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Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/2008

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The following are archived discussions from the Wikitravel:Travellers' pub. They should not be modified.


Can someone upload photos on my behalf?

Hello from a new Wikitravel contributor. I have a rather large collection of travel photos I would be happy to see used here, all online, but I have no time to upload them myself as we are travelling long-term and have limited net time. Can I somehow give people general permission to upload my shots with credit to me or our blog? Friedel

Newbie linkage question

Excuse the ignorance! What is the view on Special:Contributions/ this sort of contribs? Is it ok because it is on the talk page or is that just a way of getting around placing actual content. Cheers --Herby talk thyme 11:55, 7 January 2008 (EST)

List of dangling references

Just wondering if there is some way of generating a list of all dangling references (broken links) in Wikitravel? You know, stuff like North Cork or Mallow?--Wandering 19:31, 17 January 2008 (EST)

Try Special:Wantedpages. ~ 00:12, 19 January 2008 (EST)

Google custom search for Wikitravel researchers

For research for necessary details on attractions, restaurants and hotels I've created a custom search at Google: [1].

It only excludes known Wikitravel mirrors (so a researcher don't have to go through copies of the same content copied from Wikitravel he is already aiming to improve). Otherwise it should work just identical to Google search (at least until we find a way to improve it further).

Can it be helpful for someone? If so, where can I stick it? Wikitravel:Listings? Other ideas? --DenisYurkin 16:47, 27 January 2008 (EST)

I've just fixed it so it actually exclude the mirrors--before, it didn't for some reason. And I allowed volunteers to participate in improving it after approval--please tell who you are if you are willing to participate. --DenisYurkin 07:32, 2 February 2008 (EST)

Content from 'experts'

Hey, I had a question and was wondering what you all thought I should do. I am working for a rather famous travel expert and we have a large volume of content that I think should be somewhere in wikitravel as it pertains to the destinations, what to do at those destinations, improving the process of travel, and addressing current issues in the travel industry. The content is high-quality as the expert would not be in his position if his information was not valuable. However, it would violate the guidelines, and also is a conflict of interest if I were to begin posting links. I really do think this content would be valuable and raise the overall quality of the wikitravel guidelines, but there is also the issue of copyrights and give due credit to the author. So, what do you think? What should I do with the content?

I wanted to ask this before I started doing anything to find out what the community thought about 'expert' content. I refrained from using his name for now, as I don't want this to appear to be an effort to drive traffic to his website, and I posted it here because I think other 'experts' might want to contribute and are unsure how they can without violating the guidelines. Any and all suggestions are welcome. Thanks for your time.

Mpalmer22 11:03, 29 February 2008 (EST)

I'm not sure how it would violate the guidelines. If the expert is willing to release material under the appropriate license, feel free to start adding it. Copyright and due credit to the author would be handled as it is now for everybody else. Take a look at shared:Copyleft#Frequently_asked_questions to see how it's done. --Jonboy 13:56, 29 February 2008 (EST)

Trouble printing

I'm having trouble printing pages from Wikitravel and only this website. Is there a problem with the server? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talkcontribs) 13:42, 2008 March 5

The place to report bugs is shared:Category:Tech requests (see the note at the top of this page). I'm passing this bug report on to there. For future reference, this isn't much information; it might be hard for the engineers to make something of it. It would have been helpful to know: what pages did you have trouble with? What browser and what OS did you use? What kind of printer were you using? How did the problem manifest itself? JimDeLaHunt 17:25, 5 March 2008 (EST)
Thanks, Jim! Yes, more information will definitely be necessary to tackle this one. I'll be watching the Bug Reports for it. Thanks. JuCo 21:34, 18 March 2008 (EDT)

Test Page

Is there a Wikitravel test page? Sometimes it would be useful to able to fool around to see how Wiki markup works, and this shouldn't be done on any "real" pages. Thanks, Sailsetter 10:46, 20 March 2008 (EDT)

Yes indeed → Wikitravel:Graffiti wall --Peter Talk 13:43, 20 March 2008 (EDT)

Nifty new feature

This allows you to see what work has been done on all linked pages from one page: → Special:Recentchangeslinked/Maryland --Peter Talk 14:02, 21 March 2008 (EDT)

Discover alert

Warning warning Will Robinson! Wikitravel:Discover's queue is down to three articles at the moment, please help fill it up. Jpatokal 07:40, 22 March 2008 (EDT)

Roadmap nominations

Hmm.. I tried a rfc, keeping the page at the top of shared recentchanges for a while—time to start a ruckus in the pub.

Please come by shared:Roadmap#nominations to vote for feature request priorities!!!!

If the voting format isn't clear, just let me know, shoot me an email with your preferences, whatever, just vote. --Peter Talk 23:44, 25 March 2008 (EDT)

Texas edit war, wheee

So Texugo seems to have come up with his own personal region system for Texas, doesn't seem interested in discussing it, and has started reverting all my edits changing things back to the "official" system (or at least system used by all the state agencies). See User_talk:Texugo for my ignored attempts to open a discussion. Anyone feel like helping out? Jordanmills 12:17, 7 April 2008 (EDT)

The main discussion for this topic is here, and to make it clear, the subdividing that I have done has not affected the official 7 regions of Texas at all. The problem is that each of those sections is about the size of Pennsylvania and needs to be broken down further, something I've been working on for about a month, whereas this gentleman has come in and eliminated all my work in one evening without contributing any discussion whatsoever. Texugo 12:39, 7 April 2008 (EDT)
You pasted that two days ago, in a completely different context from our discussion at the time. Even if they are "sub-regions" (though your article edits call them regions), they're still confusing, unknown, often take the name of local regions used elsewhere. It's a nice idea, but it's just not practical. Jordanmills 12:51, 7 April 2008 (EDT)
Again, PLEASE contribute any comments on the Talk:Texas page. Texugo 12:56, 7 April 2008 (EDT)
It's right here, and I'm soliciting comments on your excessive reverts from wikitravel as a whole. Jordanmills 12:58, 7 April 2008 (EDT)
Don't be silly. It is you who tried to revert my long hours of work over the last month without comment. Where were you during the whole process? This is not about me anyhow. Please refer to Talk:Texas and stop wasting my time. Texugo 13:09, 7 April 2008 (EDT)
I've made some comments at Talk:Texas. See Talk:Washington (state)#Proposal to eliminate counties from hierarchy for a comparable project I led. I'm grateful to both Texugo and Jordanmills for their willingness to pay attention to the regional structure of Wikitravel. It's big, difficult work, but very important. JimDeLaHunt 13:05, 7 April 2008 (EDT)

