages that make absolute sense) and write the post in an original way where it's not word for word from your other marketing materials that can also be found online. Hope this better answers your question IB hill (talk) 10:23, 19 September 2018 (EDT)

Map Based wikitravel[edit]

Hello!

I wish to introduce a map based wikitravelish website impressionmap.org

I'm an avid reader and planned all trips based on info here. A big thanks first! However, articles are organized by meaningless place names (it's the only choice though), and it's not straightforward to figure out which place is where. Thus, planning bigger trips involves going back and forth between here and Google Maps, taking a long time.

It may be better to organize info by map itself and attach it to the map as snippets which will appear or disappear based on zoom level. More info and links can be added as popups. So I made the aforementioned website. You can zoom in to Amherst, MA or NYC (worse option as not much info is added) to see how it works. By the way, the website doesn't seem to work on IE and renders a bit ugly on browsers released before March 2017

Asking for advice and opinions! If you would, edit it as well!

Hopefully this is the right place to do such introduction. No bad intention, just wish to make travel info presentation more intuitive and trip planning easier Wkenmomo (talk) 14:16, 1 June 2017 (EDT)

Sorry for such a late response! We appreciate your time spent on Wikitravel -- especially for adding edits to the Liaocheng page. We hope to see more thoughtful edits like the ones you have provided. Thanks for the info! --Tonikar (talk) 01:50, 06 June 2017 (PST)
Hey Wkenmomo! I finally got a chance to check out the website you had created, and I think its pretty cool! I like that it sums up exactly where I may want to travel if I want to shop, or find out more about American history! I was wondering -- and you kind of explained already-- but your purpose for creating a map that works as so? How would this help benefit Wikitravel users? Thanks! --Tonikar (talk) 012:39, 07 June 2017 (PST)
Hey Tonikar, sorry for the late reply. Why I create it is that I want a more direct way of accessing geo info. I used to read here, search on Google Map, write what it is about and save it in my maps to compare with others. A great hassle and Google maps aren't designed for this. My purpose is to make designing "optimized" trips easier and I really hope to plan my next trip to Canada intuitively and effortlessly. Do wikitravel need a dynamic map? Wikitravel is welcome to host this map and embed it to the right zoom and boundary. The map is itself editable.Wkenmomo (talk) 13:45, 10 June 2017 (EDT)
Tonikar, Wkenmomo I think it would be a great idea to include links to Wikimapia. I'm working on US Hwy 2 between Monroe and Stephens Pass. Here is an example of what you get for Skykomish_(Washington) [1]. We could actually provide links to WikiTravel on the WikiMapia page. Ideas? Kgrr (talk) 08:46, 9 July 2017 (EDT)
Hello there, Wkenmomo, is there any way to zoom in/out the map and natively move around the places not having to type the place's name each time? --Fordaemdur (talk) 10:29, 21 August 2018 (EDT)
Hey Fordaemdur! Just a heads up, the map I think you're referring was a suggestion and not an official project. I just checked the map though and I think you can zoom in and out by scrolling. I'm using a mouse to scroll in and out on a Windows desktop so not sure if it will work the same on a trackpad of a laptop. IB hill (talk) 10:28, 22 August 2018 (EDT)

Please make suggestions for WT homepage content[edit]

Hello! We'd like Wikitravel users to help us decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for February by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Monday January 29th. We will announce the winning topics Tuesday the 30th. Thank you!Ncahill (talk) 14:11, 22 January 2018 (EST)

For Destination of the Month, what about Mexico, since the largest underwater cave was discovered there very recently? Interesting location for sure! Mexican cuisine is also nice. Adzas (talk) 09:42, 23 January 2018 (EST)
Maybe for "Off the Beaten Path" you could try Prachuap Khiri Khan in Thailand. This place is a paradise, and not at all expensive. Regrettably, more and more tourists are coming here, so go there before it becomes another Phuket or similar. Avemario (talk) 04:04, 24 January 2018 (EST)
I second Adzas idea of Mexico (and Mexican cuisine). Another option could be Venice (it's Carnival time). For OTBP you could try some small town/village around Europe (there are dozens of them). GiulioC (talk) 05:27, 26 January 2018 (EST)
Hey everyone, these are all great ideas! Still need suggestions for Language of the Month and Landmark of the Month. Shall I extend the voting until tomorrow the 31st?Ncahill (talk) 10:38, 30 January 2018 (EST)
I always vote for Mexican cuisine. For language, I would probably throw in Swahili. IBJoel (talk)IBJoel (talk) 11:08, 30 January 2018 (EST)
For Landmark of the month maybe we can do Mỹ Sơn in Vietnam, they're ruins of old Hindu Temples. IBThomas (talk) 12:31, 30 January 2018 (EST)
Hi everyone! Thank you for your wonderful suggestions this past week. Here are the winners for the home page content for February. Destination of the Month: Mexico, Off the Beaten Path: Prachuap Khiri Khan, Cuisine of the Month: Mexican, Language of the Month: Swahili, and Landmark of the Month: Mỹ Sơn. (Boy was Mexico popular!). We hope to make this a regular thing for the monthly home page content. An announcement will be made here on the Pub during the last week of the month asking for user's ideas on what the Wikitravel home page should feature. Thanks again to those who participated!Ncahill (talk) 11:39, 31 January 2018 (EST)
Great choices! Probably too late now, but since the Winter Olympics are taking place in Pyeongchang from Feb 9-25, maybe we should highlight this location too this month? Only just realised that this is happening this month. Adzas (talk) 07:53, 2 February 2018 (EST)

