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Please add new questions '''at the bottom''' of the page and sign your post by appending four tildes (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>) to it, but otherwise [[Wikitravel:plunge forward|plunge forward]]!
 
Please add new questions '''at the bottom''' of the page and sign your post by appending four tildes (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>) to it, but otherwise [[Wikitravel:plunge forward|plunge forward]]!
  
You can find Archived discussions here: '''[[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/Archives|Travellers´pub Archives]]'''
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You can find Archived discussions here: '''[[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/Archives|Travellers´pub Archives]]'''.
  
 
{{disclaimerbox|*If you have a question or suggestion about a ''particular'' article, try [[Wikitravel:using talk pages|using talk pages]] to keep the discussion specific to ''that'' article.
 
{{disclaimerbox|*If you have a question or suggestion about a ''particular'' article, try [[Wikitravel:using talk pages|using talk pages]] to keep the discussion specific to ''that'' article.
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[[fr:Wikitravel:Café des Voyageurs]]
 
[[fr:Wikitravel:Café des Voyageurs]]
 
[[he:ויקיטיול:דלפק ייעוץ]]
 
[[he:ויקיטיול:דלפק ייעוץ]]
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[[hi:विकिट्रैवल:यात्री भवन]]
 
[[hi:विकिट्रैवल:यात्री भवन]]
 
[[hu:Wikitravel:Kocsmafal]]
 
[[hu:Wikitravel:Kocsmafal]]
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[[zh:Wikitravel:旅行者茶馆]]
 
[[zh:Wikitravel:旅行者茶馆]]
 
[[wts:Wikitravel Shared:Travellers' pub]]
 
[[wts:Wikitravel Shared:Travellers' pub]]
 
== Headings ==
 
 
I am brand new to Wiki and created ny page, then somehow my headings lost their se parathion a and all but the first too be ame on line!  I tried pasting in headings from a different site but nothing works!. They are all in a block! I have also lost the Add Listing button?  [[User:Arlingham|Arlingham]] ([[User talk:Arlingham|talk]]) 19:02, 9 January 2017 (EST)
 
 
:Hello and welcome to Wikitravel!  I currently don't see anything on your userpage.  Could you provide more details as to what specific page you are trying to edit? [[User:Tyen|Tyen]] ([[User talk:Tyen|talk]]) 19:05, 9 January 2017 (EST)
 
 
M page is Arly but I don't think I have puny it yet I somehow lost all the indentation and had to change the headings to make sense but need to format but can't wo ou what to do?I am having trouble replying as I am using an iPhone and can't see what I am writing!  Y page title is Arlingham! [[User:Arlingham|Arlingham]] ([[User talk:Arlingham|talk]]) 19:24, 9 January 2017 (EST)
 
:'''[[Arlingham]]''' I fixed it for you. Some of the headings are still non-standard but they are correctly formatted. Thanks for your additions--I know that typing on those things is a real bear. [[User:Koavf|Koavf]] ([[User talk:Koavf|talk]]) 19:48, 9 January 2017 (EST)
 
 
Hello. I'm new to editing Wikitravel. I added a new city, McHenry, Illinois, but now see that there's a empty link under the Chicagoland tab for there. I don't know how to move my page to there.[[User:Damelon|Damelon]] ([[User talk:Damelon|talk]]) 09:07, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
 
 
:Hi, I have changed your article name, so you can now find it under [[McHenry (Illinois)]]. Happy editing! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 10:31, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
 
  
 
== Business Listings: How Much is too Much? ==
 
== Business Listings: How Much is too Much? ==
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: I agree. In principle, listing on multiple pages is not allowed , except where similar choices are limited and/or there're none or only a few similar listings (we do have this "something is better than nothing" policy). Yes, a prior communication with the companies who want to put their listings on multiple page sounds even better so that on one hand they can do it properly with our help, on the other we can kind of make sure things don't go out of control. I think we can start with this bus operator in NZ. What do you guys think?  --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 01:40, 23 March 2017 (EDT)
 
: I agree. In principle, listing on multiple pages is not allowed , except where similar choices are limited and/or there're none or only a few similar listings (we do have this "something is better than nothing" policy). Yes, a prior communication with the companies who want to put their listings on multiple page sounds even better so that on one hand they can do it properly with our help, on the other we can kind of make sure things don't go out of control. I think we can start with this bus operator in NZ. What do you guys think?  --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 01:40, 23 March 2017 (EDT)
  
==Watchlist==
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== Map Based wikitravel ==
Hello, for a month or so i've been pressing the star shaped sign in pages i liked, and now i can find how to access them. how can i see it? (Asked by Nir6668 at 21:47, 1 April 2017).
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:The star shaped sign (next to View History near the top right of the page) adds an article to your watchlist. You can see this by clicking on the link "Watchlist" at the top right of the page (when you are logged in). This will display a list of any of the pages in your watchlist which have been edited in the past few days - the number of days can be changed on the watchlist tab of Preferences. You can also set things so that every page that you edit is automatically added to your watchlist, and you can choose to get an email when a page on your watchlist is changed. [[User:AlasdairW|AlasdairW]] ([[User talk:AlasdairW|talk]]) 19:12, 1 April 2017 (EDT)
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Hello!
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I wish to introduce a map based wikitravelish website impressionmap.org
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I'm an avid reader and planned all trips based on info here. A big thanks first! However, articles are organized by meaningless place names (it's the only choice though), and it's not straightforward to figure out which place is where. Thus, planning bigger trips involves going back and forth between here and Google Maps, taking a long time.
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It may be better to organize info by map itself and attach it to the map as snippets which will appear or disappear based on zoom level. More info and links can be added as popups. So I made the aforementioned website. You can zoom in to Amherst, MA or NYC (worse option as not much info is added) to see how it works. By the way, the website doesn't seem to work on IE and renders a bit ugly on browsers released before March 2017
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Asking for advice and opinions! If you would, edit it as well!
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Hopefully this is the right place to do such introduction. No bad intention, just wish to make travel info presentation more intuitive and trip planning easier
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[[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] ([[User talk:Wkenmomo|talk]]) 14:16, 1 June 2017 (EDT)
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: Sorry for such a late response! We appreciate your time spent on Wikitravel -- especially for adding edits to the Liaocheng page. We hope to see more thoughtful edits like the ones you have provided. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 01:50, 06 June 2017 (PST)
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:: Hey [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]]! I finally got a chance to check out the website you had created, and I think its pretty cool! I like that it sums up exactly where I may want to travel if I want to shop, or find out more about American history! I was wondering -- and you kind of explained already-- but your purpose for creating a map that works as so? How would this help benefit Wikitravel users? Thanks! --[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 012:39, 07 June 2017 (PST)
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::: Hey [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]], sorry for the late reply. Why I create it is that I want a more direct way of accessing geo info. I used to read here, search on Google Map, write what it is about and save it in my maps to compare with others. A great hassle and Google maps aren't designed for this. My purpose is to make designing "optimized" trips easier and I really hope to plan my next trip to Canada intuitively and effortlessly. Do wikitravel need a dynamic map? Wikitravel is welcome to host this map and embed it to the right zoom and boundary. The map is itself editable.[[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] ([[User talk:Wkenmomo|talk]]) 13:45, 10 June 2017 (EDT)
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::::[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]], [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] I think it would be a great idea to include links to Wikimapia. I'm working on US Hwy 2 between Monroe and Stephens Pass.  Here is an example of what you get for [[Skykomish_(Washington)]] [http://wikimapia.org/#lang=en&lat=47.710000&lon=-121.360000&z=13&m=b&search=Skykomish].  We could actually provide links to WikiTravel on the WikiMapia page.  Ideas? [[User:Kgrr|Kgrr]] ([[User talk:Kgrr|talk]]) 08:46, 9 July 2017 (EDT)
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== Added section ==
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Homosexuality is illegal in India under a colonial-era law (Section 377) dating back to 1860 that criminalize sodomy with penalties of Homosexuality is illegal in India under a colonial-era law (Section 377) dating back to 1860 that has sentences of life imprisonment, fines, beatings and viligante executions. The law has been used to harass the LGBT community and to force them into hiding. Police officers have harassed, extorted and blackmailed, beat, and turned a blind eye to violence towards homosexuals and transexuals in India. Businessess and public accomodations are not LGBT-friendly and will deny you. LGBT are emphatically discouraged from visiting.  <small>—The [[Project:Using_talk_pages#Talk_page_formatting|preceding]] comment was added by [[User: 2600:1:f102:19e1:c03:aa02:d96d:bb58|2600:1:f102:19e1:c03:aa02:d96d:bb58]] ([[User_talk: 2600:1:f102:19e1:c03:aa02:d96d:bb58|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/2600:1:f102:19e1:c03:aa02:d96d:bb58|contribs]]) </small>
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: Hi, thank you for your recent contributions. But for your disputes with other users, I have to say I prefer current wording about LGBT which is in a more neutral tone. Yes, India is, compared to many western countries, of a more conservative view about LGBT, but progresses have been made with the ruling from the Supreme Court about LGBT rights and increased awareness. From what my understanding, LGBT people have gained wider acceptance in India over the years. So I think like many other sensitive issues, we should stay to facts and refrain from exaggerating any one-sided views. Plus, personally, as a foreigner who's visited India quite a few times I find general Indians very friendly and welcoming, and I think as long as one uses common sense and not publicly display intimacy when visiting India, they won't face any problems. Would love to hear more comments about this though.      --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 05:37, 6 January 2018 (EST)
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::I agree with Binbin, in our articles and also in our discussions we always try to remain neutral. This is a travel site, no need to go into laws and politics, as long as a traveler has a good idea what to expect. Looking at further articles online, wasn´t there a historic ruling from India’s Supreme Court in August 2017 confirming the right of the country’s LGBT people to express their sexuality without discrimination? Let´s avoid an [[Wikitravel:Edit war|edit war]] in the article, it´s good to discuss these things here before continuously editing the article, lets see what the input is from others here on the site. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 06:20, 6 January 2018 (EST)
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:::This does, as [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] pointed out, appear to be a classic [[Wikitravel:Edit war|edit war]] on the [[India]] page. Since there are 2 IP addresses and no actual WT user accounts involved, it may not be possible to mediate or resolve in a mutual way. In this case, I recommend that the Administrators huddle up and decide what to do; it may be that one editor is pushing an agenda -- if that is the case, I recommend a short ban of that IP to get the user's attention, along with a Talk Page (India) discussion of the issue. If the edit war continues afterward without participation in the discussion by the agenda-driven IP user, that IP should be blocked for 3 months. The page can also be protected for a short time if necessary. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 18:08, 8 January 2018 (EST)
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== Spam Blacklist ==
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Hello all, please take note of what links you are adding to the spam list. I've seen a couple links added that come from reputable sites/organizations.
  
==Tours listing==
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Anyways, thanks for the vigilance you all have shown in your patrolling, it makes life so much easier and it is very much appreciated! [[User:IBThomas|IBThomas]] ([[User talk:IBThomas|talk]]) 12:25, 17 January 2018 (EST)
how can i  list my tours business[[User:Eastland adventures|Eastland adventures]] ([[User talk:Eastland adventures|talk]]) 10:37, 4 April 2017 (EDT)
 
: Hey Eastland Adventures! You can list your tour business on the destination pages of the locations you service: consider viewing our rules on where to post in on either our [[Wikitravel:Activity listings]] or the [[Wikitravel:Where you can stick it]] page. Also, be sure to acknowledge our [[Wikitravel:Don't tout]] policy as well. [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 010:13, 5 April 2017 (PST)
 
  
::Hi, I have noticed that in Pune, heritage walk has been listed, even though it is also a walking tour, the policy should be uniformly applied on all, having said that I am not asking to turn down their listing. I appreciate the policy but it must modify with time, considering the practicality, wikitravel should understand that it is a self-guided tour platform and walking tours are guided tour platform, both are different and guided tours does not conflict with wikitravel because taking a walking tour does not restrict or encourage a person from using wikitravel any less, rather if a person explores a place on a walking tour that he has earlier seen listed on wikitravel, it provides him a reassurance of the quality and depth of wikitravel guides.Even lonely planet lists walking tours and so are all the other travel guide providers, it is a shame that with a fear of competition (which is actually not in reality) a portal like wiki travel is not passing on all the relevant information to the travelers about what and how to explore the city. For europe, walking tours have become very popular and so it is understandable that listing too many of such tours can actually confuse the travelers as to which one to use, but for developing nations like India, where the Indian people don't even know what are walking tours, listing the same would mean that a great deal to help travelers. A venture that i experienced recently called as Yo Tours is providing such great walking tours in india, which is highly appreciated by travelers and i tried to list those for different cities but the same has been removed. I believe case to assessment is necessary which even the tour listing policy suggests, it never says not to list walking tours. I would appreciate if i can get a solution for the same. <small>—The [[Project:Using_talk_pages#Talk_page_formatting|preceding]] comment was added by [[User: Ava2011|Ava2011]] ([[User_talk: Ava2011|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Ava2011|contribs]]) </small>
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== Help board ==
  
:::Hello, thank you for your input. As you can see in our policies, in general we don´t allow walking tours in our articles, see [[Wikitravel:Activity_listings|activity listings]]. When we check the latest edits and we see something that would be against those policies, we would remove it. It is correct that it could happen that other listings were previously added and gone unnoticed, but in general we do try to have a look at the existing listings as well to see what has slipped through overtime. But this is up to everyone who contributes to Wikitravel. If you still feel your tour would add value and needs to be included, then it should be discussed on the talk page of the article itself, see what feedback you get from other users. I hope this helps! Looking forward to further edits from you. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 11:10, 1 June 2017 (EDT)
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The Recent Changes for Hungarian is VERY backed up with spam. Any help in this department would be greatly appreciated.  
  
