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I just saw that you hadn't been properly welcomed, now you have. Thanks for all the good work you have been doing! --[[User:Peterfitzgerald|Peter]] <small><sup>[[User_talk:Peterfitzgerald|Talk]]</sup></small> 00:43, 28 July 2009 (EDT)
I just would like to say your a faggit. Thanks. --[[User:Peterfitzgerald|Peter]] <small><sup>[[User_talk:Peterfitzgerald|Talk]]</sup></small> 00:43, 28 July 2009 (EDT)
==Nusa Lembongan==
==Nusa Lembongan==

Revision as of 14:08, 16 March 2010



I just would like to say your a faggit. Thanks. --Peter Talk 00:43, 28 July 2009 (EDT)

Nusa Lembongan

Please see [[1]]. Thanks. Texugo 03:23, 1 September 2009 (EDT)

Map licensing

Re: your Nusa Lembongan map, you mentioned that "Future editing for use at Wikitravel only is not a problem", but unfortunately this is a problem -- anything you contribute to Wikitravel (text, images, maps) can, according to our Creative Commons copyleft, be used by anybody for any purpose. Jpatokal 07:45, 1 September 2009 (EDT)

Guide status

Sorry not to get back to you sooner—I was out of the internet's reach for a vacation. The article looks great, definitely guide status. I see there are some issues with the map licensing, but it looks like you are already sorting that out. Great work! --Peter Talk 12:58, 3 September 2009 (EDT)

Re Nusa Penida, the only issue I can see is that the article lacks "get out" content. It also lacks photos, which I thought to be a requirement, but it appears that the policy does not require them. Otherwise, it seems to be at guide status. --Peter Talk 01:56, 9 September 2009 (EDT)


Just wanted to thank you for your work on Bali, I'm very fond of the place but, despite my occasional applications of the weed-whacker, its articles have long been a godawful mess. It's great to see somebody finally putting some real elbow grease into them! Jpatokal 02:35, 4 September 2009 (EDT)

I was about to say the same, nice work! Globe-trotter 12:44, 6 September 2009 (EDT)

I just wanted to point your attention to the fact that your Bali guide, shows up a impressive number 6, on a Google search for Bali. Apparently there are some nuances to results depending on where you search from, but it's definitely a testament to a high google ranking for your work --Stefan (sertmann) talk 15:16, 18 January 2010 (EST)


One minor style note (and a pet peeve or mine): please use "US$" for US dollars, not "USD" or other currency codes. See Wikitravel:Currency for the full scoop. Jpatokal 05:50, 9 September 2009 (EDT)

West Bali National Park

Wow, nice work! It's fun to see good articles suddenly appear overnight. --Peter Talk 13:46, 10 September 2009 (EDT)


Hi! For your interest see on how Mainski responded to Peter's text. Have a nice day, jan 07:24, 15 September 2009 (EDT)

Central Bali see section

I noticed you copied a bunch of listings to the Central Bali see section. As a general rule, content should never be duplicated across articles, and region articles should not contain individual listings—only prose overviews. --Peter Talk 14:35, 20 September 2009 (EDT)

Mount Batukaru

I noticed you placed Mount Batukaru in the article with Tabanan, but I think it fits better with Bedugul. It's much closer to Bedugul, and travelers can drive to or from Bedugul on the scenic Jatiluwih route. When driving on that route, you can see the mountain being closeby. Tabanan is completely in the south of Central Bali, while Mount Batukaru is in the north. Globe-trotter 10:22, 21 September 2009 (EDT)

Yes, we can keep it at Tabanan, but then I think it's best to move the Jatiluwih rice fields to there as well, as it is very close to the mountain. Globe-trotter 10:58, 21 September 2009 (EDT)

Bali map

Hey there. You are doing an awesome job on our Bali articles. I wonder if you have an .svg file of the Bali map you made. I'd love to Wikitravel-ize the map, i.e., give it our standard icons, fonts, water color, logo, legend style, title style, etc. per Wikitravel:How to draw a map. Could you supply that? (or do it yourself if you like). Texugo 04:46, 27 September 2009 (EDT)

Welcome messages

The easy way to do a welcome message is {{subst:welcome}} which gives:

Hello, Burmesedays! Welcome to Wikitravel.

To help get you started contributing, we've created a tips for new contributors page, full of helpful links about policies and guidelines and style, as well as some important information on copyleft and basic stuff like how to edit a page. If you need help, check out Wikitravel:Help, or post a message in the travellers' pub.

After that, you can add your own comments. Pashley 00:13, 29 September 2009 (EDT)

Bold for redirected names

Tiny style tip which probably isn't even documented anywhere: if a name X is redirected to article Y, it's good practice to bold the name in the article, so confused users can understand why they were sent there. Eg. "Seminyak is a town which has grown to include the nearby villages of Kerobokan, Umalas etc." Jpatokal 08:25, 30 September 2009 (EDT)


Hi! I started in early 2009 to redo the Ko_Samui article. As you start with Thailand you should know that AoT has messed up the articles and with support of Peter and Jani started to clear smaller parts. That's just for your info, so feel free to adapt the data input of AoT. Most articles are obvious messed up by data dumps. jan 10:25, 6 October 2009 (EDT)


Mate! Our friend Felix505 under his anonymus IP has "found" the Senggigi article and guess: repetitions as far as you can see. I started with the cleaning and deleted primarly links to the Senggigi article that links to Senggigi etc. Would be great if you could help out a bit...jan 04:20, 8 October 2009 (EDT)

Tour listings

If you want to erase links from the Berlin tour page, do so after scrutinizing the link against the wikitravel tour listing guidelines. A blanket delete will only end up in a revert.