Bangkok Hotels[edit]

I just checked the "Bangkok" section of Wikitravel, and I saw in the "Hotels" section, a number of hotel listings. Mainly upmarket ones. I believe that these should have been placed in individual District articles, Also, they're somewhat touty. Should I remove them? Avemario (talk) 03:55, 24 January 2018 (EST)

Hello Avemario, you are correct, those listings should be moved to the respective district articles. If you feel a listing is pure advertising you can remove it, otherwise maybe adjust it a little if it is a good location to have mentioned. Just make sure you specify in the summary field of your edit what you are doing. Thanks as always! Adzas (talk) 04:46, 25 January 2018 (EST)
OK, will do. Just give me a couple of days as it is a holiday weekend here. Avemario (talk) 01:32, 26 January 2018 (EST)
OK, all sorted now. Avemario (talk) 02:20, 29 January 2018 (EST)
Thank you! Adzas (talk) 07:33, 4 February 2018 (EST)

Home Page Content Voting for March 2018[edit]

Hi All! We'd like Wikitravel users to help us decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for March by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Wednesday, February 28th. We will announce the winning topics on the Pub Thursday, March 1st. Thank you!Ncahill (talk) 11:35, 20 February 2018 (EST)

Destination of the Month could be Florence, early spring is one of the best moments to visit the city (and as far as I can see it has never been chosen before). Off the Beaten Path: Ronda in Spain. We could choose Cuisine and Language of a specific region: after all many of our phrasebook pages have sections about ordering food and drink. What do you think? GiulioC (talk) 06:07, 23 February 2018 (EST)
I just got a message from someone about an Indonesian food delivery where I live, just looking at the pictures makes me hungry, for Cuisine I would suggest Indonesian! Off the Beaten Path Papua New Guinea? Destination of the Month I like Giulio´s suggestion Florence. Landmark of the Month the Abbey at Mont Saint Michel? Such a special place. Adzas (talk) 10:10, 23 February 2018 (EST)
Indonesian cuisine! Good suggestion! GiulioC (talk) 05:36, 24 February 2018 (EST)
Landmark of the Month: the Botanical Garden in Padua. It's the oldest in the world, established in 1545, recently renovated and (sadly) often overlooked. GiulioC (talk) 11:45, 26 February 2018 (EST)
I second the call for Indonesian cuisine! Or Pakistani, alternatively. IBJoel (talk) 98.158.206.112 11:43, 1 March 2018 (EST)
Need a tie breaker for OTBP and Landmark please!Ncahill (talk) 15:53, 1 March 2018 (EST)
Thank you all for the wonderful suggestions! Here are the winners: Destination of the Month, Florence, Off the Beaten Path, Ronda in Spain, Cuisine of the Month, Javanese/Indonesian, Language of the Month, Indonesian, and Landmark of the Month, Abbey at Mont Saint Michel. Agreed with OTBP and Landmark options? Ran out of time so I chose these. Thank you again for posting, be ready for wonderful suggestions for the April home page!Ncahill (talk) 17:41, 1 March 2018 (EST)

April 2018 suggestions for WT Homepage content![edit]

A little bit to the game to this but each month the content of our homepage changes. We'd like Wikitravel users to help decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for April by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Wednesday, April 4th. We will announce the winning topics on the Pub Thursday, April 5th. Thank you!

Botswana! IBobi (talk) 17:02, 3 April 2018 (EDT)
Ooh! That can be an interesting one. Anyone else have suggestions for Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month?
What about Greek cuisine for the Cuisine topic? Off the Beaten Path a nice hidden place in Greece as well, like Zakynthos. Why not Greek as the Language of the Month then, and the Corinth Canal as the Landmark of the Month? Keeping it all in one country, long time since I have been there but a lovely country to visit! Adzas (talk) 04:50, 4 April 2018 (EDT)
Botswana would be great! Also choosing a greek island for OTBP: Zakynthos is good but we may choose some other island (Ithaca?) GiulioC (talk) 11:12, 4 April 2018 (EDT)
Wow! Great suggestions, Adzas and GiulioC! I think having those spots from Greece as OTBP, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month are all lovely idea as some people may not have heard of them or never been... like me! IB hill (talk) 11:52, 4 April 2018 (EDT)IB_hill
I was thinking a city in Japan though, like Nara (with the nice cherry season), but Botswana is a great pick too! Keeping it all in one country sounds like a very good idea. I like it. Greek cuisine for the Cuisine topic, Greek as the Language of the Month, Off the Beaten Path a nice hidden place in Greece. Good idea! I'm for it. --Binbin (talk) 04:01, 5 April 2018 (EDT)
I´ve seen pictures of these cherry blossoms in Japan, beautiful! Which months can that usually be seen, we can still use Nara next time? Beautiful! Adzas (talk) 06:01, 7 April 2018 (EDT)