== Help ==
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It should also be noted that this section in the Traveler's Pub can be used as a help board of sorts, where others can ask for help, or offer their services. Hopefully this can facilitate more of a community where people can work together. [[User:IBThomas|IBThomas]] ([[User talk:IBThomas|talk]]) 17:00, 17 January 2018 (EST)
  
Hi! I tried to post a message at the Romanian Travellers' pub. Apparently, that page is protected from any edit. I also tried to talk to user {{user|Vlad}} who is an active administrator there. But it seems he had protected his own talk page from any edit. Is that normal to protect such pages and be unable to contact anyone there? Thank you, [[User:Wintereu|Wintereu]] ([[User talk:Wintereu|talk]]) 08:30, 9 April 2017 (EDT)
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:Just had a look, all clear for now, will keep an eye on that version too. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 04:41, 23 January 2018 (EST)
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::There are hundreds of spam pages at the Hungarian version - e.g. see https://wikitravel.org/wiki/hu/index.php?title=Speci%C3%A1lis:%C3%81rva_lapok&limit=500&offset=0 [[User:Nurg|Nurg]] ([[User talk:Nurg|talk]]) 07:29, 6 June 2018 (EDT)
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:::Hey [[User:Nurg|Nurg]]! Thanks for bringing this to our attention. We're on it. [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 11:04, 6 June 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
:Hello, thank you for your message. I don´t have an account on the Romanian site, but looking at it it has been inactive for quite some time (the travellers pub). I will check with corporate and see what the reason was for the protection of the page. Thanks for bringing this up. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 16:01, 9 April 2017 (EDT)
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==Please make suggestions for WT homepage content==
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Hello! We'd like Wikitravel users to help us decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for February by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Monday January 29th. We will announce the winning topics Tuesday the 30th. Thank you![[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 14:11, 22 January 2018 (EST)
  
:: As far as I can see, the Romanian Wikitravel appear to have been ''frozen in time'' ... [[User:Wintereu|Wintereu]] ([[User talk:Wintereu|talk]]) 13:32, 10 April 2017 (EDT)
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:For Destination of the Month, what about [[Mexico]], since the largest underwater cave was discovered there very recently? Interesting location for sure! Mexican cuisine is also nice. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 09:42, 23 January 2018 (EST)
  
::: Yep. As for my talk page, some time ago wikitravel was a target for SPAM bots, and that included my talk page. All I did was this: 23 noiembrie 2008 20:13‎ Vlad (Discuție | contribuții | blochează)‎ m . . (14.577 de octeți) (0)‎ . . (A protejat "Discuţie Utilizator:Vlad" [edit=autoconfirmed:move=sysop]) (anulare):  only autoconfirmed users may edit the talk page (and of course only admin can move it), but I admit that I haven't the slightest idea what autoconfirmed users mean in wikitravel's context. --[[User:Vlad|Vlad]] ([[User talk:Vlad|talk]]) 14:06, 10 April 2017 (EDT)
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::Maybe for "Off the Beaten Path" you could try Prachuap Khiri Khan in Thailand. This place is a paradise, and not at all expensive. Regrettably, more and more tourists are coming here, so go there before it becomes another Phuket or similar. [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 04:04, 24 January 2018 (EST)
  
:::: Hello Wintereu! Thank you for reaching out! [http://wikitravel.org/ro/Special:Pagini_protejate Here] is a list of protected pages on RU WT. As mentioned by Vlad above, the main reason behind protecting pages (or sometimes the entire site) is to avoid spam attacks for those versions of Wikitravel that don't have many active admins. Sometimes the spam attacks are so "forceful" and sneaky that don't get catch by our spam filters. Therefore, in a good faith to protect what has been already created we sometimes protect the pages.
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:::I second [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] idea of Mexico (and Mexican cuisine). Another option could be Venice (it's Carnival time). For OTBP you could try some small town/village around Europe (there are dozens of them). [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:27, 26 January 2018 (EST)
:::: Are you planning to work actively on RU WT? If yes, I would be happy to lift the protection for RU pages. Hopefully, the spammers let go as well in a meantime. Cheers, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] ([[User talk:IBAlex|talk]]) 03:54, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
 
::::: Wintereu, I just read a discussion on your Talk Page and realized you're not willing to work on RU. You made fair points. If you change your mind, however, please let me know:) Have a great day, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] ([[User talk:IBAlex|talk]]) 04:02, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
 
  
Hi {{user|IBAlex}}. I just tried to (re)fix the number of days and edits to be shown within the ''recent changes'' page at RO WT (from the ''Preferences'' --> ''Recent changes''). It must be a soft problem, because I simply can't change the values there (the max days suggested there and 1000 edits to show by default). And that's only one from many issues I noticed here. Also, it seems I can't be connected on both the EN WT and RO WT at the same time... Thank you for replying and reading the discussion from my talk page. There isn't much more to say. Since the e-mail option doesn't seem to work either, if you (or any one else) feel like sending me any more message or comment, you'll find me on "''copycats''" projects under the very same user name. Happy Easter ;) [[User:Wintereu|Wintereu]] ([[User talk:Wintereu|talk]]) 13:34, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
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::::Hey everyone, these are all great ideas! Still need suggestions for Language of the Month and Landmark of the Month. Shall I extend the voting until tomorrow the 31st?[[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 10:38, 30 January 2018 (EST)
: One more thing. Can you imagine I had to log in several times just to write the message above?! [[User:Wintereu|Wintereu]] ([[User talk:Wintereu|talk]]) 13:37, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
 
  
==Deletion and Login/Funky Stuff==
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::::: I always vote for Mexican cuisine. For language, I would probably throw in Swahili. [[User:IBJoel|IBJoel]] ([[User talk:IBJoel|talk]])[[User:IBJoel|IBJoel]] ([[User talk:IBJoel|talk]]) 11:08, 30 January 2018 (EST)
Hey everyone! So lately there have been some issues with login-- Wikitravel has been logging people out frivolously, and deleted pages are still showing up in Recent Changes. We are currently working to resolve these issues. If there are any other problems or bugs you find please let us know on here or through email! Thanks! [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 3:10, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
 
  
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::::::For Landmark of the month maybe we can do Mỹ Sơn in Vietnam, they're ruins of old Hindu Temples. [[User:IBThomas|IBThomas]] ([[User talk:IBThomas|talk]]) 12:31, 30 January 2018 (EST)
  
Bangkok/Thonburi will not load on my browser.
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:::::::Hi everyone! Thank you for your wonderful suggestions this past week. Here are the winners for the home page content for February. Destination of the Month: Mexico, Off the Beaten Path: Prachuap Khiri Khan, Cuisine of the Month: Mexican, Language of the Month: Swahili, and Landmark of the Month: Mỹ Sơn. (Boy was Mexico popular!). We hope to make this a regular thing for the monthly home page content. An announcement will be made here on the Pub during the last week of the month asking for user's ideas on what the Wikitravel home page should feature. Thanks again to those who participated![[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 11:39, 31 January 2018 (EST)
  
[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 04:05, 19 April 2017 (EDT)
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::::::::Great choices! Probably too late now, but since the Winter Olympics are taking place in [[Pyeongchang]] from Feb 9-25, maybe we should highlight this location too this month? Only just realised that this is happening this month. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 07:53, 2 February 2018 (EST)
The "Understand.Get In.Get Around etc" banner from the top of the page on places where there is a pic at the top, has fallen to the bottom of the article (at least in Thailand)
 
[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 04:19, 19 April 2017 (EDT)
 
  
== Issue ==
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== Bangkok Hotels ==
  
Hi, On my talkpage when I remove the "If you feel that I have reverted" box as well as try to archive the page I keep getting "This action has been automatically identified as harmful, and therefore disallowed. If you believe your action was constructive, please inform an administrator of what you were trying to do. A brief description of the abuse rule which your action matched is: TS Page Title Block",<br />
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I just checked the "Bangkok" section of Wikitravel, and I saw in the "Hotels" section, a number of hotel listings.
Not being familiar with the site as such I have no idea who to ask or where to find any admins,<br />
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Mainly upmarket ones.
Thanks, [[User:Davey2010|Davey2010]] ([[User talk:Davey2010|talk]]) 16:20, 20 April 2017 (EDT)
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I believe that these should have been placed in individual District articles,
:Probably running into a vandalism protection filter. Just write on Tonikar's page and she can help you with that. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 18:50, 20 April 2017 (EDT)
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Also, they're somewhat touty.
::Hi [[User:IBobi|IBobi]], Not sure why tho as I've never had the issue before ?, Forgot to mention but I'm constantly being logged out aswell which I assumed was a site issue, Anyway I'll ask them thanks for your help much appreciated. [[User:Davey2010|Davey2010]] ([[User talk:Davey2010|talk]]) 18:57, 20 April 2017 (EDT)
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Should I remove them?  
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[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 03:55, 24 January 2018 (EST)
  
== Removal question ==
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:Hello [[User:Avemario|Avemario]], you are correct, those listings should be moved to the respective district articles. If you feel a listing is pure advertising you can remove it, otherwise maybe adjust it a little if it is a good location to have mentioned. Just make sure you specify in the summary field of your edit what you are doing. Thanks as always! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 04:46, 25 January 2018 (EST)
  
Hi, If for instance a hotel is closed down do we remove the listing or do we put something like "this has since closed down" ?,  Not sure if we preserve the history or not, Thanks, [[User:Davey2010|Davey2010]] ([[User talk:Davey2010|talk]]) 22:49, 21 April 2017 (EDT)
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::OK, will do. Just give me a couple of days as it is a holiday weekend here. [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 01:32, 26 January 2018 (EST)
  
:Hi, thanks for your question. Yes, you can just remove the info (after verifying) and just leave a comment in the summary field when you publish. You can add/edit any info, as long as it is clear to all why something was removed. Happy editing! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 06:08, 22 April 2017 (EDT)
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:::OK, all sorted now. [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 02:20, 29 January 2018 (EST)
::Hi [[User:Adzas|Adzas]], Okie dokie thanks very much - I didn't want to remove incase we preserve that was all, Anyway thanks for your much much appreciated :), Happy editing, [[User:Davey2010|Davey2010]] ([[User talk:Davey2010|talk]]) 10:17, 22 April 2017 (EDT)
+
::::Thank you! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 07:33, 4 February 2018 (EST)
  
== Cleanup! ==
+
==Home Page Content Voting for March 2018==
 +
Hi All! We'd like Wikitravel users to help us decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for March by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Wednesday, February 28th. We will announce the winning topics on the Pub Thursday, March 1st. Thank you![[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 11:35, 20 February 2018 (EST)
  
I do believe that I have read "please remove the clutter.................."
+
:Destination of the Month could be [[Florence]], early spring is one of the best moments to visit the city (and [[Previous_Destinations_of_the_month|as far as I can see]] it has never been chosen before). Off the Beaten Path: [[Ronda]] in Spain. We could choose Cuisine and Language of a specific region: after all many of our phrasebook pages have sections about ordering food and drink. What do you think?  [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 06:07, 23 February 2018 (EST)
Wikitravel has more than 20 articles going back a loooooooooooooooooooooooooooong time!
 
  
When I write here, I remove the article afterwards after a "reasonable" time!
+
::I just got a message from someone about an Indonesian food delivery where I live, just looking at the pictures makes me hungry, for Cuisine I would suggest Indonesian! Off the Beaten Path [[Papua New Guinea]]? Destination of the Month I like Giulio´s suggestion [[Florence]]. Landmark of the Month the Abbey at [[Mont Saint Michel]]? Such a special place. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 10:10, 23 February 2018 (EST)
  
So will someone in authority please move this old stuff to where it belongs?
+
:::Indonesian cuisine! Good suggestion! [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:36, 24 February 2018 (EST)
  
I would do it myself, but at 74 years of age, I do not know where to put it all.
+
::::Landmark of the Month: the Botanical Garden in [[Padua]]. It's the oldest in the world, established in 1545, recently renovated and (sadly) often overlooked. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 11:45, 26 February 2018 (EST)
  
[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 07:02, 27 April 2017 (EDT)
+
::::I second the call for Indonesian cuisine! Or Pakistani, alternatively. [[User:IBJoel|IBJoel]] ([[User talk:IBJoel|talk]]) [[Special:Contributions/98.158.206.112|98.158.206.112]] 11:43, 1 March 2018 (EST)
  
:Hi Avemario, thank you for pointing this out. But can you be more specific on which articles you are talking about? You are always welcome to drop me an email (you know my email address). Thank you! --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 09:55, 27 April 2017 (EDT)
+
:::::Need a tie breaker for OTBP and Landmark please![[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 15:53, 1 March 2018 (EST)
  
== Cleanup! ==
+
::::::Thank you all for the wonderful suggestions! Here are the winners: Destination of the Month, Florence, Off the Beaten Path, Ronda in Spain, Cuisine of the Month, Javanese/Indonesian, Language of the Month, Indonesian, and Landmark of the Month, Abbey at Mont Saint Michel. Agreed with OTBP and Landmark options? Ran out of time so I chose these. Thank you again for posting, be ready for wonderful suggestions for the April home page![[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 17:41, 1 March 2018 (EST)
  
Hi!!
+
== Petra edits ==
  
Is someone going to do something about "sweeping the Pub" at all?
+
Hi all! Take a look at some recent [[Petra]] edits that were reverted by Giulio. In my opinion, this is a complex case, and Giulio handled it correctly, as far as the reverts go. The information added was not strictly travel related, and was added in a format not consistent with a travel guide. However, that does not mean the edits were totally without merit. It might be useful to some travelers to know that some animal rights organizations have expressed concern over how some animals at this site have been treated. The information would, however, need to be presented in a less political, agenda-driven manner, and more like a tip for a traveler than a screed against animal cruelty.
I did mention it in the above article.
 