We don't really use these a lot, and I kinda like how they are not subject to the same rampant inflation they have on Wikipedia, but I think you deserve one for all the all the hard work in central Indonesia, and helping out with the touts! ----Stefan (sertmann) Talk 08:32, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

Congratulations! Stefan you are right it is rarely used and the major rewrite of Bali and Indonesia deserves the barn star! Keep up the great work, jan 08:42, 20 October 2009 (EDT)
Well thank you very much Stefan :) I am not sure if I deserve one of those (rather attractive it must be said) things. All the work on the Indonesian articles is just driven by passion and well, because the country deserves it. And help with battling the touts? Well, everyone else's work here deserves that. I will try to continue to do my best. --Burmesedays 09:15, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

Mount Tambora

wow i looked at the image of it its huge you been to the top of it? amazing... Gullsofpeace 11:03, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

nah sadly not. Only a handful of non-Indonesians ever make it each year. A truly brutal place to both get to and climb. It is top of my list but I doubt I will ever get there and even if I did, not at all sure I could make it.--Burmesedays 11:10, 20 October 2009 (EDT)
sounds and looks like a hard place to climb and get to. Gullsofpeace 11:08, 20 October 2009 (EDT) thanks for the info though. Gullsofpeace 11:08, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

West Bali NP

Lest you think I forgot, I am indeed hard at work on that Bali regions map ;) Could you find some image that shows the official boundaries of the entire park? I haven't been able to come up with anything, and this is thwarting my perfectionist aims with the map. --Peter Talk 23:13, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

I had not forgotten :) On the complete boundaries of West Bali NP...... you would think that is easy. It isn't. But let me have another go at finding this via official channels. The problem is especially with defining the eastern boundaries. By the way, please do not hesitate to ask if you have any other queries at all about this map Peter. --Burmesedays 23:27, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

Bali map discussion moved to Shared:Image_talk:Bali_regions_map.png. --Burmesedays 11:04, 21 October 2009 (EDT)

FYI, I uploaded a new version, and it's probably ready to go live, but I thought I'd wait for you to look over it once more. --Peter Talk 18:45, 26 October 2009 (EDT)
Great stuff Peter and I have commented on the image talk page. A few little corrections required but nothing major and the map is, as you surmised, pretty much ready to go live. I personally do not much like the monochromatic colour scheme but that is a personal opinion and nothing more. --Burmesedays 05:45, 27 October 2009 (EDT)

Bali for star nomination

Hi Burmeseday, I just wonder if you would be interested in bringing Bali up for the star article nominations? I think it would be great if we feature the article as DotM with the star lable but your support would be essential for it as you are on the island.jan 03:41, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

Hi Jan. That has certainly been on my mind. The bar is extremely high to get a region up to Star but that is definitely the aim. Please though let it rest for month or so as there is a lot going on right now with producing maps for the Bali articles. And some of the older Bali articles really need a lot of work on See, Do and all listings. So my reaction is a definite yes, but let us look at it again in one month when most of the maps will be finished. Cheers. --Burmesedays 03:59, 23 October 2009 (EDT)
Hi, simply drop me a line when you want to start. I have seen the discussion about the maps and it's a good start.jan 04:44, 23 October 2009 (EDT)
All good Jan and will do of course. Have a look at Bedugul please. That's my first WT style map uploaded. Can and will do a lot better, but at least the map now looks right.--Burmesedays 04:50, 23 October 2009 (EDT)
Just to highlight how difficult this will be, here is the bar for Region Star:
  • Has a tourist-style map showing all the linked cities, subregions, and other destinations (all guide status or better) and routes between them. The format either matches the manual of style exactly or is the exception that proves the rule. Prose is not only near-perfect grammatically but also tight, effective, and enjoyable. The article is well illustrated throughout with high quality photos.
All the sub-articles at guide or better.... whoa! I mistakenly had it in my head that the sub-regions and key destinations had to be guide but not all of them ! With the best will in the world, I ain't got a clue how the likes of Negara and Klungkung could ever be guides..... --Burmesedays 13:50, 24 October 2009 (EDT)
It's not quite that strict. Only the linked destinations need to be at guide status—that means all the 5–9 articles listed under "regions," "cities," and "other destinations." So neither Negara nor Klungkung would need to be at guide status. Getting all the regions to guide status is the hardest requirement, IMO. That and the main article will need to be beautiful ;) It would be quite an accomplishment to get this to star status—it would be the first star region on Wikitravel! --Peter Talk 23:58, 24 October 2009 (EDT)
Thanks for the clarification. This is on the backburner Peter because of the demands of the current Bali map project. But it has to be the ultimate aim, as tough as it seems. --Burmesedays 01:22, 25 October 2009 (EDT)

Bedugul and other Bali article maps

Nice work! The main issue I'd bring up is font. Listings icons should use Sans Bold (Bit Stream Vera Sans Bold or DejaVu Sans Bold). Both look the same, but the Deja Vu fonts [2] are preferable, since they have support for non-Latin alphabets (so maps can be easily translated into Russian, Korean, etc.). I've played around with those a lot for maximum readability, and have uploaded the districts map template I use for myself here.

You'll notice that the same template suggests bolded fonts for all other map labels. That is because bolded Sans fonts stay readable even at very low resolutions. Using DejaVu Sans Condensed is another option, although I've never been too sure what Jani thinks of its readability. As a rule with city/district maps (not with region maps) the only text I leave unbolded is that which I use in the listings list (below See, Eat, etc.). (If I'm not being clear, take a look at this example.) The few bits of text that read as "notes" might be fine if left unbolded, though, like "Great views from this area." Perhaps put it in parentheses, shrink it, italicize it, and even lighten the font color a bit? And since it is somewhere between a "city" and a "region" map, it might be OK to leave the town names unbolded as well. I'm starting to sound convoluted, so let me say clearly that the See, Eat, Drink, etc. headers should be bold, as should be the scale icon's text, and the map title text.

The water fill color looks great on the web, but is hard to distinguish from the foreground grey color when printed in black & white. So I'd use the fill pattern available from the template I linked above. Inkscape does not yet handle patterns well, so if you are having trouble getting it to render nicely, let me know.

For WTP, maps should be exported precisely at 3008 x 1709 pixels. You can use the thin green rectangular object in my map template as a frame (just remove the line color before exporting), as it is already set to those dimensions.