Wikitravel Software Update Coming Next Week[edit]

Hello all Wikitravellers! This is one of your admins on Wikitravel. Just sending an update that our site will be expecting a upgrade sometime next week. Should anyone come across any issues, please e-mail [email protected](dot)org or message me on my talk page. IB hill (talk) 20:21, 6 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Vandalism on WT today[edit]

If you happen to see a strange looking page on WT today, please let us know. Don't be alarmed, it's just a vandal. Our Legal team are in the process of tracing the related IPs and will be alerting local law enforcement immediately. Thank you, IBobi (talk) 15:22, 10 April 2018 (EDT)

WT Software Upgrade Happening Now![edit]

Hi everyone! Heads up that as of Wednesday, April 11th at 12:05pm PST, the site will be down and ready for upgrade! IB hill (talk) 15:05, 11 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Hi, IB hill,
Due to the software upgrade this time, we have some bugs on ja:WT. We can't display some of our pages correctly, with a internal error message instead. Here is an example:
[[email protected]] /ja/%E7%A5%AD%E3%82%84%E3%82%A4%E3%83%99%E3%83%B3%E3%83%88/4%E6%9C%88 Error from line 158 of /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/extensions/Breadcrumb.php: Call to undefined method User::getSkin()
Backtrace:
#0 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/extensions/Breadcrumb.php(64): BreadcrumbLinks(array, Title)
#1 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/includes/Setup.php(855): setupBreadcrumb()
#2 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/includes/WebStart.php(114): require_once(string)
#3 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/index.php(55): require(string)
#4 {main}
This error seems to happen all the sub pages which contains slash mark ("/") on the title (Such as "Tokyo/Chiyoda").
In addition, I couldn't write on your talk page, because it is totally protected (That's why I wrote my message here) Shoestring (talk) 08:14, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
Hey Shoestring!
Thanks for bringing this to our attention! I'm sending a report for you right now. Apologies that you couldn't talk on my talk page (you should be able to now). Will be moving our messages over there. Please keep me posted with any other issues. I plan to check on the Japan page today to see if I come across anything and will talk to you there. Thanks again! IB hill (talk) 13:20, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
Oh and also if you can let me know what device and browser you're using. That'll be much appreciated! IB hill (talk) 13:25, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
It should be working now! Please let me know if there's anything else JA WT needs. Thanks for letting us know! IB hill (talk) 18:23, 12 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Traveller of the Month[edit]

I do note that the Traveller of the Month page is defective. I did try to post this on the edit page there, but it will not allow me. Although it is an old page, maybe you can either correct it or delete it. Obviously I would prefer the former, as I use it to prove to people that it is a totally credible website. Your call..................

Avemario (talk) 04:02, 14 April 2018 (EDT)

I might add that the Thai Phrasebook has a similar problem!

Avemario (talk) 08:08, 16 April 2018 (EDT)

Hi Avemario, thanks for letting us know! The Traveller of the Month September 2015 - Avemario page can only be edited by admin, the page is protected. Is there anything you wanted to have changed? The Thai phrasebook seems ok to me, I can edit it, can you get in at all or just not save your edit? Adzas (talk) 11:02, 16 April 2018 (EDT)
Hey Avemario! Wanted to introduce myself as one of the newer admins and jump in to this thread. Seems like Adzas beat me to answering your questions! Please let us know what you would like to correct or change for your Traveller of the Month September 2015 - Avemario page. I can also correct the Thai phrasebook as well. We also had a software upgrade last week and have been running QA. However, there may still be little bugs that pop out. If you notice anything, please feel free to reach out and let us know the issue + browser & operating system you're using! IB hill (talk) 12:00, 16 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Hillary, the banner on the Traveller of the month page is extending at the bottom to cover the text. Also, it is time we re-started the Traveller of the Month back up again -- and maybe rename it Wikitraveller of the month? IBobi (talk) 20:04, 16 April 2018 (EDT)
Hi!
Thanx for your answers, both Adzas (who I know already), and IB hill.
I am using Firefox on a laptop computer.
The problem is that, with the "Traveller of the Month", the discussion start is up under the pic!
What I can read starts with "our gratitude by featuring them........"
With the Thai Phrasebook, everything can be read, but the writing is scrunched up against the pic.
I have checked a few other Thai Province websites, but they are normal.
So I leave it up to you to sort this out.
Avemario (talk) 06:28, 17 April 2018 (EDT)
Hey AveMario! Gotcha. I submitted a report for you just now and hopefully we will get that fixed for you quickly! IB hill (talk) 11:58, 17 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Pages Currently Under Evaluation[edit]