  
[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 03:24, 5 May 2017 (EDT)
+
I think what is missing is a follow-up note on user [[User:OliCharlton|OliCharlton]]'s talk page, and perhaps on the Petra talk page as well, asking the user to please continue editing WT, but in a manner consistent with a travel guide. In this way, we open up the possibility of adding a good faith editor to the site, rather than simply shutting someone down.
  
: Hi Avemario, thank you for raising this again. You are right, the Pub contains too many topics now, I agree that it should be archived. Maybe to [[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub archives|here]]?     --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 05:41, 6 May 2017 (EDT)
+
What do you think? [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 13:55, 21 February 2018 (EST)
  
: Just archived all topics raised in 2016 [[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/2016|here]]. And our Wikitravellers' pub archive page is [[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/Archives|here]].      --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 09:20, 15 May 2017 (EDT)
+
:I agree with the revert, I would have removed it too, if it was just a line or two about animal cruelty it would have been ok I think. This user should have had a welcome message and some feedback, probably with the increased spam we had lately this one maybe slipped through? Usually new users who are serious about contributing find us on our talk pages if they don´t agree with an edit we made, glad [[User:OliCharlton|OliCharlton]] managed to get in contact and hopefully we will see many valuable edits from her in the future! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 14:50, 21 February 2018 (EST)
  
== Map based wikitravel ==
+
::I think that user had good intentions and that their info can be useful to travelers because it can allow travelers to anticipate what they may see when they travel to that particular destination. However, the user could have used a more informational/neutral tone. [[User:Ncahill|Ncahill]] ([[User talk:Ncahill|talk]]) 15:04, 21 February 2018 (EST)
  
Hello!
+
:::Hello, thank you for your feedback. I will amend the text to be less political and more 'travel guide' like. Sorry I am new to this. Please let me know if my edit is ok.. <small>—The [[Project:Using_talk_pages#Talk_page_formatting|preceding]] comment was added by [[User:OliCharlton|OliCharlton]] ([[User_talk:OliCharlton|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/OliCharlton|contribs]]) </small>
 +
 
 +
::::Hello, I'm sorry I completely forgot to leave a message to [[User:OliCharlton|OliCharlton]] but there was something in the tone of her edit that made me think it was not coming from a "valuable user" (that is someone really interested in Wikitravel's [https://wikitravel.org/en/Wikitravel:Goals_and_non-goals goals]). Of course we should not encourage cruelty to animals but discussing animals rights is not what Wikitravel is about, isn't it? [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 03:26, 22 February 2018 (EST)
 +
 
 +
::::: Hello, thanks for your reply. I think its really important for people to know this goes on. I was so upset in seeing this! And had I known I might have reconsidered my plans. If I amend to this will that be ok?
 +
::::: ''WARNING' It is advisable to walk rather than use the working animals as transport. In 2018, (PETA) Asia released a video showing the abuse of these animals. This included animals forced to carry tourists or pull carriages every day with no shelter, handlers beating and whipping their animals and animals with open fly infested wounds.  <small>—The [[Project:Using_talk_pages#Talk_page_formatting|preceding]] comment was added by [[User:OliCharlton|OliCharlton]] ([[User_talk:OliCharlton|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/OliCharlton|contribs]]) </small>
 +
 
 +
::::::Hi, glad to see the discussion. The the new version is better, but I don't think the word "WARNING" is really needed. Also, we sign our comments on discussion pages (but not in articles) by entering "<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>" at the end. Hope to see more of your contributions in the future. Cheers!  --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 10:27, 22 February 2018 (EST)
 +
 
 +
:::::::Hi, this new version is much better. I agree that "WARNING" is not needed. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 11:12, 22 February 2018 (EST)
 +
 
 +
Great thank you, I will make the edit now "[[User:OliCharlton|OliCharlton]] ([[User talk:OliCharlton|talk]]) 21:08, 22 February 2018 (EST)"
 +
 
 +
=April 2018 suggestions for WT Homepage content!=
 +
A little bit to the game to this but each month the content of our homepage changes. We'd like Wikitravel users to help decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for April by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Wednesday, April 4th. We will announce the winning topics on the Pub Thursday, April 5th. Thank you!
 +
:Botswana! [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 17:02, 3 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::Ooh! That can be an interesting one. Anyone else have suggestions for Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month?
 +
 
 +
:::What about Greek cuisine for the Cuisine topic? Off the Beaten Path a nice hidden place in [[Greece]] as well, like [[Zakynthos]]. Why not Greek as the Language of the Month then, and the Corinth Canal as the Landmark of the Month? Keeping it all in one country, long time since I have been there but a lovely country to visit! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 04:50, 4 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::::Botswana would be great! Also choosing a greek island for OTBP: Zakynthos is good but we may choose some other island ([[Ithaca (Greece)|Ithaca]]?) [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 11:12, 4 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::::::Wow! Great suggestions, Adzas and GiulioC! I think having those spots from Greece as OTBP, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month are all lovely idea as some people may not have heard of them or never been... like me! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 11:52, 4 April 2018 (EDT)IB_hill
 +
:::: I was thinking a city in Japan though, like [[Nara]] (with the nice cherry season), but Botswana is a great pick too! Keeping it all in one country sounds like a very good idea. I like it. Greek cuisine for the Cuisine topic, Greek as the Language of the Month, Off the Beaten Path a nice hidden place in [[Greece]]. Good idea! I'm for it.    --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 04:01, 5 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::I´ve seen pictures of these cherry blossoms in Japan, beautiful! Which months can that usually be seen, we can still use [[Nara]] next time? Beautiful! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 06:01, 7 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
 
 +
=Wikitravel Software Update Coming Next Week=
 +
Hello all Wikitravellers!
 +
This is one of your admins on Wikitravel. Just sending an update that our site will be expecting a upgrade sometime next week. Should anyone come across any issues, please e-mail [email protected](dot)org or message me on my talk page. [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 20:21, 6 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
 
 +
== Vandalism on WT today ==
 +
 
 +
If you happen to see a strange looking page on WT today, please let us know. Don't be alarmed, it's just a vandal. Our Legal team are in the process of tracing the related IPs and will be alerting local law enforcement immediately. Thank you, [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 15:22, 10 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
 
 +
=WT Software Upgrade Happening Now!=
 +
Hi everyone! Heads up that as of Wednesday, April 11th at 12:05pm PST, the site will be down and ready for upgrade! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 15:05, 11 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
 
 +
:Hi, IB hill,
 +
:Due to the software upgrade this time, we have some bugs on ja:WT. We can't display some of our pages correctly, with a internal error message instead. Here is an example:
 +
 
 +
[[email protected]] /ja/%E7%A5%AD%E3%82%84%E3%82%A4%E3%83%99%E3%83%B3%E3%83%88/4%E6%9C%88 Error from line 158 of /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/extensions/Breadcrumb.php: Call to undefined method User::getSkin()
 +
 
 +
Backtrace:
 +
 
 +
#0 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/extensions/Breadcrumb.php(64): BreadcrumbLinks(array, Title)
 +
#1 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/includes/Setup.php(855): setupBreadcrumb()
 +
#2 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/includes/WebStart.php(114): require_once(string)
 +
#3 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/index.php(55): require(string)
 +
#4 {main}
 +
 
 +
:This error seems to happen all the sub pages which contains slash mark ("/") on the title (Such as "[[Tokyo/Chiyoda]]"). 
 +
 
 +
:In addition, I couldn't write on your talk page, because it is totally protected (That's why I wrote my message here) [[User:Shoestring|Shoestring]] ([[User talk:Shoestring|talk]]) 08:14, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::Hey Shoestring!
 +
::Thanks for bringing this to our attention! I'm sending a report for you right now. Apologies that you couldn't talk on my talk page (you should be able to now). Will be moving our messages over there. Please keep me posted with any other issues. I plan to check on the Japan page today to see if I come across anything and will talk to you there. Thanks again! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 13:20, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::Oh and also if you can let me know what device and browser you're using. That'll be much appreciated! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 13:25, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::: It should be working now! Please let me know if there's anything else JA WT needs. Thanks for letting us know! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 18:23, 12 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
 
 +
== Traveller of the Month ==
 +
 
 +
I do note that the Traveller of the Month page is defective.
 +
I did try to post this on the edit page there, but it will not allow me.
 +
Although it is an old page, maybe you can either correct it or delete it.
 +
Obviously I would prefer the former, as I use it to prove to people that it is a totally credible website.
 +
Your call..................
 +
 
 +
[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 04:02, 14 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
 
 +
I might add that the Thai Phrasebook has a similar problem!
 +
 
 +
[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 08:08, 16 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
 
 +
:Hi Avemario, thanks for letting us know! The [[Traveller of the Month September 2015 - Avemario]] page can only be edited by admin, the page is protected. Is there anything you wanted to have changed? The [[Thai phrasebook]] seems ok to me, I can edit it, can you get in at all or just not save your edit? [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 11:02, 16 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:: Hey [[User:Avemario|Avemario]]! Wanted to introduce myself as one of the newer admins and jump in to this thread. Seems like [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] beat me to answering your questions! Please let us know what you would like to correct or change for your [[Traveller of the Month September 2015 - Avemario]] page. I can also correct the [[Thai phrasebook]] as well. We also had a software upgrade last week and have been running QA. However, there may still be little bugs that pop out. If you notice anything, please feel free to reach out and let us know the issue + browser & operating system you're using! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 12:00, 16 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
:::Hillary, the banner on the Traveller of the month page is extending at the bottom to cover the text. Also, it is time we re-started the Traveller of the Month back up again -- and maybe rename it Wikitraveller of the month? [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 20:04, 16 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
 
 +
::::Hi!
 +
::::Thanx for your answers, both Adzas (who I know already), and IB hill.
 +
 
 +
::::I am using Firefox on a laptop computer.
 +
 
 +
::::The problem is that, with the "Traveller of the Month", the discussion start is up under the pic!
 +
::::What I can read starts with "our gratitude by featuring them........"
 +
 
 +
::::With the Thai Phrasebook, everything can be read, but the writing is scrunched up against the pic. 
 +
 
 +
::::I have checked a few other Thai Province websites, but they are normal.
 +
 
 +
::::So I leave it up to you to sort this out.
 +
 
 +
::::[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 06:28, 17 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
 
 +
::::: Hey AveMario! Gotcha. I submitted a report for you just now and hopefully we will get that fixed for you quickly! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 11:58, 17 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
 +
 
 +
=Pages Currently Under Evaluation=
 +
Heads up that as of 4/18/18, we're currently putting pages about Khlong Lat Mayom Floating Market, Wat Chan, and Dusun Glondok under evaluation as we're working on determining if it adheres to the site's [[Wikitravel:policies and guidelines|policies and guidelines]] and [[Wikitravel:Manual of style|style]]. If anyone has any thoughts or know anything about these sights and destinations, please reply down below here. Would love to make this a collaborative effort on Wikitravel! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 19:27, 18 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
I wish to introduce a map based wikitravelish website impressionmap.org
+
:Hi! The first two of these three appear to be Thai, but I cannot find them on Wikitravel! The third is in Indonesia and I can find it. Can you please give me more info about these above two?  If they are Thai, I should be able to resolve it.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 03:48, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
  
I'm an avid reader and planned all trips based on info here. A big thanks first! However, articles are organized by meaningless place names (it's the only choice though), and it's not straightforward to figure out which place is where. Thus, planning bigger trips involves going back and forth between here and Google Maps, taking a long time.
+
::I can´t find the first two mentioned articles, but my first thought would be that a market should not have its own article. It can be described in the article of where it is located. Dusun Glondok I can´t find much information about online, it seems to be a little village? The writer of the article should specify where exactly it is and if there are any tourist attractions so more information can be added or rewritten. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 09:48, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::update - I found the floating market info, on [[User:TAMONWAN|Tamonwan user page]]. I removed the first paragraph as this was copied from another website and I removed the [[Wikitravel:External links|external links]] for now. For the rest I would move the original info to a location article and then remove it from the user page. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 09:57, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
::: Hello hello! I realized I left my computer without adding the pages. The Thai content about Khlong Lat Mayom Floating Market and Wat Chan are posted on [[User:TAMONWAN|Tamonwan user page]] and on [[User:Jeechnps|Jeechnps user page]]. I'm curious to know what you guys think about the content and how we could better blend the info with the site. Seems like you're a Thai expert, Avemario! If you get the chance, maybe you can check it out? [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 11:55, 19 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
It may be better to organize info by map itself and attach it to the map as snippets which will appear or disappear based on zoom level. More info and links can be added as popups. So I made the aforementioned website. You can zoom in to Amherst, MA or NYC (worse option as not much info is added) to see how it works. By the way, the website doesn't seem to work on IE and renders a bit ugly on browsers released before March 2017
+
::::OK............
  
Asking for advice and opinions! If you would, edit it as well!
+
::::The Floating Market is in Thonburi in Bangkok,and is already listed there. I have updated the opening hours, but (personally) I do not ::::think that we need all the info that the Tamonwan page provides.
 +
::::After all, do we need a travel website, or a multi page book for each destination?
 +
::::I think that too much info on a place tends to be a distraction from the rest of the area. As it is, if someone wants to go there, if they ::::are in a hotel nearby, or go to a Travel Agent, they will get all the detailed stuff and can make their choice.
  