Take it easy, both of you, and remember:

  • Big changes need big discussions.
  • If your comments have more to say about the other parties involved than the issue itself, you're doing it wrong. Jpatokal 13:55, 7 April 2008 (EDT)
Amen.--Wandering 20:40, 7 April 2008 (EDT)
First point, very true. Second, I (at least hope I) restricted my comments to the subject matter in question, that being classification system and discussion thereof. I hope I'm not out of line, but that's exactly the issue. Jordanmills 22:15, 7 April 2008 (EDT)

An overview of the standing effort to break down Texas into second level subregions has been laid out at Talk:Texas. I'd like to hear a lot of opinions on this. Texugo 22:25, 7 April 2008 (EDT)

Editing disruption 4/17/08

The site will be undergoing a little work at 7AM PST on 4/17/08. Cached pages won't be affected, but editing will be. It's anticipated that the work wil last one hour. Thank you for your patience! JuCo 21:28, 16 April 2008 (EDT)

Call for discussion page

Isn't there a wikitravel Call for discussion page? I thought I came across one once but now I can't find it, either with a search or by looking at my contributions. Could someone put a link to it on the general Help page? Thanks. Sailsetter 10:47, 20 April 2008 (EDT)

Wikitravel:Requests for comment Pashley 11:12, 20 April 2008 (EDT)
Thanks, I'd forgotten what it was called. I think it would be a good idea to put a link to it on the general Help:Contents page. Sailsetter 11:16, 20 April 2008 (EDT)

Airlines & airports

Hi there

I'm new, so I'm not very familiar with the way things are done here. Having recently travelled on Singapore Airlines, I started a stub on it based on the structure of American Airlines and United Airlines. I couldn't find any help at Wikitravel:Article_templates, so I create my own template: Template:airline. I haven't added it to Wikitravel:Article templates because I'm not sure of how things are yet.

Question: Are articles on airlines within the scope of wikitravel? If so, maybe someone can take a look at the template and improve and list it in Wikitravel:Article_templates. As a related topic, how about articles on airports?

Thanks for your comments. --Rifleman 82 07:00, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

Mostly airlines and airports are handled in travel topics, see Travel_topic#By_plane. For most countries a single travel topic can cover all the airlines and airports, see Air_travel_in_South_Africa as an example. There are however exceptions:
--Nick 07:40, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
Thanks for your answer. I've read the articles you've pointed out, and I have a feeling nobody really has strong feelings whether or not airlines and perhaps airports meet wikitravel's scope. I read Wikitravel:Goals and non-goals as well, and I personally don't see how articles on airports and airlines will meet the non-goals. The Silverjet article seems pretty much a glossy brochure. Definitely not like any other wikitravel article I've seen.
Do you or anyone else have any specific comments or advise with regard to this article? Seeing the discussions Nick listed, I don't suppose there's any impetus for having a policy on airports and airlines? --Rifleman 82 09:32, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
Don't think there is a strong feelings against having airline articles, provided that they don't look like the Silverjet one. As you said, Silverjet looks like a glossy brochure rather than a wikitravel article.
I for one would support the template because, we already have a number of longstanding airline articles and it does not seem that we are about to delete any; it would thus be best to have a formal template for them. Having a template will insure that we can clean up and avoid further advertising articles like Silverjet
I'd suggest the following:
--Nick 05:33, 30 April 2008 (EDT)


The upcoming queue on Wikitravel:Discover is getting very short. Know any interesting facts about a specific destination? Please add it there to be displayed on the main page --Nick 07:58, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

I need a techical help

I plan to create template for signs of the roads in Israel. The templete should used as inline html tag. I test realization at local html file. But same html code is not work in Wikitravel. There are two possible ways:

1) the span with background-image css-attribute:

Highway 20 from Gan Sorek to Herzliya
In server response there are no css-attribute at all. This is a side effect of "background-image" css-attribute presence. I have no idea why...

2) the spans with positioning css-attributes

Highway Highway 2020 from Gan Sorek to Herzliya
This way working almost properly, but a following text come across span. In local html file this working properly. I use IE 6.0

What is wrong? -- Sergey kudryavtsev 04:07, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

Google AdSense sensitivity... or not?

Our ad policy clearly states that the ads should only be travel-related. This works fine, most of the time, but sometimes it gets just silly, probably because of Google's filter settings. Today, sv: has had ads for language classes of little or no use to a swede, ads from companies offering to restore your hard drive, how to give away a brunch as a gift, and, perhaps the most ridiculous of them all: ads linking to an online directory with search criteria for stock brokers! This needs to be looked into ASAP, because it is a breach of our own policy and is completely counterproductive. Welcome here to discuss the issue. Riggwelter 10:34, 12 May 2008 (EDT)

Could you direct me to the page where I can find the policy on ads? 2old 11:05, 12 May 2008 (EDT)


Where exactly does the sports section fit in a country page? Under the culture section, or under Do? Or does it depend on the sport and its role in the country. What about, say, cricket in India. Cricket is an integral aspect of Indian culture, and acts as a unifying factor. Besides, cricket fans often travel to India from abroad to support their country during tours/tournaments so, in that sense, it should fall under DO. Upamanyuwikitravel( Talk )( Travel ) • 04:28, 28 June 2008 (EDT) (Sorry, I forgot to sign :)

Hmm, tbd... Wikitravel_talk:Country_article_template#See_sectioncacahuate talk 00:43, 28 June 2008 (EDT)
Wikitravel:Where you can stick it says information on spectator sports goes under "Do". On a country page, if you're talking about the sport in general and how it works in the country's culture, it should probably go in "Understand" somewhere. If you're talking about a specific team or stadium or event, it should go in "Do". LtPowers 22:05, 29 June 2008 (EDT)

State names with U.S. cities . . .