Heads up that as of 4/18/18, we're currently putting pages about Khlong Lat Mayom Floating Market, Wat Chan, and Dusun Glondok under evaluation as we're working on determining if it adheres to the site's policies and guidelines and style. If anyone has any thoughts or know anything about these sights and destinations, please reply down below here. Would love to make this a collaborative effort on Wikitravel! IB hill (talk) 19:27, 18 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Hi! The first two of these three appear to be Thai, but I cannot find them on Wikitravel! The third is in Indonesia and I can find it. Can you please give me more info about these above two? If they are Thai, I should be able to resolve it.Avemario (talk) 03:48, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
I can´t find the first two mentioned articles, but my first thought would be that a market should not have its own article. It can be described in the article of where it is located. Dusun Glondok I can´t find much information about online, it seems to be a little village? The writer of the article should specify where exactly it is and if there are any tourist attractions so more information can be added or rewritten. Adzas (talk) 09:48, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
update - I found the floating market info, on Tamonwan user page. I removed the first paragraph as this was copied from another website and I removed the external links for now. For the rest I would move the original info to a location article and then remove it from the user page. Adzas (talk) 09:57, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
Hello hello! I realized I left my computer without adding the pages. The Thai content about Khlong Lat Mayom Floating Market and Wat Chan are posted on Tamonwan user page and on Jeechnps user page. I'm curious to know what you guys think about the content and how we could better blend the info with the site. Seems like you're a Thai expert, Avemario! If you get the chance, maybe you can check it out? IB hill (talk) 11:55, 19 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
OK............
The Floating Market is in Thonburi in Bangkok,and is already listed there. I have updated the opening hours, but (personally) I do not ::::think that we need all the info that the Tamonwan page provides.
After all, do we need a travel website, or a multi page book for each destination?
I think that too much info on a place tends to be a distraction from the rest of the area. As it is, if someone wants to go there, if they ::::are in a hotel nearby, or go to a Travel Agent, they will get all the detailed stuff and can make their choice.
We do not need Wikitravel "overcrowded".
And the same with Wat Chan,which is a Buddhist Temple (Wat) in Ban Chan (Chan Town)
This is in Chiang Mai Province, some 150Km North West towards Pai (which is on Wikitravel).
Chiang Mai has many attractions, and we need again to be careful we do not make the attraction into a book!
It seems from what I can read online that this place has only one decent hotel, run by Karen (Christian refugees from Myanmar, so it is an ::::out of the way place to get involved in this culture. There is transport to here from Chiang Mai in yellow songteows apparently (2 bench ::::pickup trucks).
It seems that there are also minibuses from both Chiang Mai, and Pai.
I would be inclined to only put a short article on the Chiang Mai website, just describing what it is, that there is a hotel, and how to ::::get there.Avemario (talk) 06:41, 20 April 2018 (EDT)
Hey Avemario! Appreciate you taking the time to have a deeper look and thanks for adding the floating market in Thonburi on the Bangkok/Thonburi page. And completely agree with your suggestions. I'll have a look on their pages again and see what I can do. Thanks! IB hill (talk) 12:04, 20 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Above is very helpful, great as always Avemario! I do think it is important to find out why those users are adding all this info on their user pages. As mentioned, we have had school projects before, we used to let them work on their user pages as long as all that info is moved or removed in a short period of time, either to an existing article or a new article. If the users in question don´t communicate with us and the info is not according to our guidelines (either an article already exists or the info does not justify an article etc) we should move/remove it as soon as possible. As the Travellers Pub still does not seem to appear in Recent Changes, new users may not see our discussion, so we should check on their talk pages (the messages I left so far no reaction yet as far as I can see). Great though, I´ve learnt a lot about those locations in the past days, that´s what it is all about I think. Adzas (talk) 06:34, 21 April 2018 (EDT)

Nong Prue[edit]

I have noticed an article about this place in Kanchanaburi Province in Thailand. The information is minimal, and a VERY thorough check of the internet shows virtually no information at all worthy of tourists.Personally, I would delete the article.Avemario (talk) 06:53, 21 April 2018 (EDT)