Hopefully this is the right place to do such introduction. No bad intention, just wish to make travel info presentation more intuitive and trip planning easier
+
::::We do not need Wikitravel "overcrowded".
[[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] ([[User talk:Wkenmomo|talk]]) 14:16, 1 June 2017 (EDT)
 
  
: Sorry for such a late response! We appreciate your time spent on Wikitravel -- especially for adding edits to the Liaocheng page. We hope to see more thoughtful edits like the ones you have provided. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 01:50, 06 June 2017 (PST)
+
::::And the same with Wat Chan,which is a Buddhist Temple (Wat) in Ban Chan (Chan Town)
  
:: Hey [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]]! I finally got a chance to check out the website you had created, and I think its pretty cool! I like that it sums up exactly where I may want to travel if I want to shop, or find out more about American history! I was wondering -- and you kind of explained already-- but your purpose for creating a map that works as so? How would this help benefit Wikitravel users? Thanks! --[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 012:39, 07 June 2017 (PST)
+
::::This is in Chiang Mai Province, some 150Km North West towards Pai (which is on Wikitravel).
 +
::::Chiang Mai has many attractions, and we need again to be careful we do not make the attraction into a book!
 +
::::It seems from what I can read online that this place has only one decent hotel, run by Karen (Christian refugees from Myanmar, so it is an ::::out of the way place to get involved in this culture. There is transport to here from Chiang Mai in yellow songteows apparently (2 bench ::::pickup trucks).
 +
::::It seems that there are also minibuses from both Chiang Mai, and Pai.
  
::: Hey [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]], sorry for the late reply. Why I create it is that I want a more direct way of accessing geo info. I used to read here, search on Google Map, write what it is about and save it in my maps to compare with others. A great hassle and Google maps aren't designed for this. My purpose is to make designing "optimized" trips easier and I really hope to plan my next trip to Canada intuitively and effortlessly. Do wikitravel need a dynamic map? Wikitravel is welcome to host this map and embed it to the right zoom and boundary. The map is itself editable.[[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] ([[User talk:Wkenmomo|talk]]) 13:45, 10 June 2017 (EDT)
+
::::I would be inclined to only put a short article on the Chiang Mai website, just describing what it is, that there is a hotel, and how to ::::get there.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 06:41, 20 April 2018 (EDT)
 +
:::::Hey Avemario! Appreciate you taking the time to have a deeper look and thanks for adding the floating market in Thonburi on the [[Bangkok/Thonburi]] page. And completely agree with your suggestions. I'll have a look on their pages again and see what I can do. Thanks! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 12:04, 20 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
::::[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]], [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] I think it would be a great idea to include links to Wikimapia. I'm working on US Hwy 2 between Monroe and Stephens Pass.  Here is an example of what you get for [[Skykomish_(Washington)]] [http://wikimapia.org/#lang=en&lat=47.710000&lon=-121.360000&z=13&m=b&search=Skykomish].  We could actually provide links to WikiTravel on the WikiMapia page. Ideas? [[User:Kgrr|Kgrr]] ([[User talk:Kgrr|talk]]) 08:46, 9 July 2017 (EDT)
+
::::::Above is very helpful, great as always Avemario! I do think it is important to find out why those users are adding all this info on their user pages. As mentioned, we have had school projects before, we used to let them work on their user pages as long as all that info is moved or removed in a short period of time, either to an existing article or a new article. If the users in question don´t communicate with us and the info is not according to our guidelines (either an article already exists or the info does not justify an article etc) we should move/remove it as soon as possible. As the Travellers Pub still does not seem to appear in Recent Changes, new users may not see our discussion, so we should check on their talk pages (the messages I left so far no reaction yet as far as I can see). Great though, I´ve learnt a lot about those locations in the past days, that´s what it is all about I think. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 06:34, 21 April 2018 (EDT)
  
== Asian pages: cleanup or not? ==
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== Nong Prue ==
  
Many articles related to south-central Asia have tables collecting country/regional symbols. See some examples [http://wikitravel.org/en/India#Holidays here], [http://wikitravel.org/en/Pakistan#Eat here] and [http://wikitravel.org/en/Tajikistan#Do here]. Does Wikitravel really need it? Is it really important to know the regional flower/plant/animal/tree/etcetera of those regions? There are even flags but apparently [http://wikitravel.org/en/File_talk:Flag_of_Islamic_Republic_of_Hindustan.png some are fake]  We're a travel-related community, the info in those tables would look better in WP. I suggest to remove all of them. Any thoughts? [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 09:26, 26 June 2017 (EDT)
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I have noticed an article about this place in Kanchanaburi Province in Thailand. The information is minimal, and a VERY thorough check of the internet shows virtually no information at all worthy of tourists.Personally, I would delete the article.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 06:53, 21 April 2018 (EDT)
  
:I agree, the tables seem to overtake some of the articles, we are not an encyclopedia, lets stick to travel related information, and flags we usually only put in the country articles. Especially if the flags are not “official” we should remove those. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 05:38, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
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:And I just had a really serious look at it,and found virtually nothing at all on the internet, other that there is also a Nong Prue in Pattaya. :I still think it needs deleting - there is little info justifying moving it to the Kanchanaburi page.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User :talk:Avemario|talk]]) 07:59, 22 April 2018 (EDT)
  
:: Agree. Those tables don't belong here. They take up a lot of space but don't add value to Wikitravel as a world-wide travel guide. I think we should remove all those country/regional symbols.    --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 05:49, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
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::And as much as I hate being the pain in the arse which I am - I just noticed an article on Jom Jang, which is in Nong Khai Province in ::Thailand.There is virtually no info in this article, which was added many years ago, and it is only a few Km from Nong Khai City.I think it ::should be deleted, and the info moved to the Nong Khai page.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 06:18, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
:::I agree. Remove them all. They are intrusive, not important for travel, and I suspect they may have been copied from somewhere else (Wikipedia?) without attribution (I may be wrong about that point). I have seen them here before and disliked them, but were hesitant to just delete them - so I'm glad to see others feel the same way. [[User:Nurg|Nurg]] ([[User talk:Nurg|talk]]) 06:00, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
 
  
::::So, shall we start deleting those tables? Any other thoughts about this issue? [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 10:14, 4 July 2017 (EDT)
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:::And yet again......................... Ban Rong in Lamphang Province has absolutely no info about the place. So why not remove it [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 07:04, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
:::::There have been no objections, so anyone can go ahead and delete them. [[User:Nurg|Nurg]] ([[User talk:Nurg|talk]]) 04:59, 10 August 2017 (EDT)
 
  
== can't save preferences ==
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::::Once more................ Ban Muang Kut is a place put in by advertisers who want to promote the place. Not wanted on Wikitravel.
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::::The trip should be a place to go on the Chiang Mai page. [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 07:04, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
  
I just tried to change the Internationalisation option in my preferences and change the wiki language to have the sidebar and some buttons shown in my mother language. I pressed "save" bet it's set to "english" anyway. BTW... where are the recent changes gone? can't the the recent edits. Any chance to see it? -- [[User:DerFussi|DerFussi]] ([[User talk:DerFussi|talk]]) 16:50, 9 July 2017 (EDT)
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:::::Hey Avemario! Thanks for bringing this up- truly appreciate your Thai knowledge! I will have a look over it and see if there's a place for all the articles you just mentioned. If anyone else has any suggestions, please post it here![[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 12:13, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
This was written almost two weeks ago, and no one has answered!
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::::::We always say that any location that can be visited by a traveller, no matter how remote, can be listed here. [[Jom Jang]] for example, maybe a small place but the article does have some content, for the off the beaten path traveller maybe worth to visit after reading the little information that we have there. It is even mentioned in the [[Nong Khai]] article. I would leave this for sure. Ban Rong I can´t find an article for. Completely empty articles I would remove yes, but other places maybe we can promote on the Main Page, ask for help so editors who know the location can add info. The smallest unknown places can be the most beautiful or interesting places to explore. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 10:04, 24 April 2018 (EDT)
Will someone who understands the question please provide an answer to the person asking?
 
[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 07:24, 19 July 2017 (EDT)
 
  
:Hey [[User:DerFussi|DerFussi]] and [[User:Avemario|Avemario]]! So sorry for the late response! There have also been issues lately when other users have tried to save their ad preferences as well. This may be a related issue.  We are currently looking into this! Thank you for bringing this to our attention! [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 18:59, 20 July 2017 (EDT)
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:::::::Hi Adzas!
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:::::::Thanx for your feedback!
  
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:::::::But I still stick by with what I have written.  I have never heard of any of these places I posted until I did a detailed search (and I know that I can find many more similar ones - I just did not want to overload!)And as you are aware, I know Thailand thoroughly, having visited virtually every Province! (and still do to keep things up to date)
  
==Welcome==
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:::::::If I (or most other persons want to see what is in Thailand, we visit the Provincial City page - after all, the Capital of the Province has the same name as the Province. And we read the "do" or other pages.
Hey all!
 
So I was thinking how do you all welcome people to the site?! I usually say something like:
 
  
Hello! [[Wikitravel:Welcome, newcomers|Welcome]] to [[Wikitravel:About|Wikitravel]].
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:::::::If the destination is "big" as Hua Hin is in Prachuap Khiri Khan Province, and Koh Samui in Surat Thani Province, then of course they need a separate article.
To help get you started contributing, we've created a [[Wikitravel:Tips for new contributors|tips for new contributors]] page, full of helpful links about [[Wikitravel:policies and guidelines|policies and guidelines]] and [[Wikitravel:Manual of style|style]] as well as some important information on [[Wikitravel:copyleft|copyleft]] and basic stuff like [[Wikitravel:How to edit a page|how to edit a page]].
 
If you need help, check out [[Wikitravel:Help]], or post a message in the [[Wikitravel:travellers' pub|travellers' pub]]. -- [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]])
 
  
Any suggestions for a better welcome?! [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 20:30, 24 July 2017 (EDT)
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:::::::But these small places need to be in the Provincial (City) article I think, as many more people will get to read about them.
  
: Hi Tonika, I think your welcome message is perfectly fine. However,I think sometimes a bit of personal touch can be added in the message to make it more interactive.   --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 05:16, 26 July 2017 (EDT)
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:::::::And Muang Kut, which is an elephant place should really be moved to Chiang Mai, as there are several elephant places already there.
  
:: Hey Binbin! Sounds good, what would you suggest for more of a personal touch?![[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 14:28, 31 July 2017 (EDT)
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:::::::And also, I now cannot find Ban Rong. Maybe Management removed it, but it is not in the Province page. [[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 03:54, 25 April 2018 (EDT)
  
:::I agree with [[User:Binbin|Binbin]], the welcome message is fine like that and the only thing that could be added is something personal. Usually I add the new user's name after the "Hello" and some other words if he/she made some good contributions. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:42, 1 August 2017 (EDT)
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::::::::Hello again! Apologies for the delayed response about this- I got tied up and just got to looking over this. Totally understand your point, Avemario. It was the same for me when I did a search about these places- there wasn't too much info and I had to do some serious digging. For [[Ban Muang Kut]], I agree it should be moved to [[Chiang Mai]] as the information on that page can easily be added in the "Do" section and "Elephants". As for [[Jom Jang]] and [[Nong Prue]], I feel like there's a bit of a grey area with these place even though they are significantly a lot smaller. For [[Jom Jang]], the village has a uniqueness with its population being mostly local women farmers and community project. For [[Nong Prue]], I'm torn between just adding the information to the [[Kanchanaburi]] page or leave it as it's own because it quite a distance away from the province and it could have some potential. But you're right about how the information is too minimal. I also can't find Ban Rong either so I'm not sure if that page got deleted. Love these discussions! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 16:49, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
:::::I use the standard welcome messages that we have available, either for personal or business, and add a few personal lines if someone already made edits, if they are good just to thank them, if not following our guidelines I will mention something to point them to the right direction. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 10:45, 2 August 2017 (EDT)
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::::::And once more................ Hellfire Pass is 72Km out of Kanchanaburi, Srinakarin Dam is 54Km, and these are just two places distant from Kanchanaburi City which are listed in the Kanchanaburi article. Nong Prue is quite close to Srinakarin Dam. (Do not confuse it with the Nong Prue in Pattaya (Chon Buri Province), which is some 250Km to the south)
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So again, I think it should be moved.[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 19:10, 26 April 2018 (EDT)
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::::(and again, remember that the name of the Province is the same as that of the Capital City of the Province, so these places above are within Kanchanaburi Province!(same as England, where the Capital of Derbyshire is Derby, of Yorkshire is York etc).[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 05:48, 27 April 2018 (EDT)
  
