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The '''Travellers' pub''' is the place to ask questions when you're confused, lost, afraid, tired, annoyed, thoughtful, or helpful. Please check the [[Wikitravel:FAQ|FAQ]] and [[Wikitravel:Help|Help]] page before asking a question, though, since that may save your time and others'.  
 
The '''Travellers' pub''' is the place to ask questions when you're confused, lost, afraid, tired, annoyed, thoughtful, or helpful. Please check the [[Wikitravel:FAQ|FAQ]] and [[Wikitravel:Help|Help]] page before asking a question, though, since that may save your time and others'.  
  
 
Please add new questions '''at the bottom''' of the page and sign your post by appending four tildes (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>) to it, but otherwise [[Wikitravel:plunge forward|plunge forward]]!
 
Please add new questions '''at the bottom''' of the page and sign your post by appending four tildes (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>) to it, but otherwise [[Wikitravel:plunge forward|plunge forward]]!
  
{{disclaimerbox|If you have a question or suggestion about a particular article, try [[Wikitravel:using talk pages|using talk pages]] to keep the discussion specific to that article.
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You can find Archived discussions here: '''[[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/Archives|Travellers´pub Archives]]'''
 
 
If you are having a problem that you think has to do with the [http://wikipedia.sourceforge.net/ Mediawiki software], please post that on the [[:shared:Wikitravel Shared:Technical requests|Technical requests]] page on [[:shared:Main Page|Wikitravel Shared]] instead.
 
 
 
If you want to celebrate a significant contribution to Wikitravel by yourself or others, [[Wikitravel:Celebrate a contribution]] may be the place you are looking for.
 
 
 
}}
 
 
 
<big>'''Please sweep the pub'''</big>
 
 
 
Keeping the Pub clean is a group effort. If we have too many conversations on this page, it will get too noisy and hard to read. If you see an old conversation (i.e. '''three months''' after the last comment in that discussion) that could or should be moved to a [[Wikitravel:using talk pages|talk page]], please do so, and note there that it has been swept in from the pub.
 
  
* A question regarding a destination article should be swept to the article discussion page
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{{disclaimerbox|*If you have a question or suggestion about a ''particular'' article, try [[Wikitravel:using talk pages|using talk pages]] to keep the discussion specific to ''that'' article.
* A discussion regarding a policy or the subject of an expedition can be swept to the policy or expedition discussion page
 
* A simple question asked by a user can be swept to that user's talk page, but consider if the documentation needs a quick update to make it clearer for the next user with the same question.
 
* A pointer to a discussion going on elsewhere, such as a notice of a star nomination or or a request to comment on another talk page, can be removed when it is two months old.  Any discussion that occurred in the pub can be swept to to where the main discussion took place.
 
  
Any discussions that do not fall into any of these categories, and are not of any special importance for posterity, should be archived to '''[[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/Archives]]''' and removed from here. If you are not sure where to put a discussion, let it be—better to spend your efforts on those that you do know where to place.
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*If you are having a problem that you think has to do with the [https://mediawiki.org/ MediaWiki software], please post that on the [[:shared:Wikitravel Shared:Technical requests|Technical requests]] page on [[:shared:Main Page|Wikitravel Shared]] instead.
  
{{WikitravelDoc|collaboration}}
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*If you want to celebrate a significant contribution to Wikitravel by yourself or others, [[Wikitravel:Celebrate a contribution]] may be the place you are looking for.}}
  
 
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[[ja:Wikitravel:旅人の居酒屋]]
 
[[ja:Wikitravel:旅人の居酒屋]]
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[[ko:Wikitravel:사랑방]]
 
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[[zh:Wikitravel:旅行者茶馆]]
 
[[zh:Wikitravel:旅行者茶馆]]
 
[[wts:Wikitravel Shared:Travellers' pub]]
 
[[wts:Wikitravel Shared:Travellers' pub]]
----
 
 
== OpenID still not working==
 
Also, login on en: using OpenID from fr: and URL ''fr:user:joelf'' doesn't seem to work either. Thanks for your help. joelf
 
:Take a look at [[:wts:Tech:Upgrade_to_MediaWiki_1.17#1.17_UPGRADE_BUG_REPORTS]].  --[[User:Peterfitzgerald|Peter]] <small><sup>[[User_talk:Peterfitzgerald|Talk]]</sup></small> 14:44, 18 June 2012 (EDT)
 
::Still not working yesterday. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 15:57, 18 October 2012 (EDT)
 
:::We will disable. Not a needed function at this time.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 19:30, 18 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
==[[Archaeological sites]] and [[Old Towns]]==
 
Started a page about [[archaeological sites]] and [[Old Towns]]. Contributions and cross-links are welcome. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 08:58, 10 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
: New articles: [[Christian buildings, sites and events]] and [[Muslim buildings, sites and events]]. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 10:39, 10 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:: These should link to existing articles such as [[Holy Land]] and [[UNESCO World Heritage List]]. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 20:52, 12 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
==Right to vanish policy==
 
I feel that we lack a right to vanish policy. The meatball version is to be found [http://meatballwiki.org/wiki/RightToVanish here]. The Wikipedia version is [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Courtesy_vanishing here]. Suggestion: import the current Wikipedia version. [[User:Riggwelter|Riggwelter]] 09:45, 12 September 2012 (EDT)
 
:*'''Support''' --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 21:16, 23 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
== Many more administrators needed? ==
 
 
It's been more than a year since the last Administrator, [[User:Ikan Kekek]], was nominated.
 
 
If you believe a Wikitraveller — including yourself — should have [[Wikitravel:Administrators|administrative status]] please verify that they meet the guidelines for becoming an administrator and then add them to the nominations section at [[Wikitravel:Administrator nominations]]
 
 
Nominations should also include a sentence or two outlining the nominee's relevant experience and understanding of Wikitravel's policies. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 21:24, 23 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
: The main reason for this problem is that nearly all the current admins have left to start another project. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 22:01, 23 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::W. Frank is correct -- qualified admins are needed now, and to guide this project going forward. This is an excellent fresh start for Wikitravel :) --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 20:29, 24 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
== Massive spamming ==
 
 
Can the techies improve the captcha or something to cut down on the amount of spam? I've been deleting several pages a day for some time & over a dozen today, and I am not the only admin doing it, but there are lots more. Most involve accounts apparently registered only to spam. Is there a way to prevent spambot registrations? [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 01:24, 24 September 2012 (EDT)
 
:Captcha is at its highest level (recaptcha, actually). We're exploring new ways to combat spam accounts, including the Abuse Filter extension. If you notice patterns in the spammers, please let me know. Whether it's coming from a common IP range, always posting the same exact content, similar usernames, etc -- if there's a pattern we can write a rule around, we can set up blocks.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 20:34, 24 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:: One obvious pattern is the dozens of pages with long strings of digits as page names, all with the same content, created by one user. [[Special:Contributions/Русская_месть]]
 
:: Another is use of the <nowiki><br></nowiki> tag, not needed on a wiki but found in many pages whose pattern is "Hello, I'm Bozo McGuffin from Camelot.<nowiki><br><br></nowiki> See my blog:" then some rubbish link. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 23:33, 24 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:: Thinking about it, if there was a way to prohibit new users from posting links -- for example just reject any edit to a new user page that includes a link -- that would eliminate most spam. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 23:51, 24 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::: [[User:Пиздец неруси!]] is spamming. Block immediately. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 07:42, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::::Yes, he has vandalized hundreds of articles. Blocking him before he vandalizes a few hundred more articles might be a nice idea... <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 08:25, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
If you feel strongly about this, as I do, then why not suggest other Wikitravellers — including yourself — for [[Wikitravel:Administrators|Administrator status]]?
 
 
Please verify that they (you?) meet the guidelines for becoming an administrator and then add them to the nominations section at [[Wikitravel:Administrator nominations]]. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 09:17, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:FYI, we have placed some filters, as well as scripted the mass deletion of the vandalism over the last 2 days. It's not a big deal in the end, just a minor annoyance. Vandalizing a wiki... pointless. Thank you all for you help.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 14:54, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::That's great news! --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 15:09, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
This account [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Special:Contributions/%D0%A1%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BD_-_%D0%BD%D0%B0%D1%88%D0%B5_%D0%B7%D0%BD%D0%B0%D0%BC%D1%8F_%D0%B1%D0%BE%D0%B5%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B5!&limit=500&target=%D0%A1%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BD+-+%D0%BD%D0%B0%D1%88%D0%B5+%D0%B7%D0%BD%D0%B0%D0%BC%D1%8F+%D0%B1%D0%BE%D0%B5%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B5!] has vandalised thousands of pages. On the software side of things, can making more than "X number of edits in X amount of time" by a new user/IP address be blocked? [[User:AHeneen|AHeneen]] 03:33, 26 September 2012 (EDT) PS:The name translates (Google Translate) as "Stalin-our shared combat". Wonder if it has something to do with those Pro-Communist/Russian nationalist people we've had to deal with on the Russia & Tiraspol pages?
 
 
:PPS:Looks like several vandalism bots might be those people.  За Родину!= For the Motherland!  Слава России!!!=Glory to Russia!  Слава Родине!=Glory to the motherland!  Пиздец неруси!=Nerusi f***ed!  Русская месть=Русская месть  Возмездие= Retaliation Месть русских=Revenge of the Russian That's all the Cyrillic user names that appear in the block log going back through the 14th.
 