And I just had a really serious look at it,and found virtually nothing at all on the internet, other that there is also a Nong Prue in Pattaya. :I still think it needs deleting - there is little info justifying moving it to the Kanchanaburi page.Avemario (talk) 07:59, 22 April 2018 (EDT)
And as much as I hate being the pain in the arse which I am - I just noticed an article on Jom Jang, which is in Nong Khai Province in ::Thailand.There is virtually no info in this article, which was added many years ago, and it is only a few Km from Nong Khai City.I think it ::should be deleted, and the info moved to the Nong Khai page.Avemario (talk) 06:18, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
And yet again......................... Ban Rong in Lamphang Province has absolutely no info about the place. So why not remove it Avemario (talk) 07:04, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
Once more................ Ban Muang Kut is a place put in by advertisers who want to promote the place. Not wanted on Wikitravel.
The trip should be a place to go on the Chiang Mai page. Avemario (talk) 07:04, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
Hey Avemario! Thanks for bringing this up- truly appreciate your Thai knowledge! I will have a look over it and see if there's a place for all the articles you just mentioned. If anyone else has any suggestions, please post it here!IB hill (talk) 12:13, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
We always say that any location that can be visited by a traveller, no matter how remote, can be listed here. Jom Jang for example, maybe a small place but the article does have some content, for the off the beaten path traveller maybe worth to visit after reading the little information that we have there. It is even mentioned in the Nong Khai article. I would leave this for sure. Ban Rong I can´t find an article for. Completely empty articles I would remove yes, but other places maybe we can promote on the Main Page, ask for help so editors who know the location can add info. The smallest unknown places can be the most beautiful or interesting places to explore. Adzas (talk) 10:04, 24 April 2018 (EDT)
Hi Adzas!
Thanx for your feedback!
But I still stick by with what I have written. I have never heard of any of these places I posted until I did a detailed search (and I know that I can find many more similar ones - I just did not want to overload!)And as you are aware, I know Thailand thoroughly, having visited virtually every Province! (and still do to keep things up to date)
If I (or most other persons want to see what is in Thailand, we visit the Provincial City page - after all, the Capital of the Province has the same name as the Province. And we read the "do" or other pages.
If the destination is "big" as Hua Hin is in Prachuap Khiri Khan Province, and Koh Samui in Surat Thani Province, then of course they need a separate article.
But these small places need to be in the Provincial (City) article I think, as many more people will get to read about them.
And Muang Kut, which is an elephant place should really be moved to Chiang Mai, as there are several elephant places already there.
And also, I now cannot find Ban Rong. Maybe Management removed it, but it is not in the Province page. Avemario (talk) 03:54, 25 April 2018 (EDT)
Hello again! Apologies for the delayed response about this- I got tied up and just got to looking over this. Totally understand your point, Avemario. It was the same for me when I did a search about these places- there wasn't too much info and I had to do some serious digging. For Ban Muang Kut, I agree it should be moved to Chiang Mai as the information on that page can easily be added in the "Do" section and "Elephants". As for Jom Jang and Nong Prue, I feel like there's a bit of a grey area with these place even though they are significantly a lot smaller. For Jom Jang, the village has a uniqueness with its population being mostly local women farmers and community project. For Nong Prue, I'm torn between just adding the information to the Kanchanaburi page or leave it as it's own because it quite a distance away from the province and it could have some potential. But you're right about how the information is too minimal. I also can't find Ban Rong either so I'm not sure if that page got deleted. Love these discussions! IB hill (talk) 16:49, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
And once more................ Hellfire Pass is 72Km out of Kanchanaburi, Srinakarin Dam is 54Km, and these are just two places distant from Kanchanaburi City which are listed in the Kanchanaburi article. Nong Prue is quite close to Srinakarin Dam. (Do not confuse it with the Nong Prue in Pattaya (Chon Buri Province), which is some 250Km to the south)

So again, I think it should be moved.Avemario (talk) 19:10, 26 April 2018 (EDT)

(and again, remember that the name of the Province is the same as that of the Capital City of the Province, so these places above are within Kanchanaburi Province!(same as England, where the Capital of Derbyshire is Derby, of Yorkshire is York etc).Avemario (talk) 05:48, 27 April 2018 (EDT)

Vote for May 2018 Homepage![edit]

Hey guys! This April will be coming to an end in 4 days... whoa! That means it's time to vote for the next feature on our homepage for May! This month we featured Botswana as "Destination Of The Month" with a huge emphasis on Greek for all the other categories. What do you guys want to see? Let us know by commenting down below! IB hill (talk) 16:19, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

A location in Japan where you can see the beautiful blossom, like Binbin suggested last month. For the rest let me think a bit more. Adzas (talk) 09:43, 27 April 2018 (EDT)
Bora Bora! Just because I have been there long time ago and it is true paradise, blue waters, soft sand, coconut trees etc... Adzas (talk) 04:17, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
Ooh Bora Bora sounds lovely! Maybe that can be the "Destination Of The Month" as a precursor to summer with an emphasis on Japan culture for the other categories? IB hill (talk) 16:59, 30 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Traditionally, we should be using destinations that will be popular places to travel in the months after when they are posted, so that people who are planning trips can make use of them. So, we should put Japanese cherry blossoms (which happen in April) on the DOTM in, say, January, if we can. It is useful to think ahead as far as what people are planning 3-4 months out. Right now I would think about late summer and fall travel. IBobi (talk) 17:05, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
yes, you´re right, I thought the blossom could still be seen in May but that´s not the case. Brasil is a nice location for summer holidays. Landmark: the statue in Rio (Christ the Redeemer). Adzas (talk) 18:36, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
we should be using destinations that will be popular places to travel in the months after when they are posted... Then we should think about Russia: the FIFA World Cup is taking place over there between June and July. Brazil is another good option as well as other south american places (maybe Uruguay as OTBP?). GiulioC (talk) 02:38, 1 May 2018 (EDT)
Great point Giulio! Time to start working on our World Cup article again soon too! Let´s learn some Russian then as language of the month! Adzas (talk) 05:02, 1 May 2018 (EDT)
I vote for Igbo as "Language of the month" 98.158.206.105 12:24, 1 May 2018 (EDT)IBJoel
Wow! Lots of great suggestions guys! Maybe Bora Bora for Destination of the Month, Christ the Redeemer as Landmark, Uruguay as OTBP, French Polynesia as Cuisine Of The Month, Igbo for Language Of The Month. Thanks guys! IB hill (talk) 15:32, 1 May 2018 (EDT)IB_hill
Homepage has been updated! Thanks for voting everyone! IB hill (talk) 11:18, 2 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

GDPR Compliance Announcement[edit]

Hi everyone!