::::::Great! Thanks peeps! I've been using the standard welcome and inserting their name seems to make a lot of sense! [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 19:12, 4 August 2017 (EDT)
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=Vote for May 2018 Homepage!=
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Hey guys! This April will be coming to an end in 4 days... whoa! That means it's time to vote for the next feature on our homepage for May! This month we featured Botswana as "Destination Of The Month" with a huge emphasis on Greek for all the other categories. What do you guys want to see? Let us know by commenting down below! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 16:19, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
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:A location in Japan where you can see the beautiful blossom, like Binbin suggested last month. For the rest let me think a bit more. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 09:43, 27 April 2018 (EDT)
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::[[Bora Bora]]! Just because I have been there long time ago and it is true paradise, blue waters, soft sand, coconut trees etc... [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 04:17, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
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:::Ooh [[Bora Bora]] sounds lovely! Maybe that can be the "Destination Of The Month" as a precursor to summer with an emphasis on Japan culture for the other categories? [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 16:59, 30 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
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::::Traditionally, we should be using destinations that will be popular places to travel in the months after when they are posted, so that people who are planning trips can make use of them. So, we should put Japanese cherry blossoms (which happen in April) on the DOTM in, say, January, if we can. It is useful to think ahead as far as what people are planning 3-4 months out. Right now I would think about late summer and fall travel. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 17:05, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
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:::::yes, you´re right, I thought the blossom could still be seen in May but that´s not the case. [[Brasil]] is a nice location for summer holidays. Landmark: the statue in Rio (Christ the Redeemer). [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 18:36, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
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::::::''we should be using destinations that will be popular places to travel in the months after when they are posted''... Then we should think about [[Russia]]: the FIFA World Cup is taking place over there between June and July. Brazil is another good option as well as other south american places (maybe [[Uruguay]] as OTBP?). [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 02:38, 1 May 2018 (EDT)
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:::::::Great point Giulio! Time to start working on our World Cup article again soon too! Let´s learn some Russian then as language of the month! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 05:02, 1 May 2018 (EDT)
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::::::::I vote for Igbo as "Language of the month" [[Special:Contributions/98.158.206.105|98.158.206.105]] 12:24, 1 May 2018 (EDT)IBJoel
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:::::::::Wow! Lots of great suggestions guys! Maybe [[Bora Bora]] for Destination of the Month, Christ the Redeemer as Landmark, [[Uruguay]] as OTBP, French Polynesia as Cuisine Of The Month, Igbo for Language Of The Month. Thanks guys! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 15:32, 1 May 2018 (EDT)IB_hill
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::::::::::Homepage has been updated! Thanks for voting everyone! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 11:18, 2 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
==Best International Graduate Schools: Pros and Cons==
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=GDPR Compliance Announcement=
I am going to grad school in the states, but have had a few friends venture out to do their study elsewhere such as Johannesburg, London, etc. What are some schools/places that you all have either attended, or encountered? Any pro's about going across the globe for studies? Cons? Semester programs?[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 18:50, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
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Hi everyone!
  
:I studied in my home country, but did my internship abroad, and since then have worked in different countries.  A great way to learn about another country, the language, see the sights etc. I can´t help you with info about schools abroad, not experienced that myself. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 12:00, 9 August 2017 (EDT)
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Starting on or before May 25th, 2018, Wikitravel will become GDPR compliant in accordance with the EU GDPR regulation.
  
::Oh cool [[User:Adzas|Adzas]]!!! Where did you do your internship? I'm thinking I would like to venture out for mine.[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 14:08, 9 August 2017 (EDT)
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If you are visiting this forum from an EU IP address, you will see a pop-up overlay that looks like this:
  
:::I did my internship in Disneyland Paris, just after opening in 1992 (I´m getting old!!). Worked in all the hotels there, great experience. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 11:03, 11 August 2017 (EDT)
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[[File:GDPR page for WT.png|GDPR Notice from IB]]
  
:::: Definitely should "go across the globe for studies". I've had my education in my home country, but I worked fulltime overseas for a few years immediately after my graduation. It's really the best experience I've had. So, if you have the choice, I think you should really think about going abroad for studies. Good luck!  --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 10:44, 13 August 2017 (EDT)
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After clicking "I Agree," this message should not appear again (unless you clear your browser cookies). You can learn more about this on [https://www.eugdpr.org this page]. Thank you. [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 14:32, 21 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
  
:I'm from China and dong my PhD in the states. It depends on if you are pursuing a master or PhD. For masters, it should be fine anywhere you think of. For PhD, you'd better make sure you get a good advisor and sane graduation requirements (western europe, us, oceania, japan and hong kong are safe bets, avoid mainland China due to language and paper requirements)[[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] ([[User talk:Wkenmomo|talk]]) 21:24, 13 August 2017 (EDT)
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=Slow servers?=
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My impression is that this site loads slowly. Have you had server issues? /[[User:Burbur|Burbur]] ([[User talk:Burbur|talk]]) 16:26, 21 May 2018 (EDT)
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:Hey Burbur! Not that I know of but I can go check that for you. Can you please let me know what operating system and browser you're using so I can investigate? Thanks! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 16:48, 21 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
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:: I use Windows 10 and Mozilla Firefox. /[[User:Burbur|Burbur]] ([[User talk:Burbur|talk]]) 19:09, 31 May 2018 (EDT)
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:::Can you give us some more details with your user experience? What issues you think is going on with the server? [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 19:18, 31 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
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::::Seems to be fine now. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 16:42, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
  
::I studied in my home country but I worked abroad for a while, definitely something I recommend to anyone. Have you considered moving to Europe? There are many great cities you can live in while studying. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:34, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
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=Vote for June 2018 Homepage!=
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Still some time left, before today´s changes. The [[World Cup 2018]] article is ready to go, anyone else getting excited for the upcoming event? As language of the Month Russian would be a great help I guess, for those making it over to [[Russia]], but also because it´s such an interesting language to learn (yes, I made an attempt many years ago). Landmark of the Month, the Church of the Saviour on Spilled Blood in [[St. Petersburg]]. For Off the Beaten Path I´m going to think a bit more. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 05:00, 1 June 2018 (EDT)
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:Sounds like a great idea [[User:Adzas|Adzas]]! Will update by end of today. Does anyone else have any other preferences or thoughts? [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 14:42, 4 June 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
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::Homepage has been updated! [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 10:47, 7 June 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
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:::By the way, [[User:IB hill|IB hill]], if you write the four tildes, you do not need to write your username, because the system automatically replaces the tildes with your username. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 16:54, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
  
::: Thanks [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]], that is super true, and helpful! [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] I actually have. One of my closest friends actually did her Master's degree there about a year ago, and she loved it. So I've been thinking about it! [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 14:27, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
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=Travel guide block=
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I know and understand why Wikitravellers are not allowed to use the name of a competing travel guide on this website. For example, I'd like to say that I'm mainly a contributor to Wiki but am now signed up on Wikitravel as well. Any thoughts? Just asking, I don't mind if you don't want to change. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 16:28, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
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:Also, I'd look forward to becoming a regular contributor to WT. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 21:04, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
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::Welcome! We would love for your to contribute more here :) But we do not allow references to 3rd party travel guides, sorry. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 13:28, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
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:::Thank you for your response. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 18:17, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
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:::: Why is that? /[[User:Burbur|Burbur]] ([[User talk:Burbur|talk]]) 17:30, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
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::::: Hey [[User:Burbur|Burbur]]! You can have a read [https://wikitravel.org/en/Wikitravel:External_links#Avoid_links_to_other_travel_guides here] to better answer your question. [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 17:50, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
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Longtime Wiki policy to ensure that Wikitravel remains a primary source, for travelers, by travelers, and not a link farm. Experience has shown that once you start allowing references to one guide, everyone thinks they can link whatever they want. So we just say no references or links to other travel guides, and it has worked out very nicely. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 17:51, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
  
==Warning or No Warning for [[Guam]]==
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=Vote for the July 2018 Homepage!=
As the situation develops with the North Korea, we've also got quite a bit of [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Guam&action=history back-and-forth] for the warning box for [[Guam]]. I think it's time we have a discussion here. Warning or no warning? What do you guys think?  --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 10:49, 13 August 2017 (EDT)
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I know it's really early, but it's better to start the nominating process early than to start late, so I think we may as well start now. I nominate the following with the idea of a [[Southwest (United States of America)|Southwest]] theme:
  
:Guam government issued some emergency guidelines in case of nuclear attack (see [https://www.reuters.com/article/us-northkorea-missiles-guam-idUSKBN1AR1Z3 here]), but I can't find any "official" travel alert from other governments. I would keep the warning on Guam page anyway hoping they will settle things down quickly. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:40, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
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*DOTM: [[Tucson]]
  
::Agreed. Since the situation is continually developing I think its best to have a warning, because people who have planned to travel there need to know. I think adding that link would be a good start-- Just in case. [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 14:22, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
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*OTBP: [[Monument Valley]]
:::As I understand, the talk was of landing missiles (presumably unarmed) 30-40 km from Guam, not on Guam. Anyway, Kim has now decided not to do it at this time. No warning needed. [[User:Nurg|Nurg]] ([[User talk:Nurg|talk]]) 04:09, 15 August 2017 (EDT)
 
::::I reverted the warning box when it was removed a few days ago, but now things seem to have changed and I can´t find any official negative travel warning from other countries, so I would probably remove it now but keep a close eye on the situation. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 06:27, 15 August 2017 (EDT)
 
  
== Force table of contents to appear in a certain location ? ==
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*Language of the Month: [[Spanish phrasebook]]
  
Hi, I am trying to force the table of contents to appear just below the introduction, on the page [[Dive_Sites_of_Timor-Leste|Dive Sites of Timor-Leste]], but it slips down quite a ways and it just looks odd. I searched the help files and FAQ, even looked at the html for other pages, but can't see how to force the placement of the index. Any suggestions? Thanks
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*Landmark of the Month: not sure
  
[[User:Ahalin|Ahalin]] ([[User talk:Ahalin|talk]]) 05:41, 29 August 2017 (EDT)
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*Cuisine of the Month: not sure
  
:I moved the TOC up in the page. Please check to see if it's to your liking. Thank you very much for contributing to Wikitravel! [[User:Tyen|Tyen]] ([[User talk:Tyen|talk]]) 15:19, 30 August 2017 (EDT)
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What do the others think? [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 23:14, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
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:Thanks for submitting your suggestions! We'll definitely circle back to this when the time gets closer. :) [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 18:19, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
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:: [[Grand Canyon]] is a good landmark candidate. /[[User:Burbur|Burbur]] ([[User talk:Burbur|talk]]) 17:31, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
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:::Thanks for submitting your votes early! Can't believe the first month of summer flew by fast. Please share your thoughts for what our homepage in July should be. Would love to get everyone's opinions! :) [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 13:15, 29 June 2018 (EDT)
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::::What about a location in [[New England]] to prepare for autumn (I know, summer goes way too fast!), like [[Vermont]]? OBP somewhere in [[Alaska]], Landmark of the Month: Chief Johnson Totem Pole in [[Ketchikan]]. Lovely memories...
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:::::I like the [[Grand Canyon]] as landmark and I too think that an autumn location where you can enjoy foliage would be great ([[New England]] or [[Japan]]). [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 04:18, 30 June 2018 (EDT)
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:::::: A location in [[New England]] or [[Japan]] will definitely be great. Speaking of autumn location, [[Jiuzhaigou]] would be great too: great views, rich colors, cool weather. Planning another trip :-).
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:::::::[[Jiuzhaigou]] sounds like an amazing location, would be great to feature that! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 04:58, 1 July 2018 (EDT)
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:::::::: All sound like great ideas! Maybe we can push the autumn idea to next month and do the Southwest theme that has been suggested for July? Also think it's a good idea to add [[Grand Canyon]] as Landmark of the Month. For Cuisine Of The Month, I think talking about New Mexico will be cool to top off the Southwest theme altogether. We can definitely revisit the autumn idea next month when the season gets closer and enjoy summer. :) [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 14:38, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
  
== Reminder on enforcing external links policy ==
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=Updated [[DOTM]] and [[VFD]] pages=
  
Hi all! I recently had to temp block a contributor for continuously adding 3rd party links to WT. This had been done over time, and had not been caught by previous patrollers. http://wikitravel.org/en/User:Travelgamma will be allowed to return in 3 days (this is a "get your attention" block that will continue over the weekend), but since their primary purpose seems to be to advertise their site, I have doubts that they will be back when not allowed to add their links any longer. You'll notice I made an effort to keep their non-link contributions to the site, while removing the links. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 16:07, 8 September 2017 (EDT)
+
Those pages were out of date, so I have been archiving old nominations and bringing it all up-to-date. Just wanted the administrators and other editors to know this and that I'm not trying to cause problems. [[User:SelfieCity|SelfieCity]] ([[User talk:SelfieCity|talk]]) 22:37, 17 July 2018 (EDT)
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:Thanks for bringing this to our attention. I'll take a closer look when I get a chance. [[User:IB hill|IB hill]] ([[User talk:IB hill|talk]]) 10:06, 18 July 2018 (EDT)

Latest revision as of 14:10, 18 July 2018

The Travellers' pub is the place to ask questions when you're confused, lost, afraid, tired, annoyed, thoughtful, or helpful. Please check the FAQ and Help page before asking a question, though, since that may save your time and others'.

Please add new questions at the bottom of the page and sign your post by appending four tildes (~~~~) to it, but otherwise plunge forward!

You can find Archived discussions here: Travellers´pub Archives.

  • If you have a question or suggestion about a particular article, try using talk pages to keep the discussion specific to that article.