It might be nice to add arrows to designate which way is "to Lovina." If you don't feel like cooking one up, you could just grab one from my Korea map. I'd also italicize that text.

Cool temple icon, by the way. I'd suggest removing the background from it though, to make it look a little cleaner.

That's all I can think of at the moment! --Peter Talk 16:52, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

Great feedback as I expected :). The very fact that you have been through this process and figured out so many of the pitfalls that are far from obvious, is of enormous help to Johnny-Come-Lately here. I will certainly utilise those resources you have created. I have to say that even with a greyscale screen render, the indistinct nature of the water objects was bugging me. You have probably gathered that I have been fairly religious in following the guidance at Wikitravel:How to draw a map. It is now clear though that Wikitravel maps have moved on a bit since that was written. Jani has already put me straight on fixing the output dimensions. Invaluable guidance Peter and hugely appreciated. --Burmesedays 21:48, 23 October 2009 (EDT)
Re Seminyak map: Looks great! I still would strongly recommend that you use the travel icons from Image:Template for districts.svg. They'll be much more readable at low resolutions. In addition to using the water pattern, you should also use the "park" pattern for those green areas--in addition to having a distinguishing pattern, the color is of much greater contrast with the grey. --Peter Talk 04:22, 24 October 2009 (EDT)
Thanks Peter. I have looked at Image:Template for districts.svg and you are so right. Far better icons. To be frank, the detailed information at Wikitravel:How to draw a map and the map template there especially, is now so out of date as to be nigh on useless. I will definitely change icons on all 3 maps I have done so far.
Ah, yes actually, all listings should be marked on the map ;) That can get very tricky when you have a lot of listings for a small area (this one was near impossible). When they just don't fit, I've been using "zoom in boxes" like those you'll see here. John has played around with a different idea that's probably a bit more elegant and easier to draw (see example. Now of course, everyone will be thrilled if you make any sort of map, but to get an article up to star status, it must have a WT map with every listing in the article marked. --Peter Talk 16:31, 24 October 2009 (EDT)
Oh God. I feared you might say something like that. Well at least that gives motivation to cull some of the less helpful sleep listings :). Seminyak for example has 19 private villas/houses in the sleep listings. It has been suggested before (by Jani I seem to remember) that the sleep listings in Bali need severe culling....... I am now in full agreement :). There is also an issue when a listing is not actually in the area covered by the map. Does not happen often but it will for sure in some more rural areas. I intended to use an arrow with a km distance marker... eg Hotel xx 3 km --> . And I finally got to grips with pattern rendering in Inkscape and have changed the water and green area patterns. I am getting some irritating grid lines in these patterns though. I will try to sort that. --Burmesedays 22:08, 24 October 2009 (EDT)

The grid lines are the most annoying part (hopefully this will be fixed in the next version of Inskcape), as well as the fact that you can't handle the scale of the pattern. The first isn't too hard to deal with—just make a copy of the object, move it below the original, and fill the color from the blue part of the pattern. Here's what I told Marc when he asked for a condescending level of detail to fix the latter issue:

  1. Ctrl+D to duplicate the patterned water object
  2. Move the duplicate out of the way
  3. Downsize the duplicate (Ctrl+<) until the pattern is displaying on it at a more aesthetically pleasing size
  4. Move the duplicate to the bottom of the layer (END)
  5. Combine the original patterned water object with the now-downsized duplicate (Ctrl+k) (At this point the pattern should be at the desired size on the original object)
  6. Break apart (Ctrl+Shift+k) the original object from the duplicate (following their combination in the last step)
  7. Delete the duplicate

--Peter Talk 00:03, 25 October 2009 (EDT)

Nice tip.... thanks very much for that. You know what Peter, this whole discussion ought to be copied into or linked from Wikitravel:How to draw a map. The help you have given me here should be easily available to all users who are getting started with WT-style maps. --Burmesedays 01:14, 25 October 2009 (EDT)
I've resisted rewriting that guide in order to avoid stepping on toes and pushing my own style on others, but indeed, it might be time to do so. --Peter Talk 01:58, 25 October 2009 (EDT)

Subregion maps

Whew, I'm having to rack my brain to come up with some examples for you—there are very few maps yet created for regions at the "bottom" of the hierarchy (i.e., regions with no further subregions). All I can think of are the ones I made (long ago) for the obscure regions of Nenetsia and South Ossetia. Both are a little too basic in content and archaic in style to be very helpful, I'm afraid.

As far as possible, I would recommend making the subregion maps in exactly the same sort of style as the Bali region map, just with a greater level of detail, and with a solid grey foreground, rather than colored regions. Mark cities with the usual dots; use the light blue squares to mark non-municipality destinations. It's fine to use white colored roads, and that can especially be useful to designate tertiary roads (red = principal; yellow = secondary). With your incredibly deep knowledge of the area, though, I imagine you'll have content you'd like to add that won't fit so neatly into this formula, so please feel free to experiment. I'll be glad to "proofread" one and clean things up where I think it would be useful. --Peter Talk 23:38, 31 October 2009 (EDT)

While not perfect for this application, perhaps these could serve as some inspiration too:
--Stefan (sertmann) talk 23:51, 31 October 2009 (EDT)
Many thanks Peter and Stefan. I will get going on that basis and stick a draft up on shared for your comment. I think I will start with East Bali. --Burmesedays 03:23, 1 November 2009 (EST)
This looks great! The only criticism that comes to mind is that you forgot to give me credit, as it is a derivative work of Image:Bali regions map.png ;) Otherwise, any improvements would probably be additions, rather than corrections. I'm also glad to see that you were able to create the map from the main Bali map without retracing—that's a goal with region maps, but often a hard one to meet. It sure saves time in the long run, though! --Peter Talk 16:48, 1 November 2009 (EST)
Thanks Peter. The re-tracing comment is sadly not really correct, although I did try to figure out a way to avoid this. It is certainly derivative though and large apologies for forgetting to credit you. I used your main Bali regions map as the backdrop for re-tracing (together with OSM) and this definitely saved time but did not remove the need for tracing.. It was quite late when I finished the draft yesterday and looking again with fresh eyes this morning, I am quite pleased and this is a decent model to use for low level region maps I think. As an aside, the inability of Inkscape to scale patterns is really annoying me now. --Burmesedays 21:05, 1 November 2009 (EST)


Please stop deleting my contributions to the Philadelphia page. I am doing this for a very important school project and everything on here is an advertisement! is a website that I frequent being a NATIVE of Philadelphia, which tourists comming to my city can appreciate and save money on thier travels!