Starting on or before May 25th, 2018, Wikitravel will become GDPR compliant in accordance with the EU GDPR regulation.

If you are visiting this forum from an EU IP address, you will see a pop-up overlay that looks like this:

GDPR Notice from IB

After clicking "I Agree," this message should not appear again (unless you clear your browser cookies). You can learn more about this on this page. Thank you. IB hill (talk) 14:32, 21 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Slow servers?[edit]

My impression is that this site loads slowly. Have you had server issues? /Burbur (talk) 16:26, 21 May 2018 (EDT)

Hey Burbur! Not that I know of but I can go check that for you. Can you please let me know what operating system and browser you're using so I can investigate? Thanks! IB hill (talk) 16:48, 21 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
I use Windows 10 and Mozilla Firefox. /Burbur (talk) 19:09, 31 May 2018 (EDT)
Can you give us some more details with your user experience? What issues you think is going on with the server? IB hill (talk) 19:18, 31 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Seems to be fine now. SelfieCity (talk) 16:42, 9 June 2018 (EDT)

Vote for June 2018 Homepage![edit]

Still some time left, before today´s changes. The World Cup 2018 article is ready to go, anyone else getting excited for the upcoming event? As language of the Month Russian would be a great help I guess, for those making it over to Russia, but also because it´s such an interesting language to learn (yes, I made an attempt many years ago). Landmark of the Month, the Church of the Saviour on Spilled Blood in St. Petersburg. For Off the Beaten Path I´m going to think a bit more. Adzas (talk) 05:00, 1 June 2018 (EDT)

Sounds like a great idea Adzas! Will update by end of today. Does anyone else have any other preferences or thoughts? IB hill (talk) 14:42, 4 June 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Homepage has been updated! IB hill (talk) 10:47, 7 June 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
By the way, IB hill, if you write the four tildes, you do not need to write your username, because the system automatically replaces the tildes with your username. SelfieCity (talk) 16:54, 9 June 2018 (EDT)

Travel guide block[edit]

I know and understand why Wikitravellers are not allowed to use the name of a competing travel guide on this website. For example, I'd like to say that I'm mainly a contributor to Wiki but am now signed up on Wikitravel as well. Any thoughts? Just asking, I don't mind if you don't want to change. SelfieCity (talk) 16:28, 9 June 2018 (EDT)

Also, I'd look forward to becoming a regular contributor to WT. SelfieCity (talk) 21:04, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
Welcome! We would love for your to contribute more here :) But we do not allow references to 3rd party travel guides, sorry. IBobi (talk) 13:28, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
Thank you for your response. SelfieCity (talk) 18:17, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
Why is that? /Burbur (talk) 17:30, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
Hey Burbur! You can have a read here to better answer your question. IB hill (talk) 17:50, 12 June 2018 (EDT)

Longtime Wiki policy to ensure that Wikitravel remains a primary source, for travelers, by travelers, and not a link farm. Experience has shown that once you start allowing references to one guide, everyone thinks they can link whatever they want. So we just say no references or links to other travel guides, and it has worked out very nicely. IBobi (talk) 17:51, 12 June 2018 (EDT)

Vote for the July 2018 Homepage![edit]

I know it's really early, but it's better to start the nominating process early than to start late, so I think we may as well start now. I nominate the following with the idea of a Southwest theme:

  • Landmark of the Month: not sure
  • Cuisine of the Month: not sure

What do the others think? SelfieCity (talk) 23:14, 9 June 2018 (EDT)

Thanks for submitting your suggestions! We'll definitely circle back to this when the time gets closer. :) IB hill (talk) 18:19, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
Grand Canyon is a good landmark candidate. /Burbur (talk) 17:31, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
Thanks for submitting your votes early! Can't believe the first month of summer flew by fast. Please share your thoughts for what our homepage in July should be. Would love to get everyone's opinions! :) IB hill (talk) 13:15, 29 June 2018 (EDT)
What about a location in New England to prepare for autumn (I know, summer goes way too fast!), like Vermont? OBP somewhere in Alaska, Landmark of the Month: Chief Johnson Totem Pole in Ketchikan. Lovely memories...
I like the Grand Canyon as landmark and I too think that an autumn location where you can enjoy foliage would be great (New England or Japan). GiulioC (talk) 04:18, 30 June 2018 (EDT)
A location in New England or Japan will definitely be great. Speaking of autumn location, Jiuzhaigou would be great too: great views, rich colors, cool weather. Planning another trip :-).
Jiuzhaigou sounds like an amazing location, would be great to feature that! Adzas (talk) 04:58, 1 July 2018 (EDT)
All sound like great ideas! Maybe we can push the autumn idea to next month and do the Southwest theme that has been suggested for July? Also think it's a good idea to add Grand Canyon as Landmark of the Month. For Cuisine Of The Month, I think talking about New Mexico will be cool to top off the Southwest theme altogether. We can definitely revisit the autumn idea next month when the season gets closer and enjoy summer. :) IB hill (talk) 14:38, 2 July 2018 (EDT)

Updated DOTM and VFD pages[edit]