Business Listings: How Much is too Much?[edit]

Earlier today, a bus company that operates New Zealand's largest passenger transport network with daily services from Auckland to many towns and cities in the Waikato region made an account, and proceeded to add their listing to a WHOLE BUNCH of pages, which looked like spam from my end. Should we allow companies to add their listings to more than a certain number of pages? Yes? No? If we do, what could be the ramifications? What could potential questions, comments, and or snide remarks could arise? -- —The preceding comment was added by Tonikar (talkcontribs)

Good question. But I think their listing should only be added to the city where their headquarters is located (and maybe to small cities and towns where they are the only choice to get into). Just imagine if we allow this bus operator to add all its lines to Wikitravel articles, we will soon see chain restaurants, hotels, and other business add listings to all places where they operate (actually, we've seen quite a few cases like this before), which will soon turn Wikitravel to a yellow page. Plus our policy about touting is pretty clear about this: ...businesses should be listed in only one article for the town or district in which the business operates... . --Binbin (talk) 04:21, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
I agree with Binbin, we'd better stick to our touting policy. The risk of having chains adding their listings everywhere is too high (and we're not the Yellow Pages, aren't we?). GiulioC (talk) 05:24, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
If you are in New Zealand without a car, it is likely that you will use Intercity to get around. I think that there is only one other operator (Naked Bus) with a smaller national network and some regional operators (Atomic etc) and for a few destinations trains. So I think that it is fine to mention them in the get in section. However we don't need the full details about WiFi etc in every article. I would prefer that some information was added about the services to a particular destination - e.g. "X has two coaches per day from Auckland via Hamilton and one from Wellington via Napier. Coaches stop outside the post office." AlasdairW (talk) 10:55, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
AlasdairW, and Binbin bring up good points. This could be a slippery slope, but on this one occasion since they are one of the few transportation services listed on our site in some areas it seems relevant and helpful. Would it be okay if they specified amenities for travelers per each location? Tonikar (talk) 9:27, 17 March 2017 (PST)
I agree that we should stick with our policy, have the business listed once, probably best the country article, and there list some specific amenities if that adds value. In our external links policy it says clearly what not to list to, so if we make an exception for one business, soon more will follow. Adzas (talk) 12:40, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
Would it be good to review our policy, and add an addendum for the amount of posts that a company has added/ can add? Also, should we be reviewing these on a case by case basis; especially if we think it could be helpful for the traveler? Like AlasdairW, had said that it is likely you will come across this company's transportation system in NZ if travelling without a car... Tonikar (talk) 1:42, 17 March 2017 (PST)

I'm torn on this one too. First, I love Alasdair's point that a business should take the time, if they are going to try this, to make EACH listing specifically relevant to that page. If they don't want to take the time to point out the relevancy of their business to that particular destination (and they ought to be encouraged by us to do so), they should not have the privilege of being listed here.

Second, I am at a loss to find something wrong with listing a business on multiple pages, if those pages do not contain any (or a very small number) similar options. In this case, if you are considering traveling to a small town in NZ that is only served by this bus company, we ought to provide details as to how to catch a bus into/out of there if we have them. What is the harm? Now, if this is, say, New York City, where there are interminable bus and other transportation options for getting in and out, I would say that allowing companies to list all of them would be disastrous for Wikitravel, and of limited to zero use for the traveler. And don't even get me started on chain restaurants!

So perhaps there is a middle ground? Where there are many existing options, disallow the listing; where there are none or very few, allow them; and when allowed, the listing must be customized to that destination. And when we see a company engaging in this behavior, we ought to make contact with them as soon as possible, guide them, and have them provide a proposed list of everywhere they are intending to add their listing, as well as the specifics of how they will customize their listing to the page, BEFORE they spam it out everywhere publicly. How's that sound? IBobi (talk) 19:29, 22 March 2017 (EDT)

I agree. In principle, listing on multiple pages is not allowed , except where similar choices are limited and/or there're none or only a few similar listings (we do have this "something is better than nothing" policy). Yes, a prior communication with the companies who want to put their listings on multiple page sounds even better so that on one hand they can do it properly with our help, on the other we can kind of make sure things don't go out of control. I think we can start with this bus operator in NZ. What do you guys think? --Binbin (talk) 01:40, 23 March 2017 (EDT)

Map Based wikitravel[edit]

Hello!

I wish to introduce a map based wikitravelish website impressionmap.org

I'm an avid reader and planned all trips based on info here. A big thanks first! However, articles are organized by meaningless place names (it's the only choice though), and it's not straightforward to figure out which place is where. Thus, planning bigger trips involves going back and forth between here and Google Maps, taking a long time.

It may be better to organize info by map itself and attach it to the map as snippets which will appear or disappear based on zoom level. More info and links can be added as popups. So I made the aforementioned website. You can zoom in to Amherst, MA or NYC (worse option as not much info is added) to see how it works. By the way, the website doesn't seem to work on IE and renders a bit ugly on browsers released before March 2017

Asking for advice and opinions! If you would, edit it as well!

Hopefully this is the right place to do such introduction. No bad intention, just wish to make travel info presentation more intuitive and trip planning easier Wkenmomo (talk) 14:16, 1 June 2017 (EDT)

Sorry for such a late response! We appreciate your time spent on Wikitravel -- especially for adding edits to the Liaocheng page. We hope to see more thoughtful edits like the ones you have provided. Thanks for the info! --Tonikar (talk) 01:50, 06 June 2017 (PST)
Hey Wkenmomo! I finally got a chance to check out the website you had created, and I think its pretty cool! I like that it sums up exactly where I may want to travel if I want to shop, or find out more about American history! I was wondering -- and you kind of explained already-- but your purpose for creating a map that works as so? How would this help benefit Wikitravel users? Thanks! --Tonikar (talk) 012:39, 07 June 2017 (PST)
Hey Tonikar, sorry for the late reply. Why I create it is that I want a more direct way of accessing geo info. I used to read here, search on Google Map, write what it is about and save it in my maps to compare with others. A great hassle and Google maps aren't designed for this. My purpose is to make designing "optimized" trips easier and I really hope to plan my next trip to Canada intuitively and effortlessly. Do wikitravel need a dynamic map? Wikitravel is welcome to host this map and embed it to the right zoom and boundary. The map is itself editable.Wkenmomo (talk) 13:45, 10 June 2017 (EDT)
Tonikar, Wkenmomo I think it would be a great idea to include links to Wikimapia. I'm working on US Hwy 2 between Monroe and Stephens Pass. Here is an example of what you get for Skykomish_(Washington) [1]. We could actually provide links to WikiTravel on the WikiMapia page. Ideas? Kgrr (talk) 08:46, 9 July 2017 (EDT)

Added section[edit]

Homosexuality is illegal in India under a colonial-era law (Section 377) dating back to 1860 that criminalize sodomy with penalties of Homosexuality is illegal in India under a colonial-era law (Section 377) dating back to 1860 that has sentences of life imprisonment, fines, beatings and viligante executions. The law has been used to harass the LGBT community and to force them into hiding. Police officers have harassed, extorted and blackmailed, beat, and turned a blind eye to violence towards homosexuals and transexuals in India. Businessess and public accomodations are not LGBT-friendly and will deny you. LGBT are emphatically discouraged from visiting. —The preceding comment was added by 2600:1:f102:19e1:c03:aa02:d96d:bb58 (talkcontribs)

Hi, thank you for your recent contributions. But for your disputes with other users, I have to say I prefer current wording about LGBT which is in a more neutral tone. Yes, India is, compared to many western countries, of a more conservative view about LGBT, but progresses have been made with the ruling from the Supreme Court about LGBT rights and increased awareness. From what my understanding, LGBT people have gained wider acceptance in India over the years. So I think like many other sensitive issues, we should stay to facts and refrain from exaggerating any one-sided views. Plus, personally, as a foreigner who's visited India quite a few times I find general Indians very friendly and welcoming, and I think as long as one uses common sense and not publicly display intimacy when visiting India, they won't face any problems. Would love to hear more comments about this though. --Binbin (talk) 05:37, 6 January 2018 (EST)
I agree with Binbin, in our articles and also in our discussions we always try to remain neutral. This is a travel site, no need to go into laws and politics, as long as a traveler has a good idea what to expect. Looking at further articles online, wasn´t there a historic ruling from India’s Supreme Court in August 2017 confirming the right of the country’s LGBT people to express their sexuality without discrimination? Let´s avoid an edit war in the article, it´s good to discuss these things here before continuously editing the article, lets see what the input is from others here on the site. Adzas (talk) 06:20, 6 January 2018 (EST)
This does, as Adzas pointed out, appear to be a classic edit war on the India page. Since there are 2 IP addresses and no actual WT user accounts involved, it may not be possible to mediate or resolve in a mutual way. In this case, I recommend that the Administrators huddle up and decide what to do; it may be that one editor is pushing an agenda -- if that is the case, I recommend a short ban of that IP to get the user's attention, along with a Talk Page (India) discussion of the issue. If the edit war continues afterward without participation in the discussion by the agenda-driven IP user, that IP should be blocked for 3 months. The page can also be protected for a short time if necessary. IBobi (talk) 18:08, 8 January 2018 (EST)

Spam Blacklist[edit]

Hello all, please take note of what links you are adding to the spam list. I've seen a couple links added that come from reputable sites/organizations.

Anyways, thanks for the vigilance you all have shown in your patrolling, it makes life so much easier and it is very much appreciated! IBThomas (talk) 12:25, 17 January 2018 (EST)

Help board[edit]

The Recent Changes for Hungarian is VERY backed up with spam. Any help in this department would be greatly appreciated.

It should also be noted that this section in the Traveler's Pub can be used as a help board of sorts, where others can ask for help, or offer their services. Hopefully this can facilitate more of a community where people can work together. IBThomas (talk) 17:00, 17 January 2018 (EST)

Just had a look, all clear for now, will keep an eye on that version too. Adzas (talk) 04:41, 23 January 2018 (EST)
There are hundreds of spam pages at the Hungarian version - e.g. see https://wikitravel.org/wiki/hu/index.php?title=Speci%C3%A1lis:%C3%81rva_lapok&limit=500&offset=0 Nurg (talk) 07:29, 6 June 2018 (EDT)
Hey Nurg! Thanks for bringing this to our attention. We're on it. IB hill (talk) 11:04, 6 June 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Please make suggestions for WT homepage content[edit]

Hello! We'd like Wikitravel users to help us decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for February by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Monday January 29th. We will announce the winning topics Tuesday the 30th. Thank you!Ncahill (talk) 14:11, 22 January 2018 (EST)

For Destination of the Month, what about Mexico, since the largest underwater cave was discovered there very recently? Interesting location for sure! Mexican cuisine is also nice. Adzas (talk) 09:42, 23 January 2018 (EST)
Maybe for "Off the Beaten Path" you could try Prachuap Khiri Khan in Thailand. This place is a paradise, and not at all expensive. Regrettably, more and more tourists are coming here, so go there before it becomes another Phuket or similar. Avemario (talk) 04:04, 24 January 2018 (EST)
I second Adzas idea of Mexico (and Mexican cuisine). Another option could be Venice (it's Carnival time). For OTBP you could try some small town/village around Europe (there are dozens of them). GiulioC (talk) 05:27, 26 January 2018 (EST)
Hey everyone, these are all great ideas! Still need suggestions for Language of the Month and Landmark of the Month. Shall I extend the voting until tomorrow the 31st?Ncahill (talk) 10:38, 30 January 2018 (EST)
I always vote for Mexican cuisine. For language, I would probably throw in Swahili. IBJoel (talk)IBJoel (talk) 11:08, 30 January 2018 (EST)
For Landmark of the month maybe we can do Mỹ Sơn in Vietnam, they're ruins of old Hindu Temples. IBThomas (talk) 12:31, 30 January 2018 (EST)
Hi everyone! Thank you for your wonderful suggestions this past week. Here are the winners for the home page content for February. Destination of the Month: Mexico, Off the Beaten Path: Prachuap Khiri Khan, Cuisine of the Month: Mexican, Language of the Month: Swahili, and Landmark of the Month: Mỹ Sơn. (Boy was Mexico popular!). We hope to make this a regular thing for the monthly home page content. An announcement will be made here on the Pub during the last week of the month asking for user's ideas on what the Wikitravel home page should feature. Thanks again to those who participated!Ncahill (talk) 11:39, 31 January 2018 (EST)
Great choices! Probably too late now, but since the Winter Olympics are taking place in Pyeongchang from Feb 9-25, maybe we should highlight this location too this month? Only just realised that this is happening this month. Adzas (talk) 07:53, 2 February 2018 (EST)

Bangkok Hotels[edit]

I just checked the "Bangkok" section of Wikitravel, and I saw in the "Hotels" section, a number of hotel listings. Mainly upmarket ones. I believe that these should have been placed in individual District articles, Also, they're somewhat touty. Should I remove them? Avemario (talk) 03:55, 24 January 2018 (EST)

Hello Avemario, you are correct, those listings should be moved to the respective district articles. If you feel a listing is pure advertising you can remove it, otherwise maybe adjust it a little if it is a good location to have mentioned. Just make sure you specify in the summary field of your edit what you are doing. Thanks as always! Adzas (talk) 04:46, 25 January 2018 (EST)
OK, will do. Just give me a couple of days as it is a holiday weekend here. Avemario (talk) 01:32, 26 January 2018 (EST)
OK, all sorted now. Avemario (talk) 02:20, 29 January 2018 (EST)
Thank you! Adzas (talk) 07:33, 4 February 2018 (EST)

Home Page Content Voting for March 2018[edit]

Hi All! We'd like Wikitravel users to help us decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for March by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Wednesday, February 28th. We will announce the winning topics on the Pub Thursday, March 1st. Thank you!Ncahill (talk) 11:35, 20 February 2018 (EST)

Destination of the Month could be Florence, early spring is one of the best moments to visit the city (and as far as I can see it has never been chosen before). Off the Beaten Path: Ronda in Spain. We could choose Cuisine and Language of a specific region: after all many of our phrasebook pages have sections about ordering food and drink. What do you think? GiulioC (talk) 06:07, 23 February 2018 (EST)
I just got a message from someone about an Indonesian food delivery where I live, just looking at the pictures makes me hungry, for Cuisine I would suggest Indonesian! Off the Beaten Path Papua New Guinea? Destination of the Month I like Giulio´s suggestion Florence. Landmark of the Month the Abbey at Mont Saint Michel? Such a special place. Adzas (talk) 10:10, 23 February 2018 (EST)
Indonesian cuisine! Good suggestion! GiulioC (talk) 05:36, 24 February 2018 (EST)
Landmark of the Month: the Botanical Garden in Padua. It's the oldest in the world, established in 1545, recently renovated and (sadly) often overlooked. GiulioC (talk) 11:45, 26 February 2018 (EST)
I second the call for Indonesian cuisine! Or Pakistani, alternatively. IBJoel (talk) 98.158.206.112 11:43, 1 March 2018 (EST)
Need a tie breaker for OTBP and Landmark please!Ncahill (talk) 15:53, 1 March 2018 (EST)
Thank you all for the wonderful suggestions! Here are the winners: Destination of the Month, Florence, Off the Beaten Path, Ronda in Spain, Cuisine of the Month, Javanese/Indonesian, Language of the Month, Indonesian, and Landmark of the Month, Abbey at Mont Saint Michel. Agreed with OTBP and Landmark options? Ran out of time so I chose these. Thank you again for posting, be ready for wonderful suggestions for the April home page!Ncahill (talk) 17:41, 1 March 2018 (EST)

Petra edits[edit]

Hi all! Take a look at some recent Petra edits that were reverted by Giulio. In my opinion, this is a complex case, and Giulio handled it correctly, as far as the reverts go. The information added was not strictly travel related, and was added in a format not consistent with a travel guide. However, that does not mean the edits were totally without merit. It might be useful to some travelers to know that some animal rights organizations have expressed concern over how some animals at this site have been treated. The information would, however, need to be presented in a less political, agenda-driven manner, and more like a tip for a traveler than a screed against animal cruelty.