Star nominations: Diving the Cape Peninsula and False Bay/Pinnacle

Hi Burmesedays, I have fixed a number of issues, including work on some of the items you commented on, in the dive site sub-article Pinnacle. If you have the time, would you mind taking a look to see if you like the results, and leave comment either on the article talk page, or on the star nominations page. Peter (Southwood) Talk 02:26, 7 November 2009 (EST)

More updates, including revised map. Cheers, and thanks for your help. -- Peter (Southwood) Talk 04:43, 14 November 2009 (EST)

Booking dot com is on the blacklist

Hi Burmeseday! I added booking dot com on the blacklist and it should work from now on. Thanks for your work. jan 04:59, 11 November 2009 (EST)


Hello, please, why you think, that my edit is "all going in the wrong article in the wrong places"? where is right article and right place? --Prague-boy 07:56, 13 November 2009 (EST)

hello, thanks for your answear. I will try to do better.

Hello again, one more question - you wrote about link to forums, but page, which i linked is not forum and its not my page. There are fresh news from real Prague citizens with many experience from real Prague live. I think it could be very helpful for Prague visitors, what you think? --Prague-boy 09:07, 13 November 2009 (EST)

Ok, but why WT never links to facebook page? WT is full of links to commercial pages and page i linked to is much more valuable and uncommercial... --Prague-boy 09:48, 13 November 2009 (EST)


Thanks a bunch for helping out patrolling new edits, it's greatly needed, and we are always far behind - so, yeah, thanks! A few things to make the process smoother though

  • Please go to your preferences, select the recent changes tab, and tick 'Enchanted recent changes' if you haven't already done so, it may look a bit awkward at first, it sure did for me, but it quickly becomes indispensable.
  • Once you've done that, remember to click the [Mark as patrolled] under the "Current revision" details. If you've enabled the enchanted view above, you mark all revisions as patrolled this way.

That would save us from doing double duties, I've run into a fair bit of edits today that you had already patrolled. In case you haven't noticed, the !'s in the recent changes page, denotes edits from users active less than 3 months, which haven't been checked. Cheers --Stefan (sertmann) talk 13:58, 19 November 2009 (EST)

Hmmm, you really don't see those red exclamation marks in front of the time stamp? they might not be there if someone has recently been patrolling comprehensively, but they will usually be there, and should look something like this:
! 02:37 Taunton (Massachusetts) (diff; hist) . . (+123) . . Lesmclok (Talk | contribs | block) (→Splurge - )
If you only have the 50 most recent edits enabled which I think is default, they might be harder to spot, I personally have the latest 250, this can be set in the Recent Changes tab of your preferences - also since you don't seem to have sniffed around in there too much, I just want to make sure you know that you can disable the ads in the the Wikitravel tab. --Stefan (sertmann) talk 20:49, 22 November 2009 (EST)

Taiwan map

Looks beautiful! --Peter Talk 10:31, 20 November 2009 (EST)

Cambodia regions

My knowledge of Cambodian cultural geography is 0. I could do some more research after eating and then recovering from my turkey feast, but that will have to wait until the tryptophan wears off ;) I'd ask Jani—I think he's pretty familiar with the country. --Peter Talk 14:26, 26 November 2009 (EST)

Shiny Buttons

It's customary to ask someone if they're interested before nominating, so would you have any interest in gaining some shiny buttons? Based on your contributions here there would seem to be no doubt of a quick approval, and it will probably save you some time having access to the revert, block, and protect buttons. -- Ryan • (talk) • 22:57, 29 November 2009 (EST)

Done. While writing the nomination I realized that I've assumed you are a "he" despite any indication one way or another on your user page, so if I've got that wrong let me know and I'll fix the nomination :) -- Ryan • (talk) • 23:39, 29 November 2009 (EST)

Europa, UK, England

i can list some outlines for you. Jun9Kinak 10:24, 2 December 2009 (EST)

Ko Tao diving bumph

I have cut almost everything and put in links, and transferred it to Diving in Thailand#Ko Tao where it is potentially useful. I will prune the touting and both articles will be improved. You may wish to re-arrange the links. Cheers, -- Peter (Southwood) Talk 04:18, 7 December 2009 (EST)

Actually the system of dive guides allows them scope for enticing customers by providing good site guides, so they can legitimately and acceptably publicise Ko Tao by providing good information for the travelling diver. As long as they can live with us cutting the bullshit, its a win-win situation. Keep alerting me when this sort of thing comes up, or if you like just cut and paste the raw text to a reasonably appropriate place in one of the dive guide articles and I will clean it up as I have most of them on my watchlist. Important to put in the links though. -- Peter (Southwood) Talk 08:24, 7 December 2009 (EST)

Ditto Ko Lanta

Done. Peter (Southwood) Talk 06:44, 15 December 2009 (EST)

North Korea vandal

The place to bring up a ban for would be Wikitravel:User ban nominations, but I'm not convinced it would be effective -- it's a tool that is rarely used, and it's impossible to ban someone that's dedicated to causing mischief if all they need to do is come in from a different IP address. Since that's a residential, cable modem address, it would be trivially easy for them to do. I'd definitely support blacklisting the tour agency they're pushing, though.

As it is, the problem user is slow enough that it's probably easiest to just keep up with the manual reversions until they give up. (If it were high-speed vandalism, a block would be more effective, if only as a way to ensure they saw a "read your talk page" message.) In a way, I think it helps that North Korea is such a contentious article in general -- it means more people are keeping an eye on it!