Those pages were out of date, so I have been archiving old nominations and bringing it all up-to-date. Just wanted the administrators and other editors to know this and that I'm not trying to cause problems. SelfieCity (talk) 22:37, 17 July 2018 (EDT)

Thanks for bringing this to our attention. I'll take a closer look when I get a chance. IB hill (talk) 10:06, 18 July 2018 (EDT)
By the way, the information there about having the schedule go on for six months (which of course we don't do anymore) was not something I wrote, that was written many years ago when the website was set up, I think. SelfieCity (talk) 19:22, 5 August 2018 (EDT)

Vote for Aug 2018 Homepage[edit]

August is coming up in just a few days. Anyone have suggestions on what should be on the homepage? Comment below down here!IB hill (talkcontribs)

Hey, last month we were talking about a location for autumn and a few names came up (Vermont, New England, Japan, Jiuzhaigou). All of these (maybe someone here knows more specific locations in the US and Japan) could be DOM. GiulioC (talk) 03:43, 28 July 2018 (EDT)
I agree with Giulio, a nice autumn location would be great. Depending on what we choose we can base the food, landmark, language on that too! Adzas (talk) 14:40, 28 July 2018 (EDT)
A location for autumn sounds great! For food, isn't autumn best for sea food? Language can be decided after that. --Binbin (talk) 01:39, 29 July 2018 (EDT)
All great suggestions! Maybe we can do either Japan or Jiuzhaigou since we did a US destination for last month. Jiuzhaigou might be a more interesting choice as some people might not know too much about it! —The preceding comment was added by IB hill (talkcontribs)
I think Japan sounds excellent for next month's theme when you consider how Japan has its own cuisine, language, and surely plenty of landmarks (such as Samurai-type forts with Japanese architecture) and of course Mt. Fuji. Probably better climate for the time of year than the Southwest in July, as well (although the elevation of somewhere like the rim of the Grand Canyon brings the temperature to a reasonable level). SelfieCity (talk) 13:00, 30 July 2018 (EDT)
I love the idea of Japan. Plenty of good leaf viewing there in fall. IBobi (talk) 14:26, 30 July 2018 (EDT)
Ok! Let's do Japan then and stick with that theme where we can have cuisine and language be Japanese. Does anyone have any suggestions for OTBP? Maybe we can do one of the islands such as Hokkaido or Kyushu? IB hill (talk) 12:49, 31 July 2018 (EDT)
Talking about Hokkaido, while I was on that article I noticed a picture of the "Goko Five Lakes" in Shiretoko National Park, a national park on Hokkaido Island. Shiretoko Park is a usable article, so it seems like a good OTBP possibility except for the bears that live there, which are of course going to be a danger. SelfieCity (talk) 13:04, 31 July 2018 (EDT)
I just want to go to Japan now! I also started to read about the National Parks in the Hokkaido article, maybe to narrow it down a little for OBP we should pick one of those articles? Bears, sounds exciting! Adzas (talk) 16:29, 31 July 2018 (EDT)
Ooh, let's do that then. Thanks guys! IB hill (talk) 18:24, 31 July 2018 (EDT)
The Shiretoko National Park looks great! It'd be a good OTBP! GiulioC (talk) 03:15, 1 August 2018 (EDT)


Vote for Sept 2018 Homepage[edit]

The last month of summer is officially halfway over! This means it's a good time to start thinking what we want to see on the homepage for the first month of fall. If anyone has suggestions, please comment below! :) IB hill (talk) 10:54, 16 August 2018 (EDT)

In response to IB hill, I think a New England theme would work well. -- Selfie City (talk) 15:44, 21 August 2018 (EDT)
Thanks SelfieCity for sharing your thoughts! IB hill (talk) 14:29, 22 August 2018 (EDT)
I think Hartford would probably be a good DOTM, and Burlington for OTBP are definitely possibilities, since they are at usable status and have quite a lot of content. For a landmark, the United States side of the Niagara Falls looks like a pretty good article, and has 2 static maps. I'm not so sure about cuisine of the month or language of the month, although since French can be found close to New England in southern Canada, perhaps French would be a good choice.
At some point in the near future I might take a look at my DOTM and OTBP selections and make formatting-type edits where needed, so the articles look good when they're featured. -- Selfie City (talk) 14:02, 22 August 2018 (EDT)
I was actually thinking about another autumn location, since last month we were discussing between New England and Japan (and we ended up choosing the latter) this time we could choose New England. I don't know Hartford nor Burlington as suggested by Selfie City, so to me they're both good. GiulioC (talk) 04:59, 23 August 2018 (EDT)
Yes, I was suggesting Hartford and Burlington in line with the New England theme. -- Selfie City (talk) 14:53, 23 August 2018 (EDT)
So I've done some work on the Hartford and Burlington articles. Here's Hartford before my recent edits [2] and here's how it looks as of this comment [3]. Mostly just formatting fixes, etc., but every little bit helps.
Then on the Burlington article, it looked like this [4] and as of this comment it looks like this [5]. Again, pretty insignificant changes on the surface. Just wanted to let others know when considering what to feature next month that these are now formatted quite well. -- Selfie City (talk) 14:21, 24 August 2018 (EDT)
What about Sighisoara as OBP, or Transylvania in general, a great Halloween destination to visit the said birthplace of Dracula. Or Bran with as landmark of the month Bran Castle. Just to get into the mysterious mood of Halloween..... Adzas (talk) 04:29, 30 August 2018 (EDT)
We're going into September, not October, though. -- Selfie City (talk) 22:10, 27 August 2018 (EDT)
Correct Selfie City (talk) but we always try to plan ahead a few months with our articles so travellers can still book accordingly. Adzas (talk) 03:59, 28 August 2018 (EDT)
Transylvania! I like it! GiulioC (talk) 03:21, 30 August 2018 (EDT)
Hey guys! Thanks for your input for September's DOTM and OTBP. I'll go ahead and put Hartford and Burlington on the calendar. We can save Sigisoara and Transylavnia for October. :) IB hill (talk) 16:21, 30 August 2018 (EDT)