I think what is missing is a follow-up note on user OliCharlton's talk page, and perhaps on the Petra talk page as well, asking the user to please continue editing WT, but in a manner consistent with a travel guide. In this way, we open up the possibility of adding a good faith editor to the site, rather than simply shutting someone down.

What do you think? IBobi (talk) 13:55, 21 February 2018 (EST)

I agree with the revert, I would have removed it too, if it was just a line or two about animal cruelty it would have been ok I think. This user should have had a welcome message and some feedback, probably with the increased spam we had lately this one maybe slipped through? Usually new users who are serious about contributing find us on our talk pages if they don´t agree with an edit we made, glad OliCharlton managed to get in contact and hopefully we will see many valuable edits from her in the future! Adzas (talk) 14:50, 21 February 2018 (EST)
I think that user had good intentions and that their info can be useful to travelers because it can allow travelers to anticipate what they may see when they travel to that particular destination. However, the user could have used a more informational/neutral tone. Ncahill (talk) 15:04, 21 February 2018 (EST)
Hello, thank you for your feedback. I will amend the text to be less political and more 'travel guide' like. Sorry I am new to this. Please let me know if my edit is ok.. —The preceding comment was added by OliCharlton (talkcontribs)
Hello, I'm sorry I completely forgot to leave a message to OliCharlton but there was something in the tone of her edit that made me think it was not coming from a "valuable user" (that is someone really interested in Wikitravel's goals). Of course we should not encourage cruelty to animals but discussing animals rights is not what Wikitravel is about, isn't it? GiulioC (talk) 03:26, 22 February 2018 (EST)
Hello, thanks for your reply. I think its really important for people to know this goes on. I was so upset in seeing this! And had I known I might have reconsidered my plans. If I amend to this will that be ok?
WARNING' It is advisable to walk rather than use the working animals as transport. In 2018, (PETA) Asia released a video showing the abuse of these animals. This included animals forced to carry tourists or pull carriages every day with no shelter, handlers beating and whipping their animals and animals with open fly infested wounds. —The preceding comment was added by OliCharlton (talkcontribs)
Hi, glad to see the discussion. The the new version is better, but I don't think the word "WARNING" is really needed. Also, we sign our comments on discussion pages (but not in articles) by entering "~~~~" at the end. Hope to see more of your contributions in the future. Cheers! --Binbin (talk) 10:27, 22 February 2018 (EST)
Hi, this new version is much better. I agree that "WARNING" is not needed. GiulioC (talk) 11:12, 22 February 2018 (EST)

Great thank you, I will make the edit now "OliCharlton (talk) 21:08, 22 February 2018 (EST)"

April 2018 suggestions for WT Homepage content![edit]

A little bit to the game to this but each month the content of our homepage changes. We'd like Wikitravel users to help decide what should go on the Wikitravel homepage for April by offering ideas for 5 different categories: Destination of the Month, Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month. Please post your ideas on the Pub between today and Wednesday, April 4th. We will announce the winning topics on the Pub Thursday, April 5th. Thank you!

Botswana! IBobi (talk) 17:02, 3 April 2018 (EDT)
Ooh! That can be an interesting one. Anyone else have suggestions for Off the Beaten Path, Cuisine of the Month, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month?
What about Greek cuisine for the Cuisine topic? Off the Beaten Path a nice hidden place in Greece as well, like Zakynthos. Why not Greek as the Language of the Month then, and the Corinth Canal as the Landmark of the Month? Keeping it all in one country, long time since I have been there but a lovely country to visit! Adzas (talk) 04:50, 4 April 2018 (EDT)
Botswana would be great! Also choosing a greek island for OTBP: Zakynthos is good but we may choose some other island (Ithaca?) GiulioC (talk) 11:12, 4 April 2018 (EDT)
Wow! Great suggestions, Adzas and GiulioC! I think having those spots from Greece as OTBP, Language of the Month, and Landmark of the Month are all lovely idea as some people may not have heard of them or never been... like me! IB hill (talk) 11:52, 4 April 2018 (EDT)IB_hill
I was thinking a city in Japan though, like Nara (with the nice cherry season), but Botswana is a great pick too! Keeping it all in one country sounds like a very good idea. I like it. Greek cuisine for the Cuisine topic, Greek as the Language of the Month, Off the Beaten Path a nice hidden place in Greece. Good idea! I'm for it. --Binbin (talk) 04:01, 5 April 2018 (EDT)
I´ve seen pictures of these cherry blossoms in Japan, beautiful! Which months can that usually be seen, we can still use Nara next time? Beautiful! Adzas (talk) 06:01, 7 April 2018 (EDT)

Wikitravel Software Update Coming Next Week[edit]

Hello all Wikitravellers! This is one of your admins on Wikitravel. Just sending an update that our site will be expecting a upgrade sometime next week. Should anyone come across any issues, please e-mail [email protected](dot)org or message me on my talk page. IB hill (talk) 20:21, 6 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Vandalism on WT today[edit]

If you happen to see a strange looking page on WT today, please let us know. Don't be alarmed, it's just a vandal. Our Legal team are in the process of tracing the related IPs and will be alerting local law enforcement immediately. Thank you, IBobi (talk) 15:22, 10 April 2018 (EDT)

WT Software Upgrade Happening Now![edit]

Hi everyone! Heads up that as of Wednesday, April 11th at 12:05pm PST, the site will be down and ready for upgrade! IB hill (talk) 15:05, 11 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Hi, IB hill,
Due to the software upgrade this time, we have some bugs on ja:WT. We can't display some of our pages correctly, with a internal error message instead. Here is an example:
[[email protected]] /ja/%E7%A5%AD%E3%82%84%E3%82%A4%E3%83%99%E3%83%B3%E3%83%88/4%E6%9C%88 Error from line 158 of /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/extensions/Breadcrumb.php: Call to undefined method User::getSkin()
Backtrace:
#0 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/extensions/Breadcrumb.php(64): BreadcrumbLinks(array, Title)
#1 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/includes/Setup.php(855): setupBreadcrumb()
#2 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/includes/WebStart.php(114): require_once(string)
#3 /var/www/html/wikitravel.org/mw-1.30.0/index.php(55): require(string)
#4 {main}
This error seems to happen all the sub pages which contains slash mark ("/") on the title (Such as "Tokyo/Chiyoda").
In addition, I couldn't write on your talk page, because it is totally protected (That's why I wrote my message here) Shoestring (talk) 08:14, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
Hey Shoestring!
Thanks for bringing this to our attention! I'm sending a report for you right now. Apologies that you couldn't talk on my talk page (you should be able to now). Will be moving our messages over there. Please keep me posted with any other issues. I plan to check on the Japan page today to see if I come across anything and will talk to you there. Thanks again! IB hill (talk) 13:20, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
Oh and also if you can let me know what device and browser you're using. That'll be much appreciated! IB hill (talk) 13:25, 12 April 2018 (EDT)
It should be working now! Please let me know if there's anything else JA WT needs. Thanks for letting us know! IB hill (talk) 18:23, 12 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Traveller of the Month[edit]

I do note that the Traveller of the Month page is defective. I did try to post this on the edit page there, but it will not allow me. Although it is an old page, maybe you can either correct it or delete it. Obviously I would prefer the former, as I use it to prove to people that it is a totally credible website. Your call..................

Avemario (talk) 04:02, 14 April 2018 (EDT)

I might add that the Thai Phrasebook has a similar problem!

Avemario (talk) 08:08, 16 April 2018 (EDT)

Hi Avemario, thanks for letting us know! The Traveller of the Month September 2015 - Avemario page can only be edited by admin, the page is protected. Is there anything you wanted to have changed? The Thai phrasebook seems ok to me, I can edit it, can you get in at all or just not save your edit? Adzas (talk) 11:02, 16 April 2018 (EDT)
Hey Avemario! Wanted to introduce myself as one of the newer admins and jump in to this thread. Seems like Adzas beat me to answering your questions! Please let us know what you would like to correct or change for your Traveller of the Month September 2015 - Avemario page. I can also correct the Thai phrasebook as well. We also had a software upgrade last week and have been running QA. However, there may still be little bugs that pop out. If you notice anything, please feel free to reach out and let us know the issue + browser & operating system you're using! IB hill (talk) 12:00, 16 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Hillary, the banner on the Traveller of the month page is extending at the bottom to cover the text. Also, it is time we re-started the Traveller of the Month back up again -- and maybe rename it Wikitraveller of the month? IBobi (talk) 20:04, 16 April 2018 (EDT)
Hi!
Thanx for your answers, both Adzas (who I know already), and IB hill.
I am using Firefox on a laptop computer.
The problem is that, with the "Traveller of the Month", the discussion start is up under the pic!
What I can read starts with "our gratitude by featuring them........"
With the Thai Phrasebook, everything can be read, but the writing is scrunched up against the pic.
I have checked a few other Thai Province websites, but they are normal.
So I leave it up to you to sort this out.
Avemario (talk) 06:28, 17 April 2018 (EDT)
Hey AveMario! Gotcha. I submitted a report for you just now and hopefully we will get that fixed for you quickly! IB hill (talk) 11:58, 17 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Pages Currently Under Evaluation[edit]

Heads up that as of 4/18/18, we're currently putting pages about Khlong Lat Mayom Floating Market, Wat Chan, and Dusun Glondok under evaluation as we're working on determining if it adheres to the site's policies and guidelines and style. If anyone has any thoughts or know anything about these sights and destinations, please reply down below here. Would love to make this a collaborative effort on Wikitravel! IB hill (talk) 19:27, 18 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Hi! The first two of these three appear to be Thai, but I cannot find them on Wikitravel! The third is in Indonesia and I can find it. Can you please give me more info about these above two? If they are Thai, I should be able to resolve it.Avemario (talk) 03:48, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
I can´t find the first two mentioned articles, but my first thought would be that a market should not have its own article. It can be described in the article of where it is located. Dusun Glondok I can´t find much information about online, it seems to be a little village? The writer of the article should specify where exactly it is and if there are any tourist attractions so more information can be added or rewritten. Adzas (talk) 09:48, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
update - I found the floating market info, on Tamonwan user page. I removed the first paragraph as this was copied from another website and I removed the external links for now. For the rest I would move the original info to a location article and then remove it from the user page. Adzas (talk) 09:57, 19 April 2018 (EDT)
Hello hello! I realized I left my computer without adding the pages. The Thai content about Khlong Lat Mayom Floating Market and Wat Chan are posted on Tamonwan user page and on Jeechnps user page. I'm curious to know what you guys think about the content and how we could better blend the info with the site. Seems like you're a Thai expert, Avemario! If you get the chance, maybe you can check it out? IB hill (talk) 11:55, 19 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
OK............
The Floating Market is in Thonburi in Bangkok,and is already listed there. I have updated the opening hours, but (personally) I do not ::::think that we need all the info that the Tamonwan page provides.
After all, do we need a travel website, or a multi page book for each destination?
I think that too much info on a place tends to be a distraction from the rest of the area. As it is, if someone wants to go there, if they ::::are in a hotel nearby, or go to a Travel Agent, they will get all the detailed stuff and can make their choice.
We do not need Wikitravel "overcrowded".
And the same with Wat Chan,which is a Buddhist Temple (Wat) in Ban Chan (Chan Town)
This is in Chiang Mai Province, some 150Km North West towards Pai (which is on Wikitravel).
Chiang Mai has many attractions, and we need again to be careful we do not make the attraction into a book!
It seems from what I can read online that this place has only one decent hotel, run by Karen (Christian refugees from Myanmar, so it is an ::::out of the way place to get involved in this culture. There is transport to here from Chiang Mai in yellow songteows apparently (2 bench ::::pickup trucks).
It seems that there are also minibuses from both Chiang Mai, and Pai.
I would be inclined to only put a short article on the Chiang Mai website, just describing what it is, that there is a hotel, and how to ::::get there.Avemario (talk) 06:41, 20 April 2018 (EDT)
Hey Avemario! Appreciate you taking the time to have a deeper look and thanks for adding the floating market in Thonburi on the Bangkok/Thonburi page. And completely agree with your suggestions. I'll have a look on their pages again and see what I can do. Thanks! IB hill (talk) 12:04, 20 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Above is very helpful, great as always Avemario! I do think it is important to find out why those users are adding all this info on their user pages. As mentioned, we have had school projects before, we used to let them work on their user pages as long as all that info is moved or removed in a short period of time, either to an existing article or a new article. If the users in question don´t communicate with us and the info is not according to our guidelines (either an article already exists or the info does not justify an article etc) we should move/remove it as soon as possible. As the Travellers Pub still does not seem to appear in Recent Changes, new users may not see our discussion, so we should check on their talk pages (the messages I left so far no reaction yet as far as I can see). Great though, I´ve learnt a lot about those locations in the past days, that´s what it is all about I think. Adzas (talk) 06:34, 21 April 2018 (EDT)