What is the style for state names with U.S. cities (and, for that matter, any similar appellations)? It is annoying to search for Los Angeles, California, only to be directed to a Disambiguation page. I notice that some cities are followed by the name of the state in parentheses, but that's not the way most people would do a search. See Aurora (Colorado). Sincerely, GeorgeLouis 09:50, 7 July 2008 (EDT)

A current rules was explained in Wikitravel:Article naming conventions. -- Sergey kudryavtsev 10:19, 7 July 2008 (EDT)
Los Angeles, California should be a redirect to Los Angeles. I have created it as such. LtPowers 14:05, 7 July 2008 (EDT)

Newbie Maps Question

Hey guys. So I'm a newbie here and I'd like to continue plunging forward on some of the places I've been and such. I've also realized that many of the guides here on wikitravel have excellent maps (examples shared:Image:Map-USA-Regions01.png and shared:Image:Map_of_Asia.png). I hate to sound niave, but what program/website/software do you use to produce these excellent maps? and how would I go about making my own? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Matt.Cannella 18:19, 24 July 2008 (EDT)

Hi, Matt, and welcome. I think all your questions are answered at Wikitravel:Mapmaking Expedition. If not, leave a message on my talk page and I'll chase it down. OldPine 18:49, 24 July 2008 (EDT)
Definitely also take a look at Wikitravel:How to draw a map, which explains the Wikitravel conventions for creating maps in Inkscape. And Wikitravel:How to create a map, which explains how to auto-generate street maps from OSM data (although you need to be running a UNIX-based OS to use this method). --Peter Talk 00:15, 25 July 2008 (EDT)
Wikitravel:How to draw a map is good for city maps but provides no guidance on region maps, unfortunately. My own attempts at region maps have been pretty hodgepodge as a result (see shared:User:LtPowers/Gallery). LtPowers 11:04, 25 July 2008 (EDT)

Travel News

Maybe I'm missing something, but there seems to be a problem with adding Travel News to the main page. The Travel news page itself is just fine, but when I follow the instructions in Wikitravel:How to add travel news#Adding news to Main Page I end up at a page that says "No such section You tried to edit a section that doesn't exist. Since there is no section 15, there's no place to save your edit."

Right now the "Travel warning: Hurricane Dolly" news item dated 23rd July which is sitting in Travel News#Future really ought to be on the main page - but I can't see a way to put it there, Presumably neither could the anonymous user ( who wrote it. Tarr3n 13:43, 25 July 2008 (EDT)

Collections: Build your own Wikitravel books

Just a heads-up for the feature request for the Collections extension. This is an existing Mediawiki plugin that lets you build "collections" (bookmark sets) shopping-cart style, and then print them out as paper copies. It's already up and running on some wikis like the OpenOffice wiki, it's coming to Wikipedia soon, and it would rock to get this on Wikitravel as well. Please chip in to the discussion! Jpatokal 08:07, 1 August 2008 (EDT)

Copyrighted material

Hi, I have a quick question. When I was writing up info on the San Francisco/Golden Gate article, I got a bit lazy when it came to the section on the Presidio, and I added many of the listings there pretty much straight from their website — although saying that, not verbatim. Although I've been there a zillion times I used their layout as it was unlikely I could improve on it and they say here [2] that the info is not copyrighted and in the public domain. I just wanted to double check that this is ok to use on WT. Asterix 19:05, 1 August 2008 (EDT)

Publications of the US government are in the public domain unless otherwise specified, so all CIA maps, NPS text, etc. is OK to copy verbatim to Wikitravel. -- Ryan • (talk) • 20:32, 1 August 2008 (EDT)
Thanks Asterix 18:51, 2 August 2008 (EDT)

Can't move page

I don't know if this is a bug or if I'm just doing something wrong, but when I try to rename the page West Aegean Islands to Western Greek Islands (because I realized after creating the page that the Western Greek Islands aren't in the Aegean) using Move Page, I get an error "This action cannot be performed on this page." (I've been able to rename other pages recently.) Sailsetter 11:33, 5 August 2008 (EDT)

After writing that I moved another page (The Greek Islands to Greek Islands) and it worked ok, in the same login session. So I don't know what's wrong with the Western Aegean Islands move. Sailsetter 11:36, 5 August 2008 (EDT)

West Aegean Islands hasn't been created yet, it seems :) – cacahuate talk 12:16, 5 August 2008 (EDT)
Oh. Duh. Thanks. Sailsetter 12:37, 5 August 2008 (EDT)

region map color cool

I would like to edit the article about Romania and make the regions appear in the article with colors to match the ones I put on the map of Romania. I can find no template or code for it. i have tried to copy the code from Netherlands but I did not succeed in making it work. Where can I find the proper code?

Deni120 09:03, 7 August 2008 (EDT)

The easiest way is to copy the code from an article that already has it (like Antarctica). But the template is here. Hope that's what you were looking for! And nice map, by the way—perhaps you'd be interested to look over our new Wikitravel:Regions map Expedition. --Peter Talk 10:18, 7 August 2008 (EDT)

Arabic Wikitravel

Could someone please add the link to Arabic Wikitravel? Hot Coffee 13:40, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

Trail of breadcrumbs help

Many articles have at their beginning a "trail of breadcrumbs" showing how to navigate back, for instance, "Europe : Mediterranean Europe : Greece : Crete".

Where can I find documentation of how to add or change this? Sailsetter 15:25, 19 August 2008 (EDT)

Welcome to Wikitravel! I believe Wikitravel:Breadcrumb navigation has the information you need. If anything isn't clear, feel free to ask here or on Wikitravel talk:Breadcrumb navigation. LtPowers 15:44, 19 August 2008 (EDT)

Someone is impersonating me on Wikitravel

Someone has been cyberstalking and cyberbullying me, and the latest thing they've done is impersonate me on Wikitravel by creating an account with the same name as my account on Wikipedia. This person used my real name on their user page (I don't want my real name associated with my user name), and they made multiple abusive edits, getting themselves temporarily blocked. So, what should I do? I don't want to give this person any more attention and motivate them to impersonate me all over the internet, so I'd rather the account be deleted rather than turned over to me. Advice? -- 10:30, 23 August 2008 (EDT)

Well, you could start by telling us the account name. Jpatokal 12:15, 24 August 2008 (EDT)

Low-cost airplane "hubs"

I was wondering whether it would be beneficial to include a article abou long-haul airplane "hubs". As such, travellers can now which first airplane to take to bridge the largest distance at the cheapest cost (as these flights are generally the most expensive and can easily cost 1500-2000$ . For example flying to china is best done from the UK by Air Asia X, to India by Jet Airways, ... Similar hubs should also be found for SE Asia, ... Also the Pacific is something needing to be looked into. I recently saw that Bruce Parry used Singapore to bridge the longest distance in his trip to Anuta, perhaps this is a cheap flight too ? If its a good idea, perhaps its also good to include a worldmap with the main connections. 08:56, 24 August 2008 (EDT)

See Discount airlines. Jpatokal 12:15, 24 August 2008 (EDT)