Question about Main Page[edit]

Hi! I am new here as an editor, though I have been reading this website for years and I have just looked at the main page. The strange thing is that I see it full-size, but it fits the left half of my computer screen. Is there any way to change the resolution of the main page to fit individual screens? --Fordaemdur (talk) 10:31, 21 August 2018 (EDT)

Fordaemdur, not sure what might be the issue but can you please let us know what browser and operating system you're using? Also, please send over any screen shots that may help our tech team look into the situation to admin(dot)wikitravel.com. Thanks! IB hill (talk) 10:12, 22 August 2018 (EDT)

Hyphen/dash formatting[edit]

Just wanted to check, since I couldn't find this in Wikitravel policy: it's considered best to use an mdash (that is, "—") instead of "-" or "--", right? Just wanted to check because I have been changing hyphens to mdahes in a couple articles. For example, see this link [6] to see what I mean by this. -- Selfie City (talk) 15:17, 22 August 2018 (EDT)

Hey Selfie City! So sorry for the delayed response... I thought I replied! I think your judgement is correct as I took a look at some of our star articles and they all have "&mdash". I'm assuming people might have forgotten about the style over time but it's always good to bring it back :) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by IB hill (talkcontribs)
Thanks. It's not the biggest formatting issue in the world but still one that I'll do in future for articles that are DOTMs, etc. -- Selfie City (talk) 11:54, 29 August 2018 (EDT)

Technical Issues with logging in[edit]

Hi everyone. There is a current issue with users not being able to log in. Just wanted to announce that we are well aware of it and will take care of it ASAP. Apologies for any inconveniences. 98.158.206.108 09:47, 23 August 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

The issue has been fixed. Thanks for your patience! IB hill (talk) 13:55, 23 August 2018 (EDT)
I never even had a problem! :) Thanks for mentioning this anyway, though. -- Selfie City (talk) 14:53, 23 August 2018 (EDT)

Main page overlap[edit]

I've noticed for quite a while now that the travel news, phrasebook/picture of the month, and the DOTM slideshow all overlap over each other. I should have mentioned this earlier. -- Selfie City (talk) 12:40, 31 August 2018 (EDT)

Hey Selfie City!
We are well aware of this issue and have been in contact with the tech team to work on it. Can you let me know what browser and operating :system you're using? For my computer, it's only the "Language Of the Month" picture bleeding into the "Destination of the Month". IB hill (talk) 12:52, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
I'm using Chrome as the browser and Windows 10. -- Selfie City (talk) 13:11, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
Hmm good to know. If you can, please send over screenshots to [email protected](dot)com. Would appreciate if I can get a better understanding of what you're seeing. Thanks! IB hill (talk) 13:14, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
Could I perhaps upload the screenshot to this website? -- Selfie City (talk) 15:41, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
I'm also using Chrome and Windows 10 but I don't see anything unusual on my screen? Adzas (talk) 05:37, 1 September 2018 (EDT)

Vote for October 2018 Homepage[edit]

Halloween month is less than two weeks away! We had Sighisoara, Transylvania, and Bran mentioned already. Does anyone have any other suggestions they want to see on the homepage for October 2018? IB hill (talk) 18:00, 18 September 2018 (EDT)

I think these are really good options! But I'll think about some other places just to have some more ideas... if we want to have some weird, eerie place for Halloween, have you ever heard about the "Park of the monsters" in Bomarzo, Italy? GiulioC (talk) 04:00, 20 September 2018 (EDT)
I still like the idea of Transylvania. Maybe the Castle in Bran as the Landmark of the month, and Giulio's “Park of monsters” sounds like a great OBP destination, it is something new, I’ve never heard of it. Adzas (talk) 03:52, 21 September 2018 (EDT)
In all, there are about six different ones, right? There’s also cuisine and language. Apart from pumpkins, I can’t think of much related to October 31 in those fields. So what should we do with those? -- Selfie City (talk) 14:38, 22 September 2018 (EDT)
Those place are all very nice, but I still hope to see Jiuzhaigou [7], maybe as the OBP of this month? I've been there in an October holiday. Really nice at this time of the year, the view, the weather. Enjoy this beautiful season! Cheers! --Binbin (talk) 23:52, 22 September 2018 (EDT)