Unfortunately, there's no way to put a Special:Contributions page on your watchlist, so it's not always easy to spot it when they edit other articles. Peter keeps a manual list that he checks, User:Peterfitzgerald/Touts. I've stumbled across another simple way of spotting them -- since I usually only check the contributions of an anonymous IP if they've been up to no good, then they show up as a previously-visited link on Special:Recentchanges, which catches my eye. Crude and unplanned, but surprisingly effective. - D. Guillaime 02:00, 10 December 2009 (EST)


I noticed you have been to Muscat, so I wondered if you might have an idea on how best to deal with Matrah. It is listed as a city in Muscat Province, but we only have an article for Muscat City. The Oman page states that the Muscat page represents the "area", which sounds like it should cover the province or it was created by someone who is not familiar with the area and dealt with it in the best way that they could. Either way, do you think Matrah should be merged into Muscat to cover the "area" or should it have its own article? It's currently listed as a city inside Muscat, which is poor organization. I would merge it now, but I'd like to know what someone who has been there thinks before I mess with something I don't know about. ChubbyWimbus 02:13, 15 December 2009 (EST)

If there is a parent Muscat article, though, do you think Matrah would be better to stay as a city? Are there many other cities in the Muscat province/area that could be listed under the parent article? I looked at the talk page discussion you posted, but alas, my knowledge is near nothing on the nation, so I'm afraid I'm not much help there... ChubbyWimbus 03:36, 15 December 2009 (EST)
Until the country is properly regionalised, it is hard to get a clear picture. I am fairly sure though that Matrah is not really a separate article. If the city of Muscat were districtified, then it could be along with Ruwi and others (but that will never be necessary). From a traveller's POV, Matrah is no more a separate city than Westminster or Southwark are separate cities from London. On the regions I suspect we will end up with only 3 or 4 (including the Empty Quarter).--Burmesedays 03:50, 15 December 2009 (EST)


Welcome to the admin club! The guide to your new shiny buttons is here.

In unrelated news, I'll be in Bali from Jan 8 to 12 (Seminyak & Ubud), let me know if you'd be up for lunch or a drink. Jpatokal 07:24, 15 December 2009 (EST)

Of course! That would be great providing I am here and at the moment that looks likely. And I will unearth somewhere suitably OtBP for lunch:). --Burmesedays 07:29, 15 December 2009 (EST)

London work

You're very welcome, and thanks for the encouraging comments! I have no problem with changing some of the categories I created. Basically there were too many listings in "Pubs and bars" so I attempted to classify them a bit. I thought "Music club" would be good for the ones geared towards listening to live music with a cocktail in-hand...the swankier places into "Bars" and the hole-in-the-wall places with a friendly neighbor also lurking at the end of the bar "Pubs." I'm glad to have done the work and certainly have no issue with you re-categorizing. Thanks again for the note and comments you've made! Cheers!Zepppep 16:19, 17 December 2009 (EST)

Star for Bali

Nice to see it there at last. Cheers, Peter (Southwood) Talk 09:33, 1 January 2010 (EST)

London cotm

Since you were so instrumental in making the London cotm our most successful collaboration of all time, I thought you might like to look over the results. Thanks again for your help! --Peter Talk 14:13, 1 January 2010 (EST)


Dear Sir, My most humble applogies should I have offended anybody. I have very little experience in your world and fully appreciate your guidance.

Pemba Dive & Bush Camp was developed on request by travellers and has provided a service that has been which are the following: PEACE & QUIET: No traffic, no loud music, no loud noises till early hours of the morning. SAFETY: (I have received clients robbed with broken bones)We have a clean history. ACTIVITIES: - The last fourteen years travellers complained there is nothing to do. The Dive Lodge is offering 15 activities for free. BUDGET: free coffe/tea, ativities, service. ORIANTATION: Put detailed information on the web. A notice board is up with different Islands, venues and sightseeing locations. SOLLUTIONS: Often we receive tourists with problems who are not our clients that have been in a tight spot or robbed and we have solved all problems, because of the conservation and community service we have given in Pemba. My husband was born in Pemba.

The traveller now has a CHOICE with the two camping locations and we do complement each other very well and neither are the best. Overlander rate the camp site "Excellant". Kingley Holgate quoted "The best Base Camp in the Southern Hemisphere" The two above had a choice where they wanted to stay! The community with pride have rated "El Pirate" kite boarding and "Pemba Dive & Bush Camp" the two best places in Pemba. Pemba has a bad reputation of being very expensive and we have accommodated this.

Does a new lodge that has just been developed according to the popular requests of travellers gets throwen out, without an explination or email. I understand you are over whelmed with so many emails fully appriciate your time. What do you recommend tourism would like to read. Thank you. Happy New Year to you and keep up your great work. Kind regards

Brenda Franck [email protected]

Sub-regionalising Cambodia

You asked me about Sub-regionalising Cambodia. - Huttite 05:58, 3 January 2010 (EST)

Hi there. I am wondering why you have inserted a sub-regional level into Eastern Cambodia? I am very sure that the country does not require this extra level, and if you think it does, would it not be best to discuss on the country talk page first? If you look at the regionlist table on the country page it is clear that it goes Cambodia -> Region -> City/OD. The provinces are listed in each regional article to avoid any confusion. Also at Eastern Cambodia you have wikilinked the provinces to existing city articles. --Burmesedays 04:59, 3 January 2010 (EST)

My reply is:

I noted that you reverted the edit of User:Killersnack who attempted to place Sen Monorom into the Cambodia city listings, without then attempting to relocate the new, and now orphaned, article into a better location. Nor did you personally explain to User:Killersnack what was wrong. Another administrator later reverted a second edit by that user to the Cambodia page. To me it seems the Cambodia page is now closed to new cities and the regions now need to be built out upon.
With Eastern Cambodia, I merely to linked to the names given to the regions, if the cities have the same names as their provinces then there should be a disambiguation page or something else mentioned there to indicate that there is ambiguousness. In any case, I suspect from your comments that you have no desire to build out those provinces at this time. I built out the province for Sen Monorom so that the breadcrumb listing would display correctly and because I perceived the place might not find a home anywhere else.
Lastly, Wikitravel:Plunge forward means there is no need to ask permission first, only forgivness afterwards. Sorry if I have upset your country scheme but there was nothing mentioned on Talk:Eastern Cambodia about why the regions were not wikilinked and I had thought it would help travelers to wikilink them. I had understood that this was also the implication of the Wikitravel:Geographical hierarchy.
Essentially because Sen Monorom exists as valid article, Mondulkiri and the other provinces also need to exist as articles if you are going to limit the number of cities in Cambodia, and its regions, to 9. Otherwise, where can they be placed? - Huttite 05:49, 3 January 2010 (EST)
First, I really did not say that permission is needed to do anything! Rather, I inquired as to why you thought another regional level was required. I do think (and this is backed up by normal practice here) that regionalisation of a country should be discussed and fully understood before structural changes are made.
My fault with Sen Monorom - it should have been added to the city list at Eastern Cambodia when I removed it from the 9 (that is not a limit I impose by the way - it is Wikitravel policy). Apologies for that. I did leave a comment with the edit as to why it was reverted. It is simply impossible to inform each user why their edit has been reverted but I do often leave a comment in the edit history.
There may be a time when we have too many cities for the four Cambodia region articles, but we are far from that at the moment. If further regionalised, Eastern Cambodia for example, would have four provincial articles with only four cities between them! Sen Monorom's correct home in the structure is as part of Eastern Cambodia. The other reason not to do this based simpy on Provincies is that the provinces are split in some cases. For example, you will see if you look closely that Kratie province to the east of the Mekong River is in Eastern Cambodia and to the west of the river it is in Mekong Lowlands and Central Plains. Sometimes geography is much much appropriate than political lines when regionalising.
The other place to put any cities which you fear will be orphaned is into the country regionlist table itself. You will see that there is a slot there for each city in each region. Cheers. --Burmesedays 07:11, 3 January 2010 (EST)

Persistent touts

Regarding your comment about a consistent extlink violation, if it is excessive don't be afraid to put them on the blacklist, but be sure to leave a comment on Wikitravel talk:Local spam blacklist so that there is a pointer as to why the link was added. In the past this has been a very effective way of getting someone's attention, and it's easy enough to remove them once they agree to abide by the site policies. Also, I've yet to notice you taking advantage of your new "rollback" button - if an edit can be reverted with the need for comment (such as obvious vandalism) it's a handy tool and a bit quicker than the "undo" button :) -- Ryan • (talk) • 21:35, 4 January 2010 (EST)

Re: your comments on my talk page, you're all good with how you seem to be using the blacklist - some people never use it, some people use it rarely, some people may use it too much (sadly I may be guilty of this...), and other people just aren't comfortable with it so they choose to let others handle it. As to rollbacks, the two main advantages of "rollback" over "undo" is that "rollback" removes all consecutive contributions from a user (undo is one-at-a-time), and it also saves a screen - changes are reverted immediately, while "undo" takes you to the edit screen first. Otherwise you're right that "undo" is very similar. Cheers! -- Ryan • (talk) • 21:53, 4 January 2010 (EST)


--KillerGhoulSlaya2457 03:34, 5 January 2010 (EST)


Hi - Why did you delete Safari Care from the Arusha page ? It doesn't seem any different from the other safari companies listed there. I don't have any connection to them, I'm just wondering/making sure my understanding of WT's guidelines is consistent. Thanks. - Alingelb 13:54, 6 January 2010 (EST)

Thanks for your response. I took a look at Safari Care's site, and in fact they do have a local address. So, I added them back, and put the other listings in tags, and removed one that did not appear to have a local address. My thinking is: these companies fit the criteria (local address, probably adding value), seem to have it together as they have decent web sites, and most importantly, as a visitor, I would probably want to know about them. If you disagree I certainly defer to your expertise - just undo my edit and I won't bother the page again. - Alingelb 17:57, 7 January 2010 (EST)


--FourGreenLights 01:56, 8 January 2010 (EST)

Camping Croatia

(Moved from my user page) --Burmesedays 11:02, 10 January 2010 (EST)

Dear Sir, can you please explain why some links are deleted and others not? And if there is a payment link? Because I do not see another reason.Link to charter companies you leave but link to camp site you erase. I'm talking about page

Can you please answer my? I'm very interested for this.

Thank you for all information. I will tray put information about camping like you tell my. I will send to you information about this.

Hello, I put my information like you tell my but some thing, informations was delete.

Public Domain Pic

I got it from a forum site, posted by someone, I don't know if it has rights or not but it was publicly posted in that forum; [3], scroll down and you'll see it. You can feel free to delete it if you want to :) there are other pics that I have picked from google, that I think don't have rights due to no labels written on it. You can delete those pics if you want to, i don't really mind. The two pics in the DO SECTION other than Bacollywood is taken from the website of Provincial government sites of Bacolod and Neg. Occ. Cheers :)

SnappyHip 04:07PM, 12 January 2010 (UTC)


Hi Burmeseday. First, I hope you had a good start in the new year and had some time to relax! I have seen that you also patrol quite often Recent changes. Could you please always use either undo, rollback or write hard remove with the user ID in the text? Ryan and myself started to systematically block user id's that are frequently used by spammers, vandals etc.? It has an effect as some IP number ranges seem to be more often spammers than others. Thanks and best regards from snowy Zurich jan 10:39, 14 January 2010 (EST)

Israel map

Thanks! I am still working on the map, will try to get the text in the white box to be readable as well. Was quite a work to use three different maps and make it something interesting, glad it worked. --globe-trotter 21:42, 13 January 2010 (EST)


Hi Burmesedays. I honestly do not understand why you keep moving the information about getting FROM Lembar Harbour. This is all specific information about leaving Lembar for other destinations. As what I understand information about getting FROM Lembar should be under GET OUT; information about getting TO Lembar should be under GET IN. Am I missing the point?

question about Yekaterinburg page

Hi! Could you please explain me why did you remove the information about our travel agency from the page about Yekaterinburg? I see, that this page already contains info about other agencies, that's why it's unclear to me. And tell me please if I can add this information using listings. Sunady 15:23, 17 January 2010 (EST)

Thank you very much for your answer! Sunady 09:14, 18 January 2010 (EST)

Beijing embassy section formatting

Hi Burmesedays! The embassy section for Beijing is displayed in a really akward way, at least in my browser. But I saw you’ve undone my changes, so I suppose you want to keep that kind of table markup. Should something like “| style="vertical-align:top;width:50%;" |” be added then? I saw that in other embassy sections (Copenhagen, London,…). Thanks!