Florida Expedition

I have created a Florida Expedition, with the goal of getting the Florida state page up to Guide status. Anyone who would like to participate, please sign up. gamweb 03:52, 26 August 2008 (EDT)

Collaboration of the Month— A Plug

Just a wee plug for the newly revamped Collaboration of the Month. After some discussion, the consensus was that the Collaboration of the Week format was not working, so we have moved to a monthly format, with 3 collaborations from different continents each month. The Collaboration of the Month is an opportunity to highlight a specific Wikitravel article that needs improvement in some way. While anyone can edit any article at any time, the Collaboration of the Month provides a way to highlight a single article allowing many contributors to help improve it together. As most of you have probably noticed on the Main_Page or Project Home Page, the collaborations for September 2008 are Calabar, Beijing and Little Rock. Do please have a look and plunge forward! Tarr3n 07:36, 2 September 2008 (EDT)

I really hope this takes off. For it to work we'll need at least a small pool of ~3+ interested users who do semi-regular work on the CotMs. I'll do my best to try and pitch in a bit. --Peter Talk 12:39, 3 September 2008 (EDT)

Sheki Star nomination

Sheki is attempting to move on up from mere "former OtBP" status to a full out star. Please drop by the starnom page and leave some praise, criticism, or even just partial criticism of one small section of the article would be appreciated, since people have worked hard on this one! --Peter Talk 10:15, 10 September 2008 (EDT)

A starnom for a destination in Azerbaijan? Wow! I never believed I can live to see anything in ex-USSR in starnoms... (Sorry, I never been there--and find it unconstructive to criticize without any experience with the destination) --DenisYurkin 17:58, 10 September 2008 (EDT)
No need for knowledge of the destination—star qualifications are mostly just manual of style issues, and I know you're familiar with those! Or you can just mention there that you like the article ;) --Peter Talk 18:05, 10 September 2008 (EDT)
I'd like to just jump in here quickly too in defense of people critiquing an unfamiliar destination. Sure, they can't verify that's it's "complete," but they can do everything else. Also, because of their local knowledge, authors may tend assume that something is obvious when it is not. Those unfamiliar with a destination can provide a valuable insight in into whether or not an article makes sense from their perspective — a perspective that is shared by the travelers themselves, who are also likely unfamiliar with the destination. Therefore, I think it's a useful "dry run" for the real readers, and imo, ideally all articles should be reviewed by a healthy mix of those that are very familiar with a destination, those that know a little about it, and those that know nothing at all. Asterix 14:47, 11 September 2008 (EDT)

Not a comment per se ... more a plea for help !

I'm flying in to Hong Kong on the evening of the 16th September. From there I need to get through to Zhengzhou (Henan province - Mainland) as quickly as possible, for to start a basic Chinese language course. I've been told there's a train (T97B) from Jiu Long through to ZZ. (a charming 18 hour train trip !) Does anyone know what my options are, if any, or perhaps suggest a better way. Optimistically yours, P````

Please try asking on , that's what it's there for!
But the obvious option would be to fly. Both China Southern and Hong Kong Airlines fly direct from HK to Zhengzhou, or you could just cross the border to Shenzhen (there are even ferries direct from the airport) and take an even cheaper flight from there. Jpatokal 07:59, 11 September 2008 (EDT)

How do I add my ogg vorbis sound file to wikitravel?

How do I add my ogg vorbis sound file to the wikitravel phrase book?..I want to help!LingoSuccess 23:41, 11 September 2008 (EDT)

A audio is deprecated by our Image policy ("Other media" section). -- Sergey kudryavtsev 02:49, 12 September 2008 (EDT)

Independent travel in Africa

Why are there so many people who advise against travelling independant in Africa? We just did buy a car in Kenya and travelled all over East Africa, with no problems at all.?? It's very easy!! --—The preceding comment was added by Mara85 (talkcontribs) .

Booking agancy link

It's needed to add (English interface provided) to the spam list. This link was added twice in Saint Petersburg (Russia). -- Sergey kudryavtsev 02:50, 16 September 2008 (EDT)

PS: In Russia too. -- Sergey kudryavtsev 02:54, 16 September 2008 (EDT)

New Server Transition Begins, September 24th

The tech team will begin the transition to the new server setup today. This will create some disruption in service to the site. Beginning immediately, the Search function will be switched to a back-up version that, some may notice, is less robust. Many of you may not notice a difference at all. This is a temporary switch. Full search will be restored after the transition to the new servers. Once the work on search is completed, which should be a matter of hours, the transfer of the site will begin. At that point, Wikitravel will become "read-only", meaning you won't be able to make edits. A message will appear on edit pages. This "read only" period will last for about three hours. When the site comes up on the new servers, the message will disappear and you will be able to edit again. JuCo 16:57, 24 September 2008 (EDT)

Is the transition already finished? -- Sergey kudryavtsev 02:06, 25 September 2008 (EDT)
New site architecture went live at roughly 10:20 last night Los Angeles time KevinSours 10:19, 25 September 2008 (EDT)
Please report bugs in Wikitravel Shared as you encounter them. Thank you for your patience during the upgrade. We're very excited about what the new setup will mean for greater stability and scalability moving forward! JuCo 13:34, 25 September 2008 (EDT)

Problem with redirects

I just now noticed that there is a problem with redirect pages all over the website, namely, in that the redirect page displays an earlier version of the cache page. Take "Disneyland" (the cache) versus "Disneyland Resort" (the redirect), for example. Jonathan 784 18:31, 6 October 2008 (EDT)

Actually, you noticed it several days ago. =) Use the solution I put on your talk page, if I wrote it intelligibly enough. LtPowers 19:55, 6 October 2008 (EDT)

Incredible India

Do we really need an identical listing for this travel agency in 20 or more articles? I'm thinking not. Texugo 04:02, 17 October 2008 (EDT)

One of the admins has seen to this now. Just noticed there is still one reference on the Mumbai page. Will keep an eye out for more popping up. Nrms 06:47, 20 October 2008 (EDT)

Copenhagen/Østerbro Star nomination

I'm hard at work giving Copenhagen a huge notch up in the scale, hoping to make it DoTM when it hosts the World Outgames in August - And i think my home district, has ended up quite good. So please head over and comment on the Star Nominations page - and while you're at it Sheki needs a few more comments too. Cheers Sertmann 23:53, 10 October 2008 (EDT)

Pennsylvania School Projects

Just a heads up. Some teacher in Pennsylvania has apparently sent all her students here to each to their own article on a small town in Pennsylvania. I've been trying to keep up with style edits and removing copyrighted material, but it's a bit overwhelming. Could use some help. Texugo 01:36, 20 October 2008 (EDT)

Nice concept though! :) I'll try to keep a look out once a day or so... Sertmann 06:44, 20 October 2008 (EDT)
Is that why I just had to revert our Pennsylvania region names and delete a bunch of related copyvios from VisitPA? LtPowers 14:14, 20 October 2008 (EDT)

A question.... It's about maps...