 
:The red box being put on pages corresponds with the [http://wikitravel.org/ru/%D0%A3%D1%87%D0%B0%D1%81%D1%82%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BA:%D0%A0%D1%83%D1%81%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9 page of the user] that has taken over the Russian WT merging former Soviet countries into the "Russia" page. User page translates to: "Слава России! GLORY OF RUSSIA! Glory to the great heroes of the Russian land! Honor, praise, honor and eternal glory to the victorious people! Kudos to you, brave,    GLORY, fearless!        Eternal glory SINGS TO YOU PEOPLE. Valiantly lived,    Death is broken,        MEMORIES OF YOU WILL NEVER DIE! WE - RUSSIAN, God with us!"  Clearly some delusional apparatchik well-versed in Russian nationalist, revisionist history. Can Cyrillic characters be blocked from new user names? Any other ways to deal with this? Seems to me like the people who gave us the headache over on the Russia/Tiraspol pages were likely from Transnistria (which corresponds to the Tiraspol edits & the fact that Transnistria remains stuck in the 1980s with the Communist party in charge). Any way to automatically block (or put restrictions on editing capability) of Moldovan IP addresses? Possible to also add Ukraine, too, because Transnistria borders it and it's possible telecom services might come from Ukraine due to the conflict between Moldova/Transnistria.[[User:AHeneen|AHeneen]] 04:22, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
: Can we make it impossible to register an account on en with a non-ASCII name? There have been at least two accounts with Russian names used for vandalism. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 03:45, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::I see the vandalism and your heroic efforts. I think both those restrictions are on the table and good ideas.  Thanks for your heroic efforts in reverting. We'll have to see about a mass revert via username. If the Abuse Filter can handle the x edits/x time restriction, that might do it. Even if we set it to 50/hour, it would have helped here tremendously.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 03:56, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
I would strongly deprecate any blocking based on geographical area or Cyrillic alphabet names. We do not want the innocent to suffer because of the guilty. Number of edits allowable per minute (if technically feasible) would not penalise the innocent newbie so much, but set much lower limits eg 1 edit per 2 minutes for 1st 7 days  of a new account, then 1 edit per 1 minute for next 7 days, then 2 edits per 1 minute for next 28 days, then 3 edits per 1 minute for next 90 days, subject to manual override on appeal. -- <strike>[[Special:Contributions/89.242.187.211|89.242.187.211]]</strike> [[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 04:36, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:I agree with Frank, we shouldn't discriminate against a certain area or language. Anyways, the vandal could switch to ASCII names, so there's not much point in blocking non-ASCII names. But I'm fine with an edits per minute limit. <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 10:23, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:: I am taking out anywhere from two to twenty spam pages every time I visit, and that is just the obvious stuff. I'm not even looking at the dozens that are probably spam, the ones with a three-line intro to a "user" and some irrelevant link. Nor am I patrolling edits other than new pages and some things on my watchlist. I am doing far more deletions now than I used to when there was a whole crew of editors, but I'm also seeing more problems I do not have time for and much less patrolling by other admins.
 
 
:: If IB want to keep this site alive despite the massive defection of editors, something must be done quite urgently. Either find many new editors or have IB employees doing extensive patrolling. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 23:48, 14 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::: And the spammers are getting craftier. I believe [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk:Dajamer&diff=prev&oldid=1941189 this one] created several different "Black Hat" user names to vandalise dozens of pages and then went back using his "White hat" user account to "repair" the damage - but also added a tailored external link to a travel guide each time, hoping it would not be noticed in the pag3 "restoration"!
 
:::IBadmins are doing extensive patrolling Monday to Friday but there are patterns in this spamming which could be used to automate reversions.
 
:::Meanwhile, I would hope that we might see some more [[Wikitravel:Administrator_nominations|Administrator nominations here...]] --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 10:08, 15 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::::Thank for that alert, guys -- were you in fact seeing that spam piling up on the weekend? We do expect to see less of that as more admins are starting to peck away at night and weekends. We also are in the process of implementing a number of filters that keep vandalism and spam more at bay, but there is only so much Captcha and filtering can do versus NEW pages; no system is going to be able to tell what is a "good" new page and what is not, because there's very little commonality with which to write a rule that prevents them without potentially preventing "good" new pages from being created.
 
 
::::The good news is, new content continues to be added to WT at a fantastic rate. This site is doing great, and you two are part of the reason. If you have ideas for spam remediation, I am more than happy to implement them!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:24, 18 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:::::I do have one lead that you might want to check out - but since I suspect it might be against (your implicit) policy to mention the source here, I will email you about it. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 18:44, 18 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
===Abuse filter===
 
The abuse filter names are singularly unhelpful (they appear to be named after things like Stephen King novels and the like).  When a user gets a message like "A brief description of the abuse rule which your action matched is: Lethal Weapon", that doesn't help them make more constructive edits, because it doesn't explain what the problem was.  [[User:LtPowers|LtPowers]] 16:47, 25 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
===Legal action?===
 
User [[User:IBlegal]] has made some imprecise and obnoxious threats and IB has actually sued some users and there are countersuits[https://blog.wikimedia.org/2012/09/05/wikimedia-foundation-seeks-declaratory-relief-in-response-to-legal-threats-from-internet-brands/].
 
 
Would it not be a better use of legal dep't time to go after the spammers who are actively and persistently damaging the site? I took out 24 rubbish pages today, 19 yesterday, and I'm just doing the obvious ones. Unchecked, these bozos will destroy WT.
 
 
Also, going after spammers would be much better politically, doing something that might help all the other wiki sites out there rather than appearing petulant and aggressive. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 06:09, 13 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:You're not wrong! --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 15:01, 13 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::That was literally months ago. We've moved on.
 
::FYI legal has nothing whatsoever to do with spam. Spam is handled here, by people like you & me. Some of it we can handle technically, a lot of it manually. This is how it is everywhere. It's a neverending battle, but we do very well at it. I saw your edits over the weekend and recently, Pashley, and you're doing an amazing job! For instance: the life of the [http://wikitravel.org/en/Special:Undelete/Various_Knobs_and_pulls_for_door knob and door] page was... about 3 hours? That's fantastic!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 16:05, 13 November 2012 (EST)
 
:::That's great news if it really is true that Internet Brands have reached an out of court settlement with the Wikimedia foundation and the former contributors to this site that it sued, IBobi. Where can we see the press release and ''then'' move on? --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 16:23, 13 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::: Good question! [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 08:02, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
Yes, I know that currently "legal has nothing whatsoever to do with spam"; I am suggesting that they should. There are laws in place that make misuse of other people's computers a criminal offense and/or grounds for a lawsuit in many jurisdictions. The site logs have IP addresses for where this rubbish comes from. The spam itself has URLs for advertised pages. I'm both cynical and biased, so my opinion of IB's legal department is remarkably low, but I imagine they could do this. It might even be profitable if they nail the right spammers. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 08:13, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
:Again, you're not wrong!
 
:Although, the hard case spammers can use proxy servers and internet cafe's to try and attempt to circumvent these lawsuits, it would be a relatively trivial programming task to block IP edits (as opposed to edits by registered users) from each proxy or IP address as it becomes known for abuse. In this case I would suggest also blocking edits by registered users from each black-listed proxy or IP address until an editor using a black-listed proxy or IP address has made a certain number of good edits - say 15 - so that privacy obsessed and registered "good" editors are not handicapped in any way.
 
:Thanks for continuing your spam removal, Pashley! --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 10:15, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
::Ideally I agree with all of this. Internet companies have explored many avenues for actually tracking down spammers who blast their sites. The sad reality is they continue to make enough money doing this that they can afford to employ armies of people in between themselves and the site, masking IPs, and generally making themselves untouchable to anything short of the FBI; and if they're outside the US? No idea. Interpol? We always do as Frank suggested, blocking obvious spam user accounts permanently while also blocking the IP address they come from for a shorter amount of time. It's the best that can be done, and it works. The amount and type of spam we had three months ago was night and day compared to now. As we continue to add admins, it will get even better.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 13:46, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::: You think the current situation is "better"? Wow! To me, it seems an almost complete disaster.
 
::: Checking recent changes, I find I have nuked 57 garbage pages in the last four days. I am ''only'' checking main article space and only taking out really obvious spam. There are certainly dozens I am missing; I would not be surprised if it were hundreds.
 
::: Moreover, I generally just nuke the page leaving it to others to block the bogus users. I quite often see the page reappear in my watchlist with new spam, indicating that no-one is doing those blocks. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 14:07, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:::::It's definitely better; the measure is not how many spam pages appear, it's how long do they live on the site for. If a spammer/spambot creates a page, we delete the page, block the spam account and block the IP they used, the same spammer can then create the same page using a new account and IP. That's why you may see that happening after you nuke a page; it isn't the same IP or account, it's the same spammer. If I could delete *people* I would ;)
 
:::::By the same token, if you do happen to see the same page reappear after being created by the same user/IP, please let me know. We can always use more tips on how to get it done best. Whenever possible, I use the following technique:
 
:::::1. Locate spam edit. 2. Block user/IP. 3. Protect the spam page to be editable admins only (in the hopes that it won't be able to be recreated). 4. Delete the spam page.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 14:16, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
::::::You talk a good game but, as my neighbours sometimes say in Glasgow [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk%3AIBAlex&action=historysubmit&diff=1952468&oldid=1952345 you seem to be all mouth and nae troosers!].
 