Hmmm, do you have an equivalent template here? Tristan Thomas 17:34, 20 January 2010 (EST)


I noticed you were hoping for some help on the map expedition with regionalizing African countries. I have attempted to do so with Senegal: Talk:Senegal

Also, as a delayed response, your organization of Oman looks good! ChubbyWimbus 00:28, 22 January 2010 (EST)

Good Work on those maps! However I noticed a small mistake on your map from Lao PDR, the place in the upper right should be Nong Kiau not 'Nong Thiaw'

Many thanks for that. Sometimes you look at a map so closely you are almost blind to it. I will change. The spelling used at WT is actually Nong Khiaw. Thanks again. --Burmesedays 02:59, 25 January 2010 (EST)


Hi Burmesedays! I do not agree with all your changes you made on this article today. See the discussion of the article. Hans-Jürgen Wiese 22:20, 26 January 2010 (EST)

Replied in some depth at Talk:Ruhr. --Burmesedays 19:58, 26 January 2010 (EST)

Removing Paws for Cats and Dogs, Fort Bragg, CA?

At 04:42, 26 January 2010, you undid revision 1362633 due to zero interest for a visitor

Zero interest? I respectfully disagree. The contribution is specifically for recreational vehicle travelers with pets.

--, 21:41, 27 January 2010

Hampstead star

First British star—I hadn't realized that at the time. Kudos on that! --Peter Talk 00:03, 1 February 2010 (EST)

Thank you Peter. Until after the event, nor did I! :) --Burmesedays 00:27, 1 February 2010 (EST)


Hi! I just did the DotM change for February and when i updated the schedule for March i realised next change will be Bali. I took the first picture from the Bali article for the time being but maybe you have another one you prefer. I would be glad if you comment or change. Best regards from freezing Zurich, Jan

Roll 'em..

This edit [4], which you rolled back seemed to be in good faith (and a bit of work) to me. Maybe a bit harsh? --inas 21:11, 1 February 2010 (EST)

On reflection, you are probably right. I have reverted and will go through and copy edit instead. Thanks for that. --Burmesedays 22:24, 1 February 2010 (EST)
I think the general procedure is for a good faith edit that needs to be undone, is that it is undone and not rolled back, so an informative edit note can be left as to why the edit had to go. Rollbacks are generally just used for vandalism, etc, or repeated spam, etc. See Wikitravel:Administrator's handbook#Rollbacks. Personally, I think we should make a special effort to make a new editor making changes in good faith feel welcome, though.
I also noticed that commented that you blocked an ip for repeated vandalism for 1 momth. Any blocks (except spambots) for a substantial period of time need be discussed at Wikitravel:User ban nominations, see Wikitravel:How to handle unwanted edits, unless they are a spambot. --inas 06:10, 2 February 2010 (EST)


Ought we to have a London bus subsection in the UK article? Perhaps it would fit better in the London article? Andyfarrell 03:32, 2 February 2010 (EST)

I agree. Already well covered in London. --Burmesedays 04:45, 2 February 2010 (EST)


Hello! I would like to know if my last contributions are worthy. I hope that we have worked well. Please do not delete redirects. Best regards, Mr. man 08:11, 2 February 2010 (EST)

I was nominated because I want to help project sir, are up with these policies, but if there are other, ok, I will read. Thanks. Mistertalk 08:36, 2 February 2010 (EST)


Regarding this guy, I'd advise to just revert everything and otherwise ignore him. We get tons of hotel spam from that ip range, which is associated with some marketing firm. I have successfully in the past made contact with this type of marketer, and got him to "reform" and do a better job with the listings, but ultimately what was the benefit? We got a ton of barely acceptable listings all at the behest of whoever pays marketers to spam our pages, and it wasted a ton of other users' time to monitor and clean up. So, best to just revert on sight when you see a hotel tout doing these sorts of mass spammings across multiple pages. Also, for a laugh, see User:Peterfitzgerald/Touts. --Peter Talk 12:25, 3 February 2010 (EST)

Yeah I know it is all probably a waste of time. It is an Indian company, either an SEO consultant or marketeer. I will continue to block this IP everytime I see it, as I spent a huge amount of time reverting their edits. There may even be a case here for banning the specific IPs. I know this is generally thought to be a waste of time, but when looking at these 122.169 IPs, they seem to be fixed. A ban would at least mean that this company cannot post to WT using their corporate ISP. --Burmesedays 22:38, 3 February 2010 (EST)


Don't you ever go to sleep ;-) 00:18, 4 February 2010 (EST)

Frequently. But not often at 1.20 in the afternoon :).--Burmesedays 00:20, 4 February 2010 (EST)


Thanks for your advice on maps, ClausHansen 07:47, 5 February 2010 (EST)


Congratulations! And nice map—extra points for the creative touches showing the two levels of detail ;) It's very gratifying to hear that my cheerleading played a role in the development of such an excellent guide (to which I've never been)! --Peter Talk 11:19, 8 February 2010 (EST)

Diving in Saipan

I've gone through the Category:Articles needing attention and this caught my eye; Dive sites of Saipan and Dive sites of saipan, I don't know if one should be merged, moved or deleted but these articles really need attention. -SnappyHip 18:27, 10 February 2010 (GST)


In the Discussion page, a guy posted a note that anything from his site can be used, does this mean he already released it as public domain and can be freely used in the site as well? , Already checked it out in his talk page and it really violates the copyright laws -SnappyHip