Hey, I was wondering if it's ok to make a map in Photoshop Elements, and then save it as a PNG? Is that ok?

Edmontonenthusiast 23:44, 22 October 2008 (EDT)Edmontonenthusiast

You want something that creates an SVG file... we then make a png version to use in articles, but we also upload the SVG, which allows for the community to work on maps together and update them when needed. Your time will definitely be better spent and your map will last longer if it's made as an SVG. The latest version Inkscape (free) is the preferred way to create them, but Illustrator I think also would work fine. I'm glad you're showing an interest in maps, it's definitely a bit of a learning curve involved, but it's rewarding once you get the hang of it! – cacahuate talk 02:13, 23 October 2008 (EDT)
So basically...I need to make two files-SVG and PNG? Can I make SVG in PS Elements? Also how do you upload two...hjust seperatelyt? Thamks! Edmontonenthusiast 12:14, 23 October 2008 (EDT)Edmontonenthusiast
Technically, it doesn't have to be an SVG; it could be any semi-portable vector graphics format. Unless I'm misunderstanding the policy. Photoshop is a raster graphics program, though, so it's not the best choice for creating maps. A vector graphics program, such as Inkscape, allows the creation of high-quality images at any scale. If you find some of this jargon confusing, you can read up a bit on it here. LtPowers 13:50, 23 October 2008 (EDT)
I should NOT have to install programs to make maps. I don't get why I can't use Photoshop Elements. To me it's absurd. But, then again, I may be missing something. Please, do explain. And am I right, I need to make a PNG and SVG format and upload the two? And, also, can you make SVG format in PS Elements? THANKS! Edmontonenthusiast 13:54, 23 October 2008 (EDT)Edmontonenthusiast
Also, where do you get, LNKSCAPE? Edmontonenthusiast 13:55, 23 October 2008 (EDT)Edmontonenthusiast
You can create maps in any format you wish, including png's, but the community here on Wikitravel, prefer to have them in svg format - as the work almost ends up in higher quality, and other users can pick up on your work and improve it if they wish (which is the whole point of a wiki), you can't do that with a file created in Adobe Elements. Inkscape is available for free here[3] and illustrator (expensive) here[4] - Sertmann 16:07, 23 October 2008 (EDT)
Thankyou, and what other programs give the SVG option. Or...could you just make it in PS Elements then open it in something else in which it can be made a SVG. Or you could saeve it as a jpeg, then convert it to SVG¿ How aboht those/ THanks! Edmontonenthusiast 17:35, 23 October 2008 (EDT)Edmontonenthusiast
hmmm, how do I explain this... SVG's and PNG's are two completely different ways of creating an image. Because of this, you can't use a program that makes files like png, gif or jpg to make a svg image (I'm speaking in somewhat over simplified terms here). A program like Elements or Photoshop works in pixels, where each dot on your screen is assigned a color, while programs like Inkscape or Illustrator works in vectors, which you might remember from your math classes, this means you don't work in pixels but with elements - this also means you can scale a svg image to every size you wish, and still have it look exactly the same way. We prefer svg's exactly because you work with elements, that way you can change the line of a street, text, sign or anything else in the image, without having to delete it, and use the pen tool to redraw things pixel by pixel.
It does take some time getting used too (it will seem awfully stupid and complicated at first), but once you get the hang of it, it's a lot more intuitive way to draw something and anything, you will become much faster at drawing things, and the things you draw will look a lot better. Which is why almost all professional designers use Adobe illustrator or similar programs to do their designs. So after a while. the time you spend learning this, will come back 10 fold once you get the hang of it. Sertmann 18:03, 23 October 2008 (EDT)
Actually is there any place it would be appropriate to stick the above explanation (i'd expand it a bit, and fix the awful punctuation), so it's available to other new users? Sertmann 18:12, 23 October 2008 (EDT)
Wikitravel:How to draw a map already covers most of this... it could use some updating, but it's there. To Ed, you only have to create the map once, as an SVG. then it will have layers, will be high quality, and will be editable in the future by other contributors who can improve it and update it when things change. There's an option in Inkscape to export your SVG as a PNG, which takes about 10 seconds, and that's what we use within articles. So you only have to create the map once, but yes, you end up uploading 2 different versions – cacahuate talk 18:26, 23 October 2008 (EDT)
Thansk for all the commmments! Edmontonenthusiast 18:33, 23 October 2008 (EDT)Edmontonenthusiast

Wikitravel Dutch

message to all the dutch contributors of Wikitravel: There is also the dutch version of Wikitravel where you can contribute in your own mother tongue, we really need more contributors. Hoofdpagina Wikitravel --Canshun 04:03, 24 October 2008 (EDT)

How am I doing?

Could you check me districtifying Edmonton, and well, give me a progress report if you will, of how I am doing, I have done most of it. Edmontonenthusiast 14:10, 24 October 2008 (EDT)

page credits

what are they (like at the bottom of the page) and how do you get on 'em? keep smiling, Edmontonenthusiast 23:59, 30 October 2008 (EDT)

By editing the page, you get added to the credit. You full name will appear if you give it in preferences, or your nickname if you don't. Eventually, after many people have edited the page after you, your name will just be listed under the "others" link. Quick answer, its done automatically, and you don't have to do anything. --Inas 01:02, 31 October 2008 (EDT)
Oh that's so cool. Thanks! Keep smiling, Edmontonenthusiast 11:08, 31 October 2008 (EDT)

Colored text on project pages

I just opened the Votes for deletion page, only to find it cluttered with bold text, colors and what not - and this annoys the hell out of me, since it ruins my overview of the page (I toned it down a bit now - without asking, check here for old version). Is there a concensus out there that this is a no-no on Project pages (and articles for that matter), since a quick overview is pretty critical for those of us fulfulling janitorial duties (without having to fight a path through a rainbow). Sertmann 18:49, 31 October 2008 (EDT)