Nong Prue[edit]

I have noticed an article about this place in Kanchanaburi Province in Thailand. The information is minimal, and a VERY thorough check of the internet shows virtually no information at all worthy of tourists.Personally, I would delete the article.Avemario (talk) 06:53, 21 April 2018 (EDT)

And I just had a really serious look at it,and found virtually nothing at all on the internet, other that there is also a Nong Prue in Pattaya. :I still think it needs deleting - there is little info justifying moving it to the Kanchanaburi page.Avemario (talk) 07:59, 22 April 2018 (EDT)
And as much as I hate being the pain in the arse which I am - I just noticed an article on Jom Jang, which is in Nong Khai Province in ::Thailand.There is virtually no info in this article, which was added many years ago, and it is only a few Km from Nong Khai City.I think it ::should be deleted, and the info moved to the Nong Khai page.Avemario (talk) 06:18, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
And yet again......................... Ban Rong in Lamphang Province has absolutely no info about the place. So why not remove it Avemario (talk) 07:04, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
Once more................ Ban Muang Kut is a place put in by advertisers who want to promote the place. Not wanted on Wikitravel.
The trip should be a place to go on the Chiang Mai page. Avemario (talk) 07:04, 23 April 2018 (EDT)
Hey Avemario! Thanks for bringing this up- truly appreciate your Thai knowledge! I will have a look over it and see if there's a place for all the articles you just mentioned. If anyone else has any suggestions, please post it here!IB hill (talk) 12:13, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
We always say that any location that can be visited by a traveller, no matter how remote, can be listed here. Jom Jang for example, maybe a small place but the article does have some content, for the off the beaten path traveller maybe worth to visit after reading the little information that we have there. It is even mentioned in the Nong Khai article. I would leave this for sure. Ban Rong I can´t find an article for. Completely empty articles I would remove yes, but other places maybe we can promote on the Main Page, ask for help so editors who know the location can add info. The smallest unknown places can be the most beautiful or interesting places to explore. Adzas (talk) 10:04, 24 April 2018 (EDT)
Hi Adzas!
Thanx for your feedback!
But I still stick by with what I have written. I have never heard of any of these places I posted until I did a detailed search (and I know that I can find many more similar ones - I just did not want to overload!)And as you are aware, I know Thailand thoroughly, having visited virtually every Province! (and still do to keep things up to date)
If I (or most other persons want to see what is in Thailand, we visit the Provincial City page - after all, the Capital of the Province has the same name as the Province. And we read the "do" or other pages.
If the destination is "big" as Hua Hin is in Prachuap Khiri Khan Province, and Koh Samui in Surat Thani Province, then of course they need a separate article.
But these small places need to be in the Provincial (City) article I think, as many more people will get to read about them.
And Muang Kut, which is an elephant place should really be moved to Chiang Mai, as there are several elephant places already there.
And also, I now cannot find Ban Rong. Maybe Management removed it, but it is not in the Province page. Avemario (talk) 03:54, 25 April 2018 (EDT)
Hello again! Apologies for the delayed response about this- I got tied up and just got to looking over this. Totally understand your point, Avemario. It was the same for me when I did a search about these places- there wasn't too much info and I had to do some serious digging. For Ban Muang Kut, I agree it should be moved to Chiang Mai as the information on that page can easily be added in the "Do" section and "Elephants". As for Jom Jang and Nong Prue, I feel like there's a bit of a grey area with these place even though they are significantly a lot smaller. For Jom Jang, the village has a uniqueness with its population being mostly local women farmers and community project. For Nong Prue, I'm torn between just adding the information to the Kanchanaburi page or leave it as it's own because it quite a distance away from the province and it could have some potential. But you're right about how the information is too minimal. I also can't find Ban Rong either so I'm not sure if that page got deleted. Love these discussions! IB hill (talk) 16:49, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
And once more................ Hellfire Pass is 72Km out of Kanchanaburi, Srinakarin Dam is 54Km, and these are just two places distant from Kanchanaburi City which are listed in the Kanchanaburi article. Nong Prue is quite close to Srinakarin Dam. (Do not confuse it with the Nong Prue in Pattaya (Chon Buri Province), which is some 250Km to the south)

So again, I think it should be moved.Avemario (talk) 19:10, 26 April 2018 (EDT)

(and again, remember that the name of the Province is the same as that of the Capital City of the Province, so these places above are within Kanchanaburi Province!(same as England, where the Capital of Derbyshire is Derby, of Yorkshire is York etc).Avemario (talk) 05:48, 27 April 2018 (EDT)

Vote for May 2018 Homepage![edit]

Hey guys! This April will be coming to an end in 4 days... whoa! That means it's time to vote for the next feature on our homepage for May! This month we featured Botswana as "Destination Of The Month" with a huge emphasis on Greek for all the other categories. What do you guys want to see? Let us know by commenting down below! IB hill (talk) 16:19, 26 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

A location in Japan where you can see the beautiful blossom, like Binbin suggested last month. For the rest let me think a bit more. Adzas (talk) 09:43, 27 April 2018 (EDT)
Bora Bora! Just because I have been there long time ago and it is true paradise, blue waters, soft sand, coconut trees etc... Adzas (talk) 04:17, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
Ooh Bora Bora sounds lovely! Maybe that can be the "Destination Of The Month" as a precursor to summer with an emphasis on Japan culture for the other categories? IB hill (talk) 16:59, 30 April 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Traditionally, we should be using destinations that will be popular places to travel in the months after when they are posted, so that people who are planning trips can make use of them. So, we should put Japanese cherry blossoms (which happen in April) on the DOTM in, say, January, if we can. It is useful to think ahead as far as what people are planning 3-4 months out. Right now I would think about late summer and fall travel. IBobi (talk) 17:05, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
yes, you´re right, I thought the blossom could still be seen in May but that´s not the case. Brasil is a nice location for summer holidays. Landmark: the statue in Rio (Christ the Redeemer). Adzas (talk) 18:36, 30 April 2018 (EDT)
we should be using destinations that will be popular places to travel in the months after when they are posted... Then we should think about Russia: the FIFA World Cup is taking place over there between June and July. Brazil is another good option as well as other south american places (maybe Uruguay as OTBP?). GiulioC (talk) 02:38, 1 May 2018 (EDT)
Great point Giulio! Time to start working on our World Cup article again soon too! Let´s learn some Russian then as language of the month! Adzas (talk) 05:02, 1 May 2018 (EDT)
I vote for Igbo as "Language of the month" 98.158.206.105 12:24, 1 May 2018 (EDT)IBJoel
Wow! Lots of great suggestions guys! Maybe Bora Bora for Destination of the Month, Christ the Redeemer as Landmark, Uruguay as OTBP, French Polynesia as Cuisine Of The Month, Igbo for Language Of The Month. Thanks guys! IB hill (talk) 15:32, 1 May 2018 (EDT)IB_hill
Homepage has been updated! Thanks for voting everyone! IB hill (talk) 11:18, 2 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

GDPR Compliance Announcement[edit]

Hi everyone!

Starting on or before May 25th, 2018, Wikitravel will become GDPR compliant in accordance with the EU GDPR regulation.

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After clicking "I Agree," this message should not appear again (unless you clear your browser cookies). You can learn more about this on this page. Thank you. IB hill (talk) 14:32, 21 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill

Slow servers?[edit]

My impression is that this site loads slowly. Have you had server issues? /Burbur (talk) 16:26, 21 May 2018 (EDT)

Hey Burbur! Not that I know of but I can go check that for you. Can you please let me know what operating system and browser you're using so I can investigate? Thanks! IB hill (talk) 16:48, 21 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
I use Windows 10 and Mozilla Firefox. /Burbur (talk) 19:09, 31 May 2018 (EDT)
Can you give us some more details with your user experience? What issues you think is going on with the server? IB hill (talk) 19:18, 31 May 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Seems to be fine now. SelfieCity (talk) 16:42, 9 June 2018 (EDT)

Vote for June 2018 Homepage![edit]

Still some time left, before today´s changes. The World Cup 2018 article is ready to go, anyone else getting excited for the upcoming event? As language of the Month Russian would be a great help I guess, for those making it over to Russia, but also because it´s such an interesting language to learn (yes, I made an attempt many years ago). Landmark of the Month, the Church of the Saviour on Spilled Blood in St. Petersburg. For Off the Beaten Path I´m going to think a bit more. Adzas (talk) 05:00, 1 June 2018 (EDT)

Sounds like a great idea Adzas! Will update by end of today. Does anyone else have any other preferences or thoughts? IB hill (talk) 14:42, 4 June 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
Homepage has been updated! IB hill (talk) 10:47, 7 June 2018 (EDT)IB_Hill
By the way, IB hill, if you write the four tildes, you do not need to write your username, because the system automatically replaces the tildes with your username. SelfieCity (talk) 16:54, 9 June 2018 (EDT)

Travel guide block[edit]

I know and understand why Wikitravellers are not allowed to use the name of a competing travel guide on this website. For example, I'd like to say that I'm mainly a contributor to Wiki but am now signed up on Wikitravel as well. Any thoughts? Just asking, I don't mind if you don't want to change. SelfieCity (talk) 16:28, 9 June 2018 (EDT)

Also, I'd look forward to becoming a regular contributor to WT. SelfieCity (talk) 21:04, 9 June 2018 (EDT)
Welcome! We would love for your to contribute more here :) But we do not allow references to 3rd party travel guides, sorry. IBobi (talk) 13:28, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
Thank you for your response. SelfieCity (talk) 18:17, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
Why is that? /Burbur (talk) 17:30, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
Hey Burbur! You can have a read here to better answer your question. IB hill (talk) 17:50, 12 June 2018 (EDT)

Longtime Wiki policy to ensure that Wikitravel remains a primary source, for travelers, by travelers, and not a link farm. Experience has shown that once you start allowing references to one guide, everyone thinks they can link whatever they want. So we just say no references or links to other travel guides, and it has worked out very nicely. IBobi (talk) 17:51, 12 June 2018 (EDT)

Vote for the July 2018 Homepage![edit]

I know it's really early, but it's better to start the nominating process early than to start late, so I think we may as well start now. I nominate the following with the idea of a Southwest theme:

  • Landmark of the Month: not sure
  • Cuisine of the Month: not sure

What do the others think? SelfieCity (talk) 23:14, 9 June 2018 (EDT)

Thanks for submitting your suggestions! We'll definitely circle back to this when the time gets closer. :) IB hill (talk) 18:19, 11 June 2018 (EDT)
Grand Canyon is a good landmark candidate. /Burbur (talk) 17:31, 12 June 2018 (EDT)
Thanks for submitting your votes early! Can't believe the first month of summer flew by fast. Please share your thoughts for what our homepage in July should be. Would love to get everyone's opinions! :) IB hill (talk) 13:15, 29 June 2018 (EDT)
What about a location in New England to prepare for autumn (I know, summer goes way too fast!), like Vermont? OBP somewhere in Alaska, Landmark of the Month: Chief Johnson Totem Pole in Ketchikan. Lovely memories...
I like the Grand Canyon as landmark and I too think that an autumn location where you can enjoy foliage would be great (New England or Japan). GiulioC (talk) 04:18, 30 June 2018 (EDT)
A location in New England or Japan will definitely be great. Speaking of autumn location, Jiuzhaigou would be great too: great views, rich colors, cool weather. Planning another trip :-).
Jiuzhaigou sounds like an amazing location, would be great to feature that! Adzas (talk) 04:58, 1 July 2018 (EDT)
All sound like great ideas! Maybe we can push the autumn idea to next month and do the Southwest theme that has been suggested for July? Also think it's a good idea to add Grand Canyon as Landmark of the Month. For Cuisine Of The Month, I think talking about New Mexico will be cool to top off the Southwest theme altogether. We can definitely revisit the autumn idea next month when the season gets closer and enjoy summer. :) IB hill (talk) 14:38, 2 July 2018 (EDT)

Updated DOTM and VFD pages[edit]

Those pages were out of date, so I have been archiving old nominations and bringing it all up-to-date. Just wanted the administrators and other editors to know this and that I'm not trying to cause problems. SelfieCity (talk) 22:37, 17 July 2018 (EDT)

Thanks for bringing this to our attention. I'll take a closer look when I get a chance. IB hill (talk) 10:06, 18 July 2018 (EDT)