::::::IB: "As we continue to add admins" but [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk%3AIBAlex&action=historysubmit&diff=1953924&oldid=1953816]
 
 
Good luck. I took out a dozen rubbish pages today, but I feel like I'm almost alone both as a contributor & as an admin. There are masses of admin work being left undone &mdash; patrolling in general, in particular catching the bogus user pages I mentioned above, blocking the bogus users for pages I've deleted (one spambot whose drivel I removed refilled the page eight times before I got bored & removed it from my watchlist; it is probably still active), appointing new admins (see troosers just above), ...
 
 
My editing work now is on other wikis where there's a reasonable community to interact with and admin things actually get done. I'll keep the account here and pop in from time to time to see what's doing, but for now I'm done with even trying to fix the spam problem. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 17:16, 29 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:''Bon voyage'', Sandy!
 
:The dwindling '''real''' community on Wikitravel (as opposed to some PR-speak or Orwellian new definition) certainly have appreciated your erudite contributions and dogged persistence to the bitter end here.
 
 
:I'll probably linger on (at least until fired by IBobi or one of his minions) since I hate seeing a good project destroyed by boneheaded stupidity and inaction. I'll message you privately via one of your other projects (since e-mailing is still disabled here) if there is anything cosmic that needs your urgent attention. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 19:35, 29 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:::Very sorry to hear that. In general, this *is* how spam gets removed. I and the other admins here at IB are constantly removing the spam that gets through the Captcha, Spam Blacklist, and Abuse Filters that we are also constantly updating. There will always be people trying to spam the site, and we'll always be here removing it. It's simply not possible to stop it all on the front end, so blocking and deleting is the order of the day. It's a fact of life, and any site that encourages anyone to edit it will have to deal.
 
:::You've been a very valuable admin here, Sandy, and I hope you'll reconsider & stay. Any suggestions you have will be heeded; in particular, if there are persistent spambots, we can block them at the IP level, or even rages of IPs -- there's no reason to continually remove the same content.
 
:::Either way, we'll be seeing you around, and thank you :) --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] 19:52, 29 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::: Pashley, it's sad to see you giving up. Please know, that everybody here '''highly appreciates your contributions''' and your '''administrative efforts'''. Spam is going to be always happening on sites where the content is generated by users. Actually, right now IB notices way less spam than it used to be. There are more people keeping an eye on the site plus we set up a bunch of abuse filters that help us significantly.
 
:::We would like to  see you here often. Please know that you are always welcomed on Wikitravel! Cheers! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 19:54, 29 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
== Help! ==
 
 
I'm trying to remove vandalism on the page [[Midwest (United States of America)]]. But I can't, and I get the message:
 
 
This action has been automatically identified as harmful, and therefore disallowed. If you believe your edit was constructive, please inform an administrator of what you were trying to do. A brief description of the abuse rule which your action matched is: Link spamming by anonymous or recently-registered users
 
 
Why is reverting vandalism harmful?! (unsigned by [http://wikitravel.org/en/Special:Contributions/204.45.134.109 204.45.134.109])
 
 
:Hi there, It may be that your edit included a link, which is something the system looks for from newly registered or anonymous IP editors (since they are often sources of spam). Sorry about that, it's a protection that helps keep Wikitravel's pages clean and spam-free. I recommend registering an account, and after you've become recognized by the community and the system, your edits can be properly attributed to you, etc. Welcome aboard!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 15:42, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:Also, I have made that revert!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 15:58, 25 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::Ok, I've made an account and I'm trying to revert vandalism on the page [[Mombasa]], but I cant, and I still get the same message! Im only trying to help wikitravel. [[User:Ÿ;;!!!|Ÿ;;!!!]] 09:31, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:::I'm sorry, I realize you're helping by editing the page back to where it was before. Please keep making constructive edits -- we're happy to have you!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 03:07, 27 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
== MVGreenland ==
 
 
User [http://wikitravel.org/en/Special:Contributions/MVGreenland MVGreenland] has been contributing many listings and photos (see WS). What do you think of these contributions? Touting?--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 14:34, 27 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:Someone needs to review all the photos to ensure the licensing is correct...someone over on WT Shared needs to check these. Make sure to click the link to the photo. At first I clicked the link to the user stream and saw all the photos were copyrighted. However, when I clicked on the link to the photo ([http://wikitravel.org/shared/File:Raining_Qaqortoq.jpeg on WTS] and [http://www.flickr.com/photos/ilovegreenland/4929429831/ on flickr]) I noticed it was licensed CC-SA 2.5 on WTS & CC-A 2.0 on flickr. As far as edits go, I went through the most recent 100 edits and didn't see anything that goes against our policies. There were a couple photos of businesses added (1-2 hotels & a bookshop), but none of the wording in hotel listings this user has added sound like touting. IMO, the user seems like a very helpful contributor to our Greenland pages. [[User:AHeneen|AHeneen]] 00:24, 28 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::Thanks for that -- I generally felt the same way, as did IBcash, about the tone of his edits. Skirting the line perhaps but nothing worse than other business owners do.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 01:29, 28 September 2012 (EDT)
 
 
== Selection of Destination of the Month and Off the Beaten Path for Main Page ==
 
 
Hey current editors! We have changed the Destination of the Month and Off the Beaten Path sections of the Main Page for October. However, we would value your input and suggestions in the [[Wikitravel:Destination of the Month candidates|Destination of the Month candidates page]] for following months. Please check it out! [[User:IBcash|IBcash]] 15:38, 2 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:Obviously I'd like to feature a New Zealand destination - but first I need to get one to Star status! --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 07:50, 3 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::Albuquerque has been already featured in the past as a Destination of the Month. <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 17:01, 3 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::: You're right! It slipped past me. Thanks! Since we changed it early because we didn't have one in September, we could keep it there until the 15th (the actual time when the OTBP would change) and then change it. What do you think? Any suggestions for another October OTBP? [[User:IBcash|IBcash]] 13:59, 4 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::::Thanks guys.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 19:55, 16 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:::::Hello! Are there any suggestions for the '''Destination of the Month''' and '''Off the Beaten Path''' for '''December'''. Please let us know your ideas [[Wikitravel:Destination of the Month candidates|here]]. Thank you! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 19:04, 27 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:::::I think that [[Jacksonville]] would be a good '''Destination Of The Month''' for February or March. What do you think? [[User:Travelgeek]] 12:34, 27 December 2012 (EST)
 
 
== References/footnotes/quoting ==
 
 
Hello everyone,
 
 
Being an experienced Wikipedia editor, but very, '''very''' new to Wikitravel editing (though a somewhat frequent reader of), I - on my very first intended edit - ran into a question.<br />
 
In the [[Slovakia#By_car|By car]]-section of the [[Slovakia]] travel guide, I would like to have quoted a part of the [http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/travel-and-living-abroad/travel-advice-by-country/europe/slovakia UK Foreign & Commonwealth Office travel advice for Slovakia]: "''The standard of driving is not high and can be aggressive. Specifically, beware of oncoming cars overtaking on your side of the road (particularly on bends and hills).''" In my view it sums it up very brilliantly (having being a driving tourist in Slovakia on several occasions) and I think, that sourcing it would only make it all the more authoritative in this case. While being a reader of Wikitravel I have never pondered over the "lack" of quotes, but I have now looked into both a number of articles as well as various parts of the [[Wikitravel:Manual of style]], the [[Wikitravel:External links]] (could be it had something - it didn't) and [[Wikitravel:Welcome, Wikipedians]]/[[Wikitravel:Cooperating with Wikipedia]]/[[shared:How to re-use Wikipedia content]] (Wikipedia is rather anal about quoting and sourcing). Basically I came up empty-handed in all cases. I even found [[Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:Reflist]] indicating that I'm not the only one with this "predicament". So my question is:<br />
 
How do I quote and reference it?
 
I'm inclined to just insert a statement such as:
 
:As the UK Foreign & Commonwealth Office put it in their [http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/travel-and-living-abroad/travel-advice-by-country/europe/slovakia travel advice for Slovakia]: "The standard of driving is not high and can be aggressive. Specifically, beware of oncoming cars overtaking on your side of the road (particularly on bends and hills)."
 
But I would rather do it in the right manner, in case I have missed something very obvious :). In kind regards, Henrik/[[User:Heb|Heb]] 04:01, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
 
::You could go the short quote route (under the fair dealing copyright provisions) providing a link to the source (that might quickly become outdated) but it might be better just to put that in your own words - especially if you've personal experience of driving in Slovakia. That would mean one less external link - [[Wikitravel:External_links|which we prefer]]. We normally don't reference material here and unless we're (rarely) using a direct quote, don't usually source either. Enjoy your new-found freedom and plunge forward Henrik!--[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 07:55, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
== SVG-files? ==
 
 
Okay, another question from newbie Dane, but please bare with me...<br />
 
I wanted to update the S-train-map in the [[Copenhagen#Get_around|Get around]]-section of the [[Copenhagen]] travel guide. The one currently there is from 2009, and there has been two changes since then. Because I am slightly lazy, I thought of using the [http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:S-train_diagram_(dec_2011).svg map from Wikimedia Commons], which as far as I read [[shared:Tech:Enable InstantCommons]] should be fairly easy. Unfortunately the simple <nowiki>[[Image:S-train diagram (dec 2011).svg|thumb|420px|Map of S-trains and Metro in the Copenhagen area, with districts marked in the background]]</nowiki> didn't work - and neither did replacing Image: with File:. So I tried including a .png-file from Wikimedia Commons and that actually did work :)<br />
 
Then I did a [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Special%3ASearch&redirs=1&search=svg&fulltext=Search&ns6=1&redirs=1&title=Special%3ASearch&advanced=1&fulltext=Advanced+search search for .svg-files on Wikitravel] and there seems to be a lot of them. But none of them works. So I'm guessing there is an issue with SVG-files somewhere. I tried with SVG-files on Wikimedia Commons and there have no problems. What do I do? In kind regards, Henrik/[[User:Heb|Heb]] 04:28, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:I'm afraid this is beyond my knowledge - but I can confirm it's a real problem - I had to substitute a png file for an svg file in [[Template:Busy|this template]], Henrik. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 17:16, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::I will have tech look into this! Thank you, --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:30, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
:::OK -- we're seeing that they do in fact work (you have to click all the way through to the actual file, not the thumbnail), they just won't produce thumbnails.
 