Guess I should put my 6.7809292999405338540 cents worth into this :>! I am the person who coloured up the page, heh. I honestly think it's inappropriate for articles themselves, but talk/user pages should have this allowed, it add a bit of personality to it and just something neat to look at, rather than the uniform. If it really was so bad, we really shouldn't have that option. I don't know...I was originally just testing out the colour, then I liked it so I tried it with other stuff:P. Also, if it was so bad, why don't we confront cacahuate-who usually changes the colour of the signature and ask caca to stop? I don't know. Just my stupid thoughts. Happy day of the dead, Edmontonenthusiast 18:55, 31 October 2008 (EDT)!
What you do with your signature is up to you for the most part, but a few of us mentioned yesterday in the very conversation where you learned how to color text that it was probably undesirable to the community to use it outside of signatures. Before introducing new things like that we tend to discuss it and agree upon it as well :) – cacahuate talk 19:54, 31 October 2008 (EDT)
I guess I am like a rebel to you all ;). Happy Day of the Dead, Edmontonenthusiast 19:57, 31 October 2008 (EDT)


I recently added two nominee's to the Wikitravel:Collaborations of the month in North America. I have yet to get a response excluding my own. I've even asked people in their talk to voice their opinions, I wasn't like doing it for just people to get comments I was doing it because I think they could give a good opinion. Thats all. Now I just don't get it. Keep smiling, ee talk 22:39, 8 November 2008 (EST).

Kid, you still need to learn the virtue of patience :o) That being said, I've made an entry there myself, including some ideas to try and change the dysfunctional concept, and would appreciate some comments. Sertmann 23:04, 8 November 2008 (EST)
At least you have 2 comments. I have NONE for two. Keep smiling, ee talk 23:13, 8 November 2008 (EST).

Maps - Open Street Map

Hiya there! I was just wondering, I know there is Open Street Map, but to use reference for creating maps, is there any other site? I mean OSM is fine, it's just, if you want tto use if for reference, a lot of the maps are incomplete. Keep smiling, ee talk 15:32, 9 November 2008 (EST).

It depends. For U.S. locations, the U.S. Geological Survey (USGS) has satellite images and topographic maps that are in the public domain (anything from the U.S. government is public domain). I don't know the situation in Canada. You might want to check out the NASA WorldWind application, but it's mostly going to have images of the U.S. LtPowers 16:41, 9 November 2008 (EST)
Good to know for US Cities. Anybody know about Canadian cities? Keep smiling, ee talk 17:07, 9 November 2008 (EST).
Check out the discussion over at OSM [5]. Finding compatible data is a pursued over there, and the chances are if there is an available source someone has either loaded it, or is looking into loading it. --Inas 18:44, 9 November 2008 (EST)
Also Wikitravel_talk:Copyleft#GFDL_and_Creative_Commons Pashley 20:21, 9 November 2008 (EST)
Hmm I don't se how that wiki link thing's helpful-sorry! Happy first day of snow in Edmonton, ee talk 11:37, 11 November 2008 (EST).

A question about docents that I'd like to have an answer.

I guess people thatve been a docent for a while would be the best for this, but I was wondering, is there a really large ammount of people asking questions or is it as I presume-small? Keep smiling, ee talk 17:21, 9 November 2008 (EST).

Wikitravel talk:Docents#Is this working?. -- Ryan • (talk) • 17:24, 9 November 2008 (EST)

Sorry - Images

Sorry for making another topic, I really am, but I want to get to the bottom of this. I really want to know-I've waited for a couple days, but do my images (most notably in Edmonton) look low-quality? Keep smiling, ee talk 17:52, 9 November 2008 (EST).

The technical quality (resolution, color range, etc) is just fine, and some of your pics (eg. Image:Winspear.JPG, Image:Skyline_wintaa.JPG) are IMHO artistically good as well. But photography is one of those arts that takes a lifetime to master, and you should pay a little more attention to light and framing, see eg. [6]. And patience comes in handy too, since great photos only happen when the conditions are just right... Jpatokal 03:54, 10 November 2008 (EST)
So other than those two, basically, they suck ;)? Keep smiling, ee talk 13:22, 10 November 2008 (EST).
Pictures are not just "good" or "bad", and beauty is the eye of the beholder. Any picture that accurately represents a local scene and/or makes the reader go "Ooh, that looks nice" is a plus in my book. Jpatokal 02:33, 11 November 2008 (EST)
Thanks, in yours or others opinions though, I'd like to know. Happy first day of snow in Edmonton, ee talk 11:38, 11 November 2008 (EST).

Collaboration of the month revamp

My best intentions of trying to fix the current travesty, ended up in complete and miserable failure. But if nothing else, it shook things up a bit - and there is new discussion of a revamp that have been started on the talk page. it would probably get a bit more interesting, if people knew it was there, and contributed a bit to the (as of now) pretty one sided discussion. Sertmann 02:45, 11 November 2008 (EST)

wikitravel slow?¿

I don't know about you, but every morning before about 8:40 am Mountain time (7:40 Pacific, 9:40 Central, 10:40 Eastern, in Europe 4:40, 5:40pm, etc. I believe) I always have WikiTravel really slow. It takes 2 minutes to load a page. But for some reason, after that time about, it's fine. I don't know. I really don't think it's my internet company otherwise it'd be like that all the time. I guess the question is why is it doing that and if anyone else is getting it and if they have it at different times. I also have used other computers that are like that until I don't know. Keep smiling, ee talk 14:02, 12 November 2008 (EST).


I don't know how to delete pages that complete idiots have recently made. Could someone delete them and try and tell me how to for next time? Ugh this guy is pissing me off! Keep smiling, ee talk 18:05, 12 November 2008 (EST).

Only administrators can delete pages. You can nominate pages for deletion at Wikitravel:Votes for deletion, and an administrator will look it over.
Also, the answer to this question could have been easily found with a little research in the Help section. Wikitravel:How to is especially helpful. Just for future reference, you might want to check there for the answers first before posting here. :) PerryPlanet 19:07, 12 November 2008 (EST)

Edmonton/Central nom

Hey, says I can promote here! So I nominated Edmonton/Central for Star nomination, Edmonton Central Star nom! If you can, comment! Thank you! Keep smiling, ee talk 18:35, 13 November 2008 (EST).