Discriminaton on Romanian WikiTravel

Sir, please help me on the Romanian Wikitravel I block all accounts Mr. Vlad. Please tell me to unlock this account even consider it discrimination. Please tell you this. --Ervin C. 09:04, 11 February 2010 (EST)

Hello! Please forgive me for not having put you too in the loop: --Vlad 09:38, 11 February 2010 (EST)

Sir, I can not discuss that issue there are blocked, just unblock me where we can talk there. --Ervin C. 10:05, 11 February 2010 (EST)

No capitals in directions

Hi Burmesedays, I noticed that you made some minor changes in the Nusa Lembongan article. In the accommodation listings (and other listings) you made the directions starting with a capital letter. I don't think that is correct, because directions are between brackets and most of the times not even a sentence. Please read: [5] You see, I am getting an experienced Wikitravel author :-) Whatsinaname 15:00, 12 February 2010 (EST)


Hey, I just wanted to ask, if I'm starting a Province article what kind of template should be used? Thanks, cheers. - SnappyHip 11:45, 15 February 2010 (GST)

Burry Port

Hi, yesterday you edited my Burry Port page, by deleting the photos because of copyright reasons. I was wondering where is there a resource that i can get copyright free photos from? i thought yesterday, by referencing them as from Flikr that that'd be ok. obviously not...i'm very new to this so any help would be great. thanks KingFantastic


Just wanted to know why you deleted my additions to the Grahamstown page if you did.

It, and much else, is explained on your talk page. I guess you have not read that? --Burmesedays 04:31, 22 February 2010 (EST)

Read that now and am in the process of editing all my pages..Also very new to this so still getting used to the style etc. Is it possible for you to undivert my Grahmastown page and allow me the chance to edit it.

Sure I will do that, but please do not leave it too long before editing. Also, when leaving a comment on a talk page (only a talk page), please sign your name by clicking the 2nd button from the left on the tool bar of each edit screen (or just tpe 4 tildes if you prefer). Then well know who is saying what :) --Burmesedays 02:12, 23 February 2010 (EST)


I've just organized the contents of the Addo article, I am just inquiring what status should be given to the article? :) - User:SnappyHip 15:43, 23 February 2010 (GST)


Please do not insert incorrect information as you have done in the Cambodia article. Your insistence on reverting a flawed and bigoted claim is rather concerning. Please could you also not delete comments from other users talk pages.

I have never deleted a comment from another user's talk page. It would also help if you signed your message so I knew who I was talking to. I guess you are the person who is edit warring at Cambodia about French colonial plundering. That issue should be taken up at Talk:Cambodia.--Burmesedays 03:29, 25 February 2010 (EST)

Circumventing Gili Trawangan‎

I don't know if the Internet cafe was really called Lightening. Forgive me if my spelling checks are too enthusiastic for the likes of Indonesian islands. Great work on the article, btw. --inas 17:25, 25 February 2010 (EST)

Paris/3rd arrondissement

I have to disagree with you about the vacation rentals section in Sleep. These are legitimate long-standing apartment rental agencies that do provide places to "sleep". I believe this is useful information. Since there was nothing spammy about the inclusions, I'd like to hear your reasoning for deleting them. I've reverted them for now. Or do you think they should be under one of the sub-headings (eg Mid-range)? dgns13 10:33, 26 February 2010 (CET)

Bali is dotm

Hi Burmesedays! I just switched Bali to dotm for this month. Usually the switch results in an increase in spam because it is linked on the mainpage. I thank you for your excellent work that made Bali as dotm happen and hope you can enjoy it a bit this month. jan 05:40, 1 March 2010 (EST)


What tool do you use in making maps? :) your maps seem to be a lot better than the others. Have a nice day :). -SnappyHip 13:03, 4 March 2010 (GST)

Perth edits

I see that you reverted my reversion on the Perth page. I initialy reverted this edit because the info ("Watch out for lesbian mud wrestling after 2am on a Wednesday night/Thursday morning.") is not only wrong, its a somewhat offensive/homophobic. Connections is a gay club and while they certainly have lesbians, they dont have "lesbian mud wrestling" as an attraction. To avoid an edit war, I want to get your agreement to remove this info that, I believe, should not be there. Cardboardbird 20:15, 4 March 2010 (EST)


Can I ask why my entry for Roomzzz Manchester was deleted by yourself? I can see nothing wrong with the entry that I wrote, and complied with everything Wiki asks for

First, can you please open a Wikitravel account if you wish to communicate with other users. I should be leaving this message on your talk page, but as you do not have an acocunt, nor did you sign your name above, then that is not possible. I assume you are anonymous user who placed the listing for Roomzzz at Manchester.
The listing was deleted as you wrote an advertisement. This is not a free advertising board, and all listings, hotels and otherwise should be written in an objective, factual manner. Please read about our policies on touting and using flowery language, and you will see what I mean. After reading and understanding those pages, by all means re-write the listing using acceptable language and place it again. Cheers. --Burmesedays 10:00, 5 March 2010 (EST)

Blue Mountains Link

I've put up a reply to your post on the Blue Mountains page - keep the debate going - it is an interesting one.

Image in Kerala- the one u allege in Lonely planet

Dear Burumesedays

This image is from Wikipedia, an image from Wikicommons-

This is licensed to use in all wiki areas by the user. This is a free image and freely available on net. And I own this picture, with permission from its original user- Bimal K.C, a freelancer photographer and my friend, who has given permission to me.

All pictures currently in Kerala page, mostly belongs to wikicommons and used extensively in other wikipedia, thereby licensed use in Wikitravel


Yes thanks for that information. I will try to indicate source, from now onwards. Most of the images I have uploaded are from Wikicommons. Thanks for that information, as I was under impression that Wikitravel is part of Wikimedia project. Anyhow, I will ensure that such source information will be added. Regards-Arunvarmaother


Thanks for your comments on maps. I noticed that it is stated somewhere that park labels should be white, but it does not work if the park has a lot of white street, what do you suggest? And on the shading, how should it be done?, --ClausHansen 08:31, 11 March 2010 (EST)