 
:::Can you tell me how you're uploading them, and where, step by step, i.e. 1) Go this page 2) Edit 3) Upload this file or reference this file 4) Error?--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:50, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::::Looks like this may be fixed; thumbnails should slowly repopulate as the cache rebuilds over time. Let me know if this is still not working as expected.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 20:16, 17 October 2012 (EDT)
 
 
 
== Travel news ==
 
Hello! I would like to call to action all the administrators and contributors on WT.
 
For a long time [[Travel news]] have been outdated. It is time to change it and keep the Travel Alerts and Current and upcoming events up-to-date. To achieve that, '''I need your help'''. Who is willing to offer his/her help? Thank you! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 15:54, 29 October 2012 (EDT)
 
:I think many of us are waiting for some straight answers [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Wikitravel:Travellers%27_pub&oldid=1954973#Clarification here] before we decide whether it's worth the effort in doing anything other than curating the articles that have already been written, Aleksandra. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 19:56, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
::It's a pity to hear that, Frank, because I really believe in Wikitravel and I would like to make the site as much updated as possible. I know that with '''yours''' and '''community''' support it will be easier and better. [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 20:27, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
==Edit war: [[Stay safe]] section in [[Stockholm]]==
 
The [[stay safe]] section in [[Stockholm]] (and to some extent [[Sweden]]) is frequently subject to edit conflicts, many of them pushing the opinion that Stockholm would be a dangerous city. Can you give some advice how to solve this disagreement? Thanks in advance. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 09:45, 6 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:Hello Blist! Thank you for notifying me. I checked it out and I saw that the user with the IP address 84.217.118.107 has made just one change in the [[stay safe]] section in [[Stockholm]]. However, I have already contacted him asking to avoid edit wars on [[Stockholm]] page and discuss all the changes he is planning to do on the [[Talk:Stockholm| discussion page]].
 
:I am also watching this page so I will keep an eye on this issue. Cheers! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 13:04, 6 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::The best solution is always to discuss the changes you both are making, using the Discussion page for that article. Sometimes it can be difficult to get an IP user to engage in this way. Try leaving a detailed note in the Edit Summary asking him/her to talk to you.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 14:43, 6 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::: POV-pushing continues, by first-time unregistered users. Can anything more be done? Please contribute to [[Talk:Stockholm]]. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 07:06, 26 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
== Travel booking tool! ==
 
Soon, Wikitravellers will have the ability not only to browse and edit travel topics right here on the world's largest and best free travel wiki, but also to *book* travel from the very same page.
 
 
Wikitravel has partnered with Orbitz to bring you a tool that will give you air and hotel booking options on each destination page in our travel guide. If you log in to your Wikitravel account, you will need to go to your *preferences* in order to turn on this booking tool -- you will not see it at all unless you turn it on.
 
 
We've worked with the Wikitravel community over the past 2 years to determine exactly what the look and feel of the tool ought to be; please let us know any feedback you have, and we'll make every effort to accommodate changes! Thank you, --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 14:34, 19 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:I think this is a great idea for monetising the site!
 
:I also like the way that none of our registered editors will probably ever notice this. After all, you're not wrong when you continually point out that there are millions of visitors to this site who never bother to register and will automatically get a chance to make bookings.
 
:So as not to weaken the credibility of the ads, it's even more important to give more people effective janitor tools!
 
:However, I still think that you should clarify in writing the community established policies you have changed. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 15:05, 19 November 2012 (EST)
 
::I've switched on the display of Orbitz but still I never see it. What pages is it actually working on, please?
 
::Also, Wikitravel has been slow to the point of being unusable today from this Pacific Rim country - the competing Wikimedia site loads more than 100 times faster on identical pages like [[North Korea]]. More than 20 times in succession I get the "Sorry! We could not process your edit due to a loss of session data" message. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 04:07, 22 November 2012 (EST)
 
:::Did I miss an important announcement? I still don't see the display of Orbitz travel information but now the option to switch it on has disappeared completely from my preferences. What gives? --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 02:54, 30 November 2012 (EST)
 
::::At this time, the tool is only available if you are not logged in. We will restore functionality to those who wish to use it while logged in soon.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] 14:07, 30 November 2012 (EST)
 
Thanks for your prompt response.
 
 
I assume you are still having technical problems since I have just seen the Orbitz tool appear for the first time '''while logged in''' and with my preferences flag '''not''' set to "Show Orbitz Search", as this screenshot clearly shows if you click on it to enlarge: [[Image:WikitravelScreenshot20121201Orbitz-Displays-while-logged-in.png|150px|Screenshot a few moments after IBobi's assertion]] Please feel free to email me if you need help.
 
 
With [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Wikitravel:Travellers%27_pub&curid=76403&diff=1961629&oldid=1961571 this edit] you removed another user's comments. Unless there are exceptional reasons, this is frowned upon, so I assume the excision was accidental, yes? --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 15:10, 30 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:Alice- you have to go to your web browser's options and '''clear cache''' . Then the Orbitz Widget will not show again. I hope it helps. [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 15:27, 30 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
==[[Southwest (United States of America)]]==
 
What happened to this page? Its text is now on [[Southwest United States]] but that page doesn't contain the history. <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 22:00, 31 October 2012 (EDT)
 
:Bizarre! You might want to check the logs. (IBadmins have recently promoted - without any community discussion or warning - a number of admins that, unlike yourself, have a very limited understanding of the policies and procedures of the English Wikitravel. Equally it might be some new spammer trickery.) --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 00:57, 1 November 2012 (EDT)
 
::Fixed; no biggie. Just re-saved from earlier edit. Happens with MW database on occasion.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 04:58, 1 November 2012 (EDT)
 
:::Thanks for your very rapid response.
 
:::I have deleted the contents & re-directed: [[Southwest (United States of America)]] since it's a breach of our Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike licence to duplicate a page without duplicating the attribution history.
 
:::I'm still baffled as to how (on the face of it) an IP editor managed to duplicate an article and then delete the original (and its edit history) and all without leaving a trace in the logs. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 00:36, 4 November 2012 (EDT)
 
 
::::Without doing extensive research, I'm not sure that's how it went down. Looked to me like a DB error that was easily corrected. At any rate, after verifying that the "new" page redirects also redirected to the "old" page, I went ahead and deleted the "new" page, as it consisted of nothing more than dupe content, which is confusing. We don't want people contributing on one location and not the other, which is just what would happen.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 15:52, 5 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
===Database error===
 
What is this database error? There are many pages missing including [[Ocean City]], [[Sydney/Bondi Beach]], [[Afrikaans phrasebook]]. <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 18:27, 5 November 2012 (EST)
 
:We're looking into what causes this. Obviously we do not want to wait until a knowledgeable editor like yourself discovers pages that are unusable. Did you find these by browsing to them or by some other method?--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:39, 5 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
==[[Wikitravel:Geocoding]] is also broken==
 
The article above states: "''It's possible to encode information about the latitude and longitude of a destination into the destination guide itself. This information will then be used to make special HTML tags to show that the page is related to those lat/long coordinates;"..."A "Map" link will also be added to the "Toolbox" in the left pane, which will take users to a Google, Yahoo, or Microsoft map of the location.''"
 
 
I've added the relevant template to our [[Nelson (New Zealand)]] article but the "Map" link was '''not''' added to the "Toolbox" in the left pane! --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 20:37, 6 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:Hmm. Research shows that there have been problems with this template interfering with formatting. And not being terribly useful besides. We'll have to look into this one. Do you see an example where it is working?--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 13:35, 7 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::I can't find any page where it is '''not''' currently broken - sorry.
 
 
::It's not terribly useful to save the few keystrokes needed to key "Nelson, New Zealand" into the on-line mapping provider of your choice but
 
:#it would enhance the advertising click revenue of Internet Brands to have our relevant article page (with advertising by default) show up on users geocode-enabled smartphones according to their GPS location
 
:#it's '''''very''''' useful to find out of the way places (often in third world countries) where names are often incompletely found or differently spelt on maps. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 17:01, 7 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
==ISBN book references are also broken==
 
As can be seen if you click on any of the ISBN numbers (in blue) in this section: http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Philippines&oldid=1951302#Books
 
 
You are taken to the special page but, although the search box is correctly pre-populated the "Go" search button no longer works. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 16:26, 7 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
:Hmm. I'll queue it; no guarantees on timing as this is the first I've seen of this functionality.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:00, 7 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
::Appears to be working as designed. It's generating the AMAZON and B&N, etc. links at the bottom of the page. The input box is just to refresh the page and generate those links. Let me know if you have info to the contrary.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:12, 7 November 2012 (EST)
 
 
==Clarification==
 
Because of the recent [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk:Pratyeka&diff=prev&oldid=1949763 misunderstanding] of our policies by a long-standing Wikipedia admin, I have clarified and re-emphasised [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Wikitravel%3AExternal_links&action=historysubmit&diff=1950083&oldid=1896765 our specific policies on linking to (or promoting) other travel sites that use wiki editing software here]. I doubt that many will read it in advance, but at least the clarified policy is now there to be quoted in explanation after a redaction or deletion. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 00:36, 4 November 2012 (EDT)
 
 
'''UPDATE''': My clarifications have now been deleted (twice).
 
  
So we are now back to the hypocrytical situation of having one policy actively enforced and promulgated (at least by some IBadmins) without ever having that policy enunciated on any policy page that I am aware of. I think I'll change my user name to ''George Orwell''. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 18:48, 5 November 2012 (EST)
+
== Headings ==
  
:1. WT editors are not to make changes to policies unilaterally. That is why the changes were reverted (at the request of another non-IB editor). 2. The policy in question doesn't really need a change. It's being interpreted internally in a way that it hasn't been interpreted before, due to a situation that has not arisen before. And it's almost entirely in the past. Thus there is no reason to amend policy, both because as it stands it is being applied consistently, and because the situation requiring that interpretation was unique and has now passed. It's time to move forward.--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 19:06, 5 November 2012 (EST)
+
I am brand new to Wiki and created ny page, then somehow my headings lost their se parathion a and all but the first too be ame on line!  I tried pasting in headings from a different site but nothing works!. They are all in a block! I have also lost the Add Listing button?  [[User:Arlingham|Arlingham]] ([[User talk:Arlingham|talk]]) 19:02, 9 January 2017 (EST)
  
::1) I don't think you can have it both ways. Either you genuinely do not think '''We do not allow (and will attempt to strenuously police and expunge) external links to, or promotion of, ''travel'' websites that are not primary sources - this policy ''includes other wikis'', whether Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 licensed or not''' has been our policy for a long time or <s>I'm a Dutchman</s> the policy in question has always existed and doesn't really need a change. Instead it's being interpreted internally in a way that it hasn't been interpreted before, due to a situation that has not arisen before. That interpretation needs to be made explicit and prominent to avoid edit wars.
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:Hello and welcome to Wikitravel!  I currently don't see anything on your userpage. Could you provide more details as to what specific page you are trying to edit? [[User:Tyen|Tyen]] ([[User talk:Tyen|talk]]) 19:05, 9 January 2017 (EST)
::2) I do think it completely Orwellian and counter productive not to explicitly warn people that they should not include links to or use the ''naughty names'' of other travel wikis in text - particularly those that have recently started operating from Wikimedia servers. Since I am not an admin I really do need an explicit policy to link to in a terse but precise and authoritative way when I excise ''naughty names or links'' if the (often ''bona fide'' but ignorant-of-our-policy-that-can-not-speak-its-name) editor is not to be left puzzled, frustrated and annoyed by my (to him, incomprehensible) edits. An example of this is where an article discussion section dating back to July 2006 was removed to the [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk%3AIBAlex&action=historysubmit&diff=1951308&oldid=1950874 genuine puzzlement of an IP contributor]. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 16:51, 7 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
On a related but different topic, I really find it objectionable that no official announcements are being made about new admin appointments.
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M page is Arly but I don't think I have puny it yet I somehow lost all the indentation and had to change the headings to make sense but need to format but can't wo ou what to do?I am having trouble replying as I am using an iPhone and can't see what I am writing!  Y page title is Arlingham! [[User:Arlingham|Arlingham]] ([[User talk:Arlingham|talk]]) 19:24, 9 January 2017 (EST)
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:'''[[Arlingham]]''' I fixed it for you. Some of the headings are still non-standard but they are correctly formatted. Thanks for your additions--I know that typing on those things is a real bear. [[User:Koavf|Koavf]] ([[User talk:Koavf|talk]]) 19:48, 9 January 2017 (EST)
  
It is bad enough that folks are [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk%3AIBMaarten&action=historysubmit&diff=1954335&oldid=1954333 arbitrarily being made an admin on the English language version of Wikitravel, without the usual experience+nomination+discussion process but secret appointments] are really not my idea of "moving on".
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Hello. I'm new to editing Wikitravel. I added a new city, McHenry, Illinois, but now see that there's a empty link under the Chicagoland tab for there. I don't know how to move my page to there.[[User:Damelon|Damelon]] ([[User talk:Damelon|talk]]) 09:07, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
  
If this character is '''not''' an admin, I really deprecate that this [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Special%3AActiveUsers&limit=50&username=IB naming loophole] has not been plugged weeks ago as I suggested! --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 16:11, 15 November 2012 (EST)
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:Hi, I have changed your article name, so you can now find it under [[McHenry (Illinois)]]. Happy editing! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 10:31, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
  
:Unfortunately there's no way I know of to prevent that yet. But since we watch all new user creation, we'll catch it if it happens. Sometimes users are appointed internally as admins. No biggie. I was such a user, and look how great I've turned out :) --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 16:21, 15 November 2012 (EST)
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== Business Listings: How Much is too Much? ==
  
::Has [[User_talk:IBMaarten|IBMaarten]] arbitrarily been made an admin, on the English language version of Wikitravel, without the usual experience + nomination + discussion process but as a secret appointment?? Yes or No, please. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 16:35, 15 November 2012 (EST)
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Earlier today, a bus company that operates New Zealand's largest passenger transport network with daily services from Auckland to many towns and cities in the Waikato region made an account, and proceeded to add their listing to a WHOLE BUNCH of pages, which looked like spam from my end. Should we allow companies to add their listings to more than a certain number of pages? Yes? No? If we do, what could be the ramifications? What could potential questions, comments, and or snide remarks could arise?  -- <small>—The [[Project:Using_talk_pages#Talk_page_formatting|preceding]] comment was added by [[User: Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User_talk: Tonikar|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Tonikar|contribs]]) </small>
  
:::I thought I explained it? And the edit that made him an admin was clear: he's administering the Dutch site, and also working on EN. There's nothing secret, Frank. Rejoice: and welcome the new admin!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 16:50, 15 November 2012 (EST)
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: Good question. But I think their listing should only be added to the city where their headquarters is located (and maybe to small cities and towns where they are the only choice to get into). Just imagine if we allow this bus operator to add all its lines to Wikitravel articles, we will soon see chain restaurants, hotels, and other business add listings to all places where they operate (actually, we've seen quite a few cases like this before), which will soon turn Wikitravel to a yellow page. Plus our policy about [[Wikitravel:Don't tout#Don't list the same place many times|touting]] is pretty clear about this: ''...businesses should be listed in only one article for the town or district in which the business operates... ''. --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 04:21, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
::::No, we have still not had any announcement from you, any other IBadmin or a properly appointed admin, never mind on the proper pages and you have still not answered with a "Yes".  
 
::::Neither was his admin status on the English language version of Wikitravel showing at: http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Special%3AActiveUsers&limit=50&username=IB at the time I posed the question above and at the time I make this edit.(I've taken a screenshot which I can post if you doubt my veracity).
 
:::::We're not mind readers, you know and you really are abusing all of our policies and processes now. As for there being nothing secret, that really is a lie as Alice makes clear above.  
 
:::::Would you now make clear (with a properly formatted diff) what exactly  was "the edit that made him an admin", please?
 
:::::And for the avoidance of doubt, I personally have no objection in principle to admins from other language versions being rapidly promoted to admin status on the EN Wikitravel. But there should be a clear announcement on the proper page(s) each time this happens and you urgently need to revise all those policy pages that you currently keep flouting. To do anything less is to destroy any chance of re-building the community that has been decimated by your autocratic and thoroughly whimsical decisions, never mind poisoning the wholehearted welcome that would otherwise be given to new (and sorely needed) wielders of the mop. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 18:30, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
::::::I believe you can view [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Special%3ALog&type=rights&user=&page=&year=&month=-1&tagfilter=&hide_patrol_log=1 this page?] Sorry you're unhappy Frank. We're promoting anyone who gets the required community support in the required time period, and shows the best qualities to help the community move forward. Thank you, --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] [[User talk:IBobi|talk]] [[Special:EmailUser/IBobi|email]] 18:46, 15 November 2012 (EST)
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::I agree with Binbin, we'd better stick to our [[Wikitravel:Don't tout#Don't list the same place many times|touting]] policy. The risk of having chains adding their listings everywhere is too high (and we're not the Yellow Pages, aren't we?). [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:24, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
  
:::::::That User rights log is not a page that can be added to anyone's watchlist and neither do I know of a way to find out what pages internally link to it. Do you seriously expect editors to load that page every few hours to find out what admin has been appointed on the English language version of Wikitravel most recently?
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:::If you are in New Zealand without a car, it is likely that you will use Intercity to get around. I think that there is only one other operator (Naked Bus) with a smaller national network and some regional operators (Atomic etc) and for a few destinations trains. So I think that it is fine to mention them in the get in section. However we don't need the full details about WiFi etc in every article. I would prefer that some information was added about the services to a particular destination - e.g. "X has two coaches per day from Auckland via Hamilton and one from Wellington via Napier. Coaches stop outside the post office." [[User:AlasdairW|AlasdairW]] ([[User talk:AlasdairW|talk]]) 10:55, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
:::::::I note that you have still not dealt with the most pressing point: '''Explicit Clarification in writing''', on the English language version of Wikitravel, in the obvious places of the new policies and, if they are of only a temporary nature, their expected date of expiry. --[[User:W. Frank|W.&nbsp;'''Frank''']]<sup>[[Special:EmailUser/W. Frank|<font color="green">e-mail</font>]]</sup><sub>[[User talk:W. Frank|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sub> 18:59, 15 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
==Is "formatting according to our [[MoS]]" edit warring?==
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::::AlasdairW, and Binbin bring up good points. This could be a slippery slope, but on this one occasion since they are one of the few transportation services listed on our site in some areas it seems relevant and helpful. Would it be okay if they specified amenities for travelers per each location? [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 9:27, 17 March 2017 (PST)
Perhaps appropriately, given its subject matter, [[Wikitravel talk:Edit war|this policy page]] has been constructed by individual editors plunging forward and writing stuff that seemed blindingly obvious to them.
 
  
Rather refreshingly, a brand new IBadmin [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=User_talk%3ASingapore.Alice&action=historysubmit&diff=1956425&oldid=1956420 has queried] whether making persistent changes to article formatting is "''something that needs to be '''discussed first within the community'''. I'm referring to this [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Wikitravel%3AEdit_war&action=historysubmit&diff=1956416&oldid=1516343] change.''"
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:::::I agree that we should stick with our policy, have the business listed once, probably best the country article, and there list some specific amenities if that adds value. In our [[Wikitravel:External links|external links]] policy it says clearly what not to list to, so if we make an exception for one business, soon more will follow. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 12:40, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
  
Does anybody else think that (for example) when more knowledgeable editors continuously and relentlessly change formatting that does not conform to our [[Manual of Style]] (without good reason) - such as changing "150 Pesos" to the more correct "₱150" - this is edit warring?
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::::::Would it be good to review our policy, and add an addendum for the amount of posts that a company has added/ can add? Also, should we be reviewing these on a case by case basis; especially if we think it could be helpful for the traveler? Like AlasdairW, had said that it is likely you will come across this company's transportation system in NZ if travelling without a car...  [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 1:42, 17 March 2017 (PST)
  
Who else thinks that in cases of controversy, the style manual should '''not''' trump? --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 15:05, 19 November 2012 (EST)
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I'm torn on this one too. First, I love Alasdair's point that a business should take the time, if they are going to try this, to make EACH listing specifically relevant to that page. If they don't want to take the time to point out the relevancy of their business to that particular destination (and they ought to be encouraged by us to do so), they should not have the privilege of being listed here.  
  
:Edit warring is edit warring, regardless of whether one of the parties is "right" and the other party is "wrong".
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Second, I am at a loss to find something wrong with listing a business on multiple pages, if those pages do not contain any (or a very small number) similar options. In this case, if you are considering traveling to a small town in NZ that is only served by this bus company, we ought to provide details as to how to catch a bus into/out of there if we have them. What is the harm? Now, if this is, say, New York City, where there are interminable bus and other transportation options for getting in and out, I would say that allowing companies to list all of them would be disastrous for Wikitravel, and of limited to zero use for the traveler. And don't even get me started on chain restaurants!
  
:If two people are changing the article formatting back and forth, the correct thing to do is to follow the procedure discussed in [[Wikitravel:Edit war]].  [[User:JYolkowski|JYolkowski]] 22:11, 21 November 2012 (EST)
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So perhaps there is a middle ground? Where there are many existing options, disallow the listing; where there are none or very few, allow them; and when allowed, the listing must be customized to that destination. And when we see a company engaging in this behavior, we ought to make contact with them as soon as possible, guide them, and have them provide a proposed list of everywhere they are intending to add their listing, as well as the specifics of how they will customize their listing to the page, BEFORE they spam it out everywhere publicly. How's that sound? [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 19:29, 22 March 2017 (EDT)
::Replied to you at [[Wikitravel_talk:Edit_war]] since I'm rather baffled by your imputed suggestion that we should scrap at least one of our five [[Wikitravel:Policies_and_guidelines#General_policy| foundation policies]] that: "Text and images should follow style guidelines. With rare exception, text and images should follow our Manual of style. Exceptions should gain wide consensus; in cases of controversy, the style manual trumps."  --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 22:47, 21 November 2012 (EST)
 
::The quote you included contains the words "With rare exception."  That's why you need to discuss with the other party instead of edit warring with them to see whether it makes sense for this to be such an exception.  Cheers, [[User:JYolkowski|JYolkowski]] 19:06, 23 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
==[[Wikitravel:Requested articles]]==
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: I agree. In principle, listing on multiple pages is not allowed , except where similar choices are limited and/or there're none or only a few similar listings (we do have this "something is better than nothing" policy). Yes, a prior communication with the companies who want to put their listings on multiple page sounds even better so that on one hand they can do it properly with our help, on the other we can kind of make sure things don't go out of control. I think we can start with this bus operator in NZ. What do you guys think?   --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 01:40, 23 March 2017 (EDT)
I boldly started [[Wikitravel:Requested articles]] for listing links to articles that would be useful, but do not yet exist. Would it be useful for the development of Wikitravel? /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 13:14, 22 November 2012 (EST)
 
:Why not? --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 14:27, 22 November 2012 (EST)
 
  
=="add listing" defect==
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==Watchlist==
[http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Wikitravel:Accommodation_listings&diff=next&oldid=1251767#Listing_order For a long while] we have had a policy of [[listing]]s being [[alphabet]]ically ordered unless there is a good reason not to.
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Hello, for a month or so i've been pressing the star shaped sign in pages i liked, and now i can find how to access them. how can i see it? (Asked by Nir6668 at 21:47, 1 April 2017).
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:The star shaped sign (next to View History near the top right of the page) adds an article to your watchlist. You can see this by clicking on the link "Watchlist" at the top right of the page (when you are logged in). This will display a list of any of the pages in your watchlist which have been edited in the past few days - the number of days can be changed on the watchlist tab of Preferences. You can also set things so that every page that you edit is automatically added to your watchlist, and you can choose to get an email when a page on your watchlist is changed. [[User:AlasdairW|AlasdairW]] ([[User talk:AlasdairW|talk]]) 19:12, 1 April 2017 (EDT)
  
Unfortunately this is consistently and automatically buggered by the "add listing" option that appears in blue to the right of our standard section headings of "See", "Do", "Buy", "Eat", "Drink" and "Sleep" that always adds the new listing to the bottom of that particular section.
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==Tours listing==
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how can i  list my tours business[[User:Eastland adventures|Eastland adventures]] ([[User talk:Eastland adventures|talk]]) 10:37, 4 April 2017 (EDT)
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: Hey Eastland Adventures! You can list your tour business on the destination pages of the locations you service: consider viewing our rules on where to post in on either our [[Wikitravel:Activity listings]] or the [[Wikitravel:Where you can stick it]] page. Also, be sure to acknowledge our [[Wikitravel:Don't tout]] policy as well. [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 010:13, 5 April 2017 (PST)
  
Is it time to change the listing order policy or recode the robot so that it understands alphabetic order? --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 16:34, 24 November 2012 (EST)
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::Hi, I have noticed that in Pune, heritage walk has been listed, even though it is also a walking tour, the policy should be uniformly applied on all, having said that I am not asking to turn down their listing. I appreciate the policy but it must modify with time, considering the practicality, wikitravel should understand that it is a self-guided tour platform and walking tours are guided tour platform, both are different and guided tours does not conflict with wikitravel because taking a walking tour does not restrict or encourage a person from using wikitravel any less, rather if a person explores a place on a walking tour that he has earlier seen listed on wikitravel, it provides him a reassurance of the quality and depth of wikitravel guides.Even lonely planet lists walking tours and so are all the other travel guide providers, it is a shame that with a fear of competition (which is actually not in reality) a portal like wiki travel is not passing on all the relevant information to the travelers about what and how to explore the city. For europe, walking tours have become very popular and so it is understandable that listing too many of such tours can actually confuse the travelers as to which one to use, but for developing nations like India, where the Indian people don't even know what are walking tours, listing the same would mean that a great deal to help travelers. A venture that i experienced recently called as Yo Tours is providing such great walking tours in india, which is highly appreciated by travelers and i tried to list those for different cities but the same has been removed. I believe case to assessment is necessary which even the tour listing policy suggests, it never says not to list walking tours. I would appreciate if i can get a solution for the same. <small>—The [[Project:Using_talk_pages#Talk_page_formatting|preceding]] comment was added by [[User: Ava2011|Ava2011]] ([[User_talk: Ava2011|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Ava2011|contribs]]) </small>
  
==[[Colombia]]n pesos==
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:::Hello, thank you for your input. As you can see in our policies, in general we don´t allow walking tours in our articles, see [[Wikitravel:Activity_listings|activity listings]]. When we check the latest edits and we see something that would be against those policies, we would remove it. It is correct that it could happen that other listings were previously added and gone unnoticed, but in general we do try to have a look at the existing listings as well to see what has slipped through overtime. But this is up to everyone who contributes to Wikitravel. If you still feel your tour would add value and needs to be included, then it should be discussed on the talk page of the article itself, see what feedback you get from other users. I hope this helps! Looking forward to further edits from you. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 11:10, 1 June 2017 (EDT)
There are many countries around the world that use the name "dollar" and the symbol "$" for their currency. Our [[$|usual policy]] is that<br />
 
''Prices should be listed with the currency symbol that travellers will encounter, specifically the local formatting. The currency symbol should always be prefixed. Travellers should be able to assume that symbols used for multiple currencies (like $ or £) apply to the local currency. Do ''not'' use currency codes like "USD", "EUR", or "GBP" if the symbol is established.
 
  
* $100 in [[Detroit]], not US$100, 100 USD or 100 dollars
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== Help ==
* $100 in [[Vancouver]], not CAD$100, 100 CAD or 100 dollars
 
* $100 in [[Wellington]], not NZD$100, 100 NZD or 100 dollars
 
* $100 in [[Canberra]], not AUD$100, 100 AUD or 100 dollars''<br />
 
  
and I propose no change in respect of this.
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Hi! I tried to post a message at the Romanian Travellers' pub. Apparently, that page is protected from any edit. I also tried to talk to user {{user|Vlad}} who is an active administrator there. But it seems he had protected his own talk page from any edit. Is that normal to protect such pages and be unable to contact anyone there? Thank you, [[User:Wintereu|Wintereu]] ([[User talk:Wintereu|talk]]) 08:30, 9 April 2017 (EDT)
  
However, the currency of Colombia poses special dangers of inconsistency and confusion as exemplified in our [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Cartagena_%28Colombia%29&action=historysubmit&diff=1959307&oldid=1957758 Cartagena (Colombia)] article.
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:Hello, thank you for your message. I don´t have an account on the Romanian site, but looking at it it has been inactive for quite some time (the travellers pub). I will check with corporate and see what the reason was for the protection of the page. Thanks for bringing this up. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 16:01, 9 April 2017 (EDT)
  
Colombia is unusual in having an officially recognised currency symbol of "$" that (unlike Singapore, etc) is '''not''' actually used on their banknotes - where, instead, "pesos" is printed. Since prices in the tourist industry in Colombia are also often quoted in US$, <u>I propose that we use "'''pesos'''" instead of either the $ symbol or COP for Colombia currency.</u>
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:: As far as I can see, the Romanian Wikitravel appear to have been ''frozen in time'' ... [[User:Wintereu|Wintereu]] ([[User talk:Wintereu|talk]]) 13:32, 10 April 2017 (EDT)
  
This is somewhat analogous to the "Baht or ฿" situation adjudicated at [[Wikitravel_talk:Currency]] but differs in that I propose using the plural "'''pesos'''" rather than "peso" since
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::: Yep. As for my talk page, some time ago wikitravel was a target for SPAM bots, and that included my talk page. All I did was this: 23 noiembrie 2008 20:13‎ Vlad (Discuție | contribuții | blochează)‎ m . . (14.577 de octeți) (0)‎ . . (A protejat "Discuţie Utilizator:Vlad" [edit=autoconfirmed:move=sysop]) (anulare):  only autoconfirmed users may edit the talk page (and of course only admin can move it), but I admit that I haven't the slightest idea what autoconfirmed users mean in wikitravel's context. --[[User:Vlad|Vlad]] ([[User talk:Vlad|talk]]) 14:06, 10 April 2017 (EDT)
#the peso is so minute as to be almost never encountered in the singular
 
#that is the word (in Spanish) that appears on Colombian Banknotes: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colombian_peso
 
  
Does anyone disagree with my proposal?  
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:::: Hello Wintereu! Thank you for reaching out! [http://wikitravel.org/ro/Special:Pagini_protejate Here] is a list of protected pages on RU WT. As mentioned by Vlad above, the main reason behind protecting pages (or sometimes the entire site) is to avoid spam attacks for those versions of Wikitravel that don't have many active admins. Sometimes the spam attacks are so "forceful" and sneaky that don't get catch by our spam filters. Therefore, in a good faith to protect what has been already created we sometimes protect the pages.
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:::: Are you planning to work actively on RU WT? If yes, I would be happy to lift the protection for RU pages. Hopefully, the spammers let go as well in a meantime. Cheers, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] ([[User talk:IBAlex|talk]]) 03:54, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
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::::: Wintereu, I just read a discussion on your Talk Page and realized you're not willing to work on RU. You made fair points. If you change your mind, however, please let me know:) Have a great day, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] ([[User talk:IBAlex|talk]]) 04:02, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
  
Discuss at [[Wikitravel_talk:Currency#Colombian_pesos]] rather than here, please! --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 15:21, 26 November 2012 (EST)
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Hi {{user|IBAlex}}. I just tried to (re)fix the number of days and edits to be shown within the ''recent changes'' page at RO WT (from the ''Preferences'' --> ''Recent changes''). It must be a soft problem, because I simply can't change the values there (the max days suggested there and 1000 edits to show by default). And that's only one from many issues I noticed here. Also, it seems I can't be connected on both the EN WT and RO WT at the same time... Thank you for replying and reading the discussion from my talk page. There isn't much more to say. Since the e-mail option doesn't seem to work either, if you (or any one else) feel like sending me any more message or comment, you'll find me on "''copycats''" projects under the very same user name. Happy Easter ;) [[User:Wintereu|Wintereu]] ([[User talk:Wintereu|talk]]) 13:34, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
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: One more thing. Can you imagine I had to log in several times just to write the message above?! [[User:Wintereu|Wintereu]] ([[User talk:Wintereu|talk]]) 13:37, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
  
:Nobody has raised any objections so I will now make the necessary policy change. --<sub>singapore</sub>[[User_talk:Singapore.Alice|<b><font color="#0000DD">A</font><font color="#0066FF">l</font><font color="#0099FF">i</font><font color="#00CCFF">c</font><font color="#00EEFF">e</font></b>]] 18:44, 30 November 2012 (EST)
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==Deletion and Login/Funky Stuff==
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Hey everyone! So lately there have been some issues with login-- Wikitravel has been logging people out frivolously, and deleted pages are still showing up in Recent Changes. We are currently working to resolve these issues. If there are any other problems or bugs you find please let us know on here or through email! Thanks! [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 3:10, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
  
  
== Las Vegas ==
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Bangkok/Thonburi will not load on my browser.
  
First of all, I want to apologize if this is the wrong place to post this, but right now I am so frustrated that my head is spinning.
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[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 04:05, 19 April 2017 (EDT)
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The "Understand.Get In.Get Around etc" banner from the top of the page on places where there is a pic at the top, has fallen to the bottom of the article (at least in Thailand)
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[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 04:19, 19 April 2017 (EDT)
  
When I was originally planning our family vacation to Las Vegas I used the WikiTravel website as a source of research for shows, attractions and places to stay. As a first time visitor to Las Vegas, the website seemed to be a prime resource providing a lot of useful information.
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== Issue ==
  
We have since returned to Las Vegas several times and I absolutely love this destination and am planning to return many more times.
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Hi, On my talkpage when I remove the "If you feel that I have reverted" box as well as try to archive the page I keep getting "This action has been automatically identified as harmful, and therefore disallowed. If you believe your action was constructive, please inform an administrator of what you were trying to do. A brief description of the abuse rule which your action matched is: TS Page Title Block",<br />
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Not being familiar with the site as such I have no idea who to ask or where to find any admins,<br />
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Thanks, [[User:Davey2010|Davey2010]] ([[User talk:Davey2010|talk]]) 16:20, 20 April 2017 (EDT)
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:Probably running into a vandalism protection filter. Just write on Tonikar's page and she can help you with that. [[User:IBobi|IBobi]] ([[User talk:IBobi|talk]]) 18:50, 20 April 2017 (EDT)
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::Hi [[User:IBobi|IBobi]], Not sure why tho as I've never had the issue before ?, Forgot to mention but I'm constantly being logged out aswell which I assumed was a site issue, Anyway I'll ask them thanks for your help much appreciated. [[User:Davey2010|Davey2010]] ([[User talk:Davey2010|talk]]) 18:57, 20 April 2017 (EDT)
  
In anticipation of my return to Sin City in a few months I was going through my Vegas bookmarks and I noticed the Wikitravel entry. I remembered reading a few of the entertainment/shows entries and I realized that a few things didn't jive with what I had experienced in real life.
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== Removal question ==
  
When I went back to the website to confirm my suspicions - Sure enough, there they were!
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Hi, If for instance a hotel is closed down do we remove the listing or do we put something like "this has since closed down" ?,  Not sure if we preserve the history or not, Thanks, [[User:Davey2010|Davey2010]] ([[User talk:Davey2010|talk]]) 22:49, 21 April 2017 (EDT)
Numerous inaccuries, for example:  
 
  
Blue Man Group at the Venetian (they have since moved their show to the Monte Carlo)
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:Hi, thanks for your question. Yes, you can just remove the info (after verifying) and just leave a comment in the summary field when you publish. You can add/edit any info, as long as it is clear to all why something was removed. Happy editing! [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 06:08, 22 April 2017 (EDT)
Bette Midler at Caesars Palace (her residency ended Jan. 2010)
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::Hi [[User:Adzas|Adzas]], Okie dokie thanks very much - I didn't want to remove incase we preserve that was all, Anyway thanks for your much much appreciated :), Happy editing, [[User:Davey2010|Davey2010]] ([[User talk:Davey2010|talk]]) 10:17, 22 April 2017 (EDT)
Lance Burton at the Monte Carlo (his residency ended in Sept. 2010)
 
Fab Four Live at the V Theater in Planet Hollywood (the correct title of the show is Beatleshow!)
 
Viva Elvis at the Aria (closed in August)
 
Human Nature at the Imperial Palace (ended their residency in November, and the Imperial Palace is now know as the Quad)
 
  
nowhere did it mention the residencies of:
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== Cleanup! ==
Elton at Caesars Palace (his residency has since ended but was current at the time)
 
Shania Twain at Caesars Palace
 
Celine Dion at Caesars Palace
 
Rod Stewart at Caesars Palace
 
Tim McGraw and Faith Hill at the Venetian
 
these are the most glaring ommissions
 
  
in addition:
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I do believe that I have read "please remove the clutter.................."
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Wikitravel has more than 20 articles going back a loooooooooooooooooooooooooooong time!
  
Comedy Shows had only 2 listings (2 listings?!?!? I couldn't believe this! Carrot Top and Sin City Comedy (the venue has since changed) are the only 2 comedy shows in ALL of Las Vegas???)
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When I write here, I remove the article afterwards after a "reasonable" time!
not listed were: Brad Garrett's Comedy Club, Louie Anderson, George Wallace, Big Al's Comedy Club, The Improv at Harrah's, Wolf's Comedy Den, Riviera Comedy Club etc. etc.
 
  
Tribute Shows did not list:
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So will someone in authority please move this old stuff to where it belongs?
Frank Marino's Divas Las Vegas, MJ Live, Legends in Concert, Purple Reign: A Tribute to Prince, Dancing Queen, The Australian Bee Gees, Trent Carlini's the King, The Rat Pack is Back (there are currently over 4 Frank Sinatra and/or Rat Pack shows playing) etc. etc.
 
  
Magic Shows did not list:
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I would do it myself, but at 74 years of age, I do not know where to put it all.
Jan Rouven, Mike Hammer, Nathan Burton, Seth Grabel, The Amazing Jonathon etc. etc.
 
  
Impressionist/impersonation shows did not list:
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[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 07:02, 27 April 2017 (EDT)
Gordie Brown and veteran impersonator Rich Little!
 
  
You get the picture! The number of ommissions and innaccuracies was-and-is mind-boggling!
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:Hi Avemario, thank you for pointing this out. But can you be more specific on which articles you are talking about? You are always welcome to drop me an email (you know my email address). Thank you! --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 09:55, 27 April 2017 (EDT)
Considering that Wikitravel's Main Page proclaims that it is a "complete, up-to-date and reliable worldwide travel guide" this is unfathomable!
 
  
At this point I decided to take it upon myself and sign up as a Wikitravel editor with the intention of becoming a "Las Vegas entertainment editor" of sorts and doing a thorough update of the "See" section (that's kind of funny actually).
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== Cleanup! ==
  
Anyway ...
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Hi!!
  
I spent over a week researching and documenting the current shows as well as the concerts and special events (I'll get to this in a moment) ... and this is no mean feat ...
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Is someone going to do something about "sweeping the Pub" at all?
To verify information required me to consult the venue's website, the performer's website, the authorized ticket agent's website and in some cases some entertainment revue sites. (I subscribe to dozens of Las Vegas tourism and entertainment guides and websites.)
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I did mention it in the above article.
  
Once I had compiled all the information, I went about adding the new entries to the appropriate categories and correcting any inaccuracies.
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[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 03:24, 5 May 2017 (EDT)
  
Once I was finished editing all the regular Las Vegas shows, I decided to tackle the concert listings knowing that this would be a very "hands on" endeavour requiring me to make edits on almost a daily basis.
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: Hi Avemario, thank you for raising this again. You are right, the Pub contains too many topics now, I agree that it should be archived. Maybe to [[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub archives|here]]?    --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 05:41, 6 May 2017 (EDT)
  
I created a sub-heading titled "Concerts/Special Events" with 2 sub-headings under that titled "1 Night Only" and "Limited Engagement". I then started to populate the lists in chronological order based on all the information I had.  
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: Just archived all topics raised in 2016 [[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/2016|here]]. And our Wikitravellers' pub archive page is [[Wikitravel:Travellers' pub/Archives|here]].       --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 09:20, 15 May 2017 (EDT)
  
Halfway through listing the events for December I see a notice at the top of my screen saying that "there was a conflict with some of my listings etc. etc". Upon checking my User talk page I see a message that says this:
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== Map based wikitravel ==
"I had to delete your contribution on Las Vegas page because we do not post one time events/ attractions in destination articles. Best, IBAlex 20:19, 30 November 2012 (EST)"
 
  
I could not believe what I was seeing!
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Hello!
  
To omit "1 night only" or "limited engagement" concerts/special events from a Las Vegas entertainment listings is a travesty! Las Vegas is truly the entertainment capital of the world and to ignore this by not including these listings is doing the reader a huge dis-service. I personally, would book travel based on several of these events alone and I know this to be true for many others. There has to be an exception made for Vegas ... the concerts, shows and special events are what Las Vegas is all about! That in itself is what makes Las Vegas a travel destination! You can't apply standard rules as there is no place on the planet like this!
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I wish to introduce a map based wikitravelish website impressionmap.org
  
This is a partial list of the concerts and special events for the month of December:
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I'm an avid reader and planned all trips based on info here. A big thanks first! However, articles are organized by meaningless place names (it's the only choice though), and it's not straightforward to figure out which place is where. Thus, planning bigger trips involves going back and forth between here and Google Maps, taking a long time.
Aerosmith & Cheap Trick, ZZ Top, Megadeth, The Eagles, Red Hot Chili Peppers, The Black Keys, Pitbull, The Killers, The O'Jays, Jerry Seinfeld, the Wayans Brothers, The Eagles, Jeff Dunham, UFC 155, The Ultimate Fighter Finale, The National Rodeo Finals, American Country Awards, Three Dog Night, Restless Heart, Mannheim Steamroller, Trans-Siberian Orchestra, Train, Ron White, Bill Engvall, Dennis Miller & Bill O'Reilly, Journey & Loverboy, Merle Haggard, Lonestar, Manny Pacquiao vs Juan Manuel Márquez, Charlie Daniels Band, The Oak Ridge Boys, Randy Travis, LeAnn Rimes, 3 Doors Down & Daughtry, Moody Blues, Tanya Tucker, Travis Tritt, The Tragically Hip, Trace Adkins, Social Distortion, Dave Koz and many many more.
 
  
So now, in addition to all the concert/special event listings being deleted, so are all my show updates and inclusions. All of my work is now GONE! Wiped out in one fell swoop by an all-knowing, all-mighty admin. Hours and hours of work down the toilet!
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It may be better to organize info by map itself and attach it to the map as snippets which will appear or disappear based on zoom level. More info and links can be added as popups. So I made the aforementioned website. You can zoom in to Amherst, MA or NYC (worse option as not much info is added) to see how it works. By the way, the website doesn't seem to work on IE and renders a bit ugly on browsers released before March 2017
  
So, as of right now according to the Las Vegas WikiTravel page: Bette Midler, Lance Burton and Viva Elvis are still performing, while Shania Twain, Rod Stewart, Tim McGraw & Faith Hill and Celine Dion are not. Carrot Top and Sin City Comedy are the only 2 comedy shows in town. Dozens and dozens of shows and venues do not exist and there are no concerts playing in town at all whatsoever.
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Asking for advice and opinions! If you would, edit it as well!
  
It's a shame.
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Hopefully this is the right place to do such introduction. No bad intention, just wish to make travel info presentation more intuitive and trip planning easier
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[[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] ([[User talk:Wkenmomo|talk]]) 14:16, 1 June 2017 (EDT)
  
: I restored your edits; IMHO the deletion was bad judgement by an inexperienced admin. On the other hand, she had a point; WT is a travel guide; some of your listings may be too short-term to bother with and should be deleted as unmaintainable. Dicussion should go on the article's talk page.  [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 20:03, 1 December 2012 (EST)
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: Sorry for such a late response! We appreciate your time spent on Wikitravel -- especially for adding edits to the Liaocheng page. We hope to see more thoughtful edits like the ones you have provided. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 01:50, 06 June 2017 (PST)
  
I have committed myself to maintaining the short term edits. By tomorrow morning the concert listings dated December 1 will have been deleted. And so on and so on. I can appreciate how short-term listings might be termed "unmaintainable" by conventional thinking ... but ... Las Vegas is far from being a "conventional" travel destination. Thank you  [[User:Briank58|Briank58]] 20:17, 1 December 2012 (EST)
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:: Hey [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]]! I finally got a chance to check out the website you had created, and I think its pretty cool! I like that it sums up exactly where I may want to travel if I want to shop, or find out more about American history! I was wondering -- and you kind of explained already-- but your purpose for creating a map that works as so? How would this help benefit Wikitravel users? Thanks! --[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 012:39, 07 June 2017 (PST)
  
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::: Hey [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]], sorry for the late reply. Why I create it is that I want a more direct way of accessing geo info. I used to read here, search on Google Map, write what it is about and save it in my maps to compare with others. A great hassle and Google maps aren't designed for this. My purpose is to make designing "optimized" trips easier and I really hope to plan my next trip to Canada intuitively and effortlessly. Do wikitravel need a dynamic map? Wikitravel is welcome to host this map and embed it to the right zoom and boundary. The map is itself editable.[[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] ([[User talk:Wkenmomo|talk]]) 13:45, 10 June 2017 (EDT)
  
:Briank58- thank you for your notice. I would gladly address this problem. I am here to help users and I am open to any suggestions and discussions.  
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::::[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]], [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] I think it would be a great idea to include links to Wikimapia. I'm working on US Hwy 2 between Monroe and Stephens Pass. Here is an example of what you get for [[Skykomish_(Washington)]] [http://wikimapia.org/#lang=en&lat=47.710000&lon=-121.360000&z=13&m=b&search=Skykomish]. We could actually provide links to WikiTravel on the WikiMapia page. Ideas? [[User:Kgrr|Kgrr]] ([[User talk:Kgrr