Does a travel guide require a place to sleep? Because i have seen travel guides with nothing listed under sleep... is it easier to find places and just added them and then someone can fill in stuff? please inform me thanks --Hayfield 20:22, 13 November 2008 (EST)

It is required from my knowledge. If you see places without listings, you should research and look some up. You are not required to add all informaton from the get-go. You can do it over X amount of time. Definitely easier to just add them and wait for others to add info, but sometimes you may get anxious to add to it yourself, or worse, get impatient! Keep smiling, ee talk 21:10, 13 November 2008 (EST).
See the What is an article discussion, for ideas. Practically, however, as an example there are 322,000 place names in Australia. Adding blank templates for them without any understanding, and hoping someone will come along and fill in the details adds little or no value and would probably bring us no closer to our goals. However, if you know of a travel destination, and some information on it, but don't know if there is a place to sleep there, then add it and someone can come along with the additional details on accommodation and other stuff later. --Inas 21:16, 13 November 2008 (EST)
My policy, whenever possible, is to start off with at least one "useful" thing in any outline (sight, hotel, how to get there, whatever). Once you've got that grain of sand in there, it will turn into a pearl eventually. Jpatokal 05:10, 14 November 2008 (EST)
While exceptions can be made, users whose primary contributions are random articles for small places have a slightly higher bar to climb when creating new articles, especially when their login originates from Portland (Maine). Anything without a sleep listing that can't be justified is a candidate for (speedy) deletion, as discussed on Wikitravel talk:Deletion policy. -- Ryan • (talk) • 01:09, 14 November 2008 (EST)
I think it should be clarified that since hotel listings for Regions should be in the cities pages, and for huge cities should be in the district pages, often region and city pages end up having no listings under Sleep. Personally I think that region and huge city pages either should have the Sleep heading deleted or there should be a brief comment under it about accommodations in general with a statement that specific listings will be found in the city or district pages. But so far as I know this isn't required by policy and often isn't done, so many such pages have blank sleep headings. Sailsetter 19:08, 16 November 2008 (EST)

If you want you can have a small list of the best in a city in the main article. Keep smiling, ee talk 19:11, 16 November 2008 (EST).

I'm not sure this is a good idea. It opens the way for hotel owners and others with a special interest to give certain places a recommendation boost by putting them in the "best of" section. It also will encourage everyone to put all their listings in the main article, a tendency which is already a problem. Sailsetter 19:22, 16 November 2008 (EST)

Nah not much a good idea for sleep but it is possible. It's better for buy and do though. Keep smiling, ee talk 19:31, 16 November 2008 (EST).

Person of the month?

I was wondering if we could have something like CotMs, DotMs, and OtbPs! This would be POTM (Person of the Month) where you'd nominate someone within the first errr...10 days of a month, then in the last week, they are decided, and for the next month they are person of the month. Thought it'd be neat to have - because we always honour articles but never really the people who do that work. The person should someone who has done extensive work, friendly, helpful, and has contributed in talk pages I guess. We could work out the specifics later-just wondering if people'd be interested? Keep smiling, ee talk 21:40, 13 November 2008 (EST).

No, no, no & no. That would be totallu out of touch with the spirit of this place, and I don't want this to turn into a popularity contest --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 00:56, 14 November 2008 (EST)'s just a thought! keep smiling, ee talk 10:29, 14 November 2008 (EST).
Don't worry, had i been upset I would have smacked an exclamation mark in your face as well :)-Sertmann

Alright. And I didn't mean it as an angry exclamation marke. Well, I didn't think that it would turn into a popularity contest-but that is a very good point, it may very well happen. But I know one site in particular [7], where they have Member of the Month...there's no popularity contest, but people do nominate anonymously. But then again, that's a forum, this is something different format. But I still do think people deserve applause for all the hard work they've done. I actually would've nominated you, :)! By the way remember to sign your name. Just so much effort is put into these things, people don't even realise! Anyone who has made a star article would definitely deserve this, I am really realizing how much work they put into it. Look at Chicago...that must have been brutal! I don't think we'll see another one of those for a long time-just because of it's brutalness! Anyway, I kind of got some off topic there. But yeah. Keep smiling, ee talk 15:52, 14 November 2008 (EST).

Singling out individuals would in a way go against the spirit of community, which is a concern for many of us. In the past the barn star has been a way to single people out - the idea being that anyone can let anyone else know "I think you've done good stuff" without it turning into an "employee of the month" kind of thing since at any given time there could be no barnstars handed out, or there could be dozens. -- Ryan • (talk) • 16:07, 14 November 2008 (EST)

Teaching English NOM

Hey, another nom, I made a [[Wikitravel:Star nominations#Teaching English]|star nom]] (again). It should be interesting! Keep smiling, ee talk 13:06, 14 November 2008 (EST).

Policy fellowships, anyone?

Google has a number of summer fellowships for students to work on Internet policy issues. Among the hosts, listed at [8], are Creative Commons [9] whose license we use here and the EFF [10] whose advocacy on net.freedom affects us all. Any students here want to apply? Any teachers have students who should?

For that matter, should WT offer to host some students? Adding new hosts is still possible. Pashley 23:50, 20 November 2008 (EST)


I know this may sound like so dumb, but, what is the point really of showing that an edit is minor. Sorry if it brings up stuff/is stupid. Keep smiling ,ee talk 12:31, 4 November 2008 (EST).

Minor edits can be excluded from your watchlist. Some users don't want to see spelling corrections and other less-substantial changes appearing on their watchlists. LtPowers 12:33, 4 November 2008 (EST)
No I don't mind seeing it I just don't see the actually idea behind it...but thats me! Keep smiling, ee talk 21:17, 4 November 2008 (EST).
I tick the "Minor Edit" box if the meaning of the article doesn't change and/or I can explain the edit in the edit comments. By hiding minor edits you can see the significant edits that you might want to check. Think of minor edits as maintenance, or pulling the weeds out of the garden. -- Huttite 05:04, 13 January 2009 (EST)

Approval needed?

Hi, I'm new to Wikitravel and thought I could improve the Yekaterinburg article. I'm just a little confused if there is an approval needed? I edited the page yesterday and it was looking fine and is still listed as the current version, however, the article only shows the version from before I edited it. Is this expected behaviour? Do the main articles only get cached so often? Thanks in advance, FreakRob 13:12, 15 November 2008 (EST)

Nah, you don't need approval...Wikitravel recently underwent a serverchange and sometimes the latest version doesn't go. Although you can do one of the two things to fix that: 1) reload, if that doesn't work 2) go into history, click the latest version, and it should be there. Edit it again, and it should be fine. Keep smiling, ee talk 13:14, 15 November 2008 (EST).
No approval is needed, it is just that Wikitravel pages are cached, so there may be a delay in your newly edited page being updated. To purge the cache and display your newly edited page, after you have edited and saved all your changes, simply edit the page, or any section, again but, rather than saving the changes, scrole to the bottom of the page and follow the link that says Purge Cache for this page. Or, wait a while. -- Huttite 05:37, 13 January 2009 (EST)

Approval needed x 2?

Hi all! Yes I too am a bit confused. I have made some additions to one of my favorite cities, San Diego, and my posts have been removed. I read the guidelines, and thought I was contributing valueable data? I sure would like to know what I am doing wrong. Thank you very much. [[User:RockerChick74.237.97.125 08:41, 16 January 2009 (EST)]] 8:40am, 16 January 2009 (EST)

Your text was not placed in San Diego, but it is to be found in Attractions instead. Did you use the search function to find the word Attractions? Cut and paste it to the proper (San Diego) page, please. That Attractions page is nominated for deletion! It is always a good idea to log in if you edit our pages --Rein N. 09:48, 16 January 2009 (EST)


Okay why does this site keep freezing at times recently? I don't get it. I am sorry if this IS the wrong place. Anyways thanks. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 18:05, 1 December 2008 (EST).

Perhaps the servers are in Edmonton, and they freeze whenever someone opens the door? --Inas 19:30, 2 December 2008 (EST)
LOL. No they are in Winnipeg where the building dont have insulation and everyone there is freezing their tooshie off as a grandma would say ;). edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 19:33, 2 December 2008 (EST).


Where can I get information on the number of people visiting Wikitravel, the demographics of visitors, which pages are the most popular, etc.; Wikitravel's stats? Paula 00:20, 9 December 2008 (EST)

Hi Paula. Is this what you're looking for? Texugo 01:11, 9 December 2008 (EST)
Also Alexa[11] might be useful - it's actually interesting how we compare to and, but at the same time we're really lacking behind But yeah, it sucks the webalizer stat's have been disabled, and the google analytics stats collected here, is not publicly available. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 01:17, 9 December 2008 (EST)
A bit Related, using this graph you can (totally unscientifically) approximate that we get around 10-15.000 unique visitors per day (traffic rises drasticly in the northern hemisphere's summer) --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 01:37, 9 December 2008 (EST)
Thanks for info Texugo and Stefan. Alexa has most of the info I was looking for but doesn't go into as much detail such as which pages are visited most (for example: Japan, Cancun, etc.) Stefan, you say we're lagging behind tripadvisor? From Alexa's stats, looks like WikiT is way ahead. Which stat are you referring to? I was judging it by the rankings. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Paula (talkcontribs)

Hmmm, no checked it, and they rank around 200-300 while we rank hover around 4000-5000. Anyway, find some other stats here, which includes demographics, and they claim WT to get 583.000 unique visitors per month, or 45.000 per day, which is much higher - and this figure only includes visitors from the US - wow! --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 04:25, 10 December 2008 (EST)

I see what you were reading. is better. WT is actually posted as being 22,000/day. Looks like the daily is calculated as an average of individual days. Unfortunately unlike Alexa, Quantcast only tracks US internet users. Interestingly enough for they compare global stats as well. Another related question, since WikiT doesn't accept ads why do google's ads show up on the site?Paula 03:36, 11 December 2008 (EST)

They are used to help pay for the site. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 17:34, 11 December 2008 (EST).

Yes, I know that's what they are there for. My question is basically who would a person contact if they wanted their ads to show up on WikiTravel? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Paula (talkcontribs)
You could make a proposal at shared:Talk:Advertising policy, but in general the community has been pretty against advertising... we've allowed for WT Press, since it's a related project and there was no opposition, google ads on the other hand caused a bit of a stir. I can't imagine third-party ads will be popular – cacahuate talk 21:39, 11 December 2008 (EST)


I'm de-touting some and reverting those that aren't actually in the correct location, but only for Maryland locations. Someone may want to fix the rest of these. I wouldn't object to a massive revert, since the user seems to be operating in bad faith, but there is some useful information there. --Jonboy 11:19, 22 December 2008 (EST)

I'd prefer not to see a mass revert - while I agree that it's annoying to have people associated with hotel chains plastering promotional material across the site, the hotel info is still valuable and shouldn't be terribly hard to clean up. Ideally, if anyone has any ideas on how to better get the attention of users like this one it would be great to be able to let them know that the information is good but using promotional language and always inserting those listings at the top of the hotel list (instead of alphabetically) is inappropriate. -- Ryan • (talk) • 16:36, 22 December 2008 (EST)

Launching Routebox navigation

Most everything seems to have come to a consensus regarding the implementation of Routebox navigation. I want to thank everyone who has participated in the discussions so far, contributing great ideas. Now let's please plunge forward and see what we can do. We can still discuss policy changes as needed, but I think it's time that anyone can get their hair wet and see how it goes. Please have a close look at the policy page first, and then try it out yourself! You can also check out the examples which have already been set in the Texas Panhandle/Oklahoma Great Plains region, the Florida region and, for a train network, have a look at Japan, where all high-speed train lines have been completed, as well as a number of the most important regular train lines. Feel free to join in the discussions at Wikitravel talk:Routebox navigation if you have any concerns, suggestions, or questions. Cheers! Texugo 09:41, 23 December 2008 (EST)

Thanks for your work on this. Looking forward to trying it. --Inas 17:28, 23 December 2008 (EST)
Same here, I'll be working on this as soon as I have a good amount of spare time. AHeneen 16:08, 24 December 2008 (EST)

Glædelig Jul

Thought I'd blatantly disregard the rules of off-topic chatter, and wish everyone here at this little corner of the internet a happy and merry Christmas, since we are one of those weird peoples who actually celebrate christmas on the 24th. So Glædelig Jul, Merry christmas, Feliz Navidad, Joyeux Noël, Frohe Weihnachten, Hyvää Joulua, メリークリスマス, С Рождеством Христовым (even though that's a little while off) and whatever it is to the rest of you, and a happy New Year too! --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 06:11, 24 December 2008 (EST)

Merry Christmas to you too. AHeneen 16:03, 24 December 2008 (EST)

Top Cities by 'Liveability'

So there's probably 100 different ways to rank the "best cities" in the world, but I cam across this article this evening and thought I'd share it with yall. Anyways, I hope everyone who is celebrating holidays (Christmas, Hanukkah, Kwanzaa, Festivus, Boxing Day, Yule, etc.) are enjoying them. AHeneen 01:55, 27 December 2008 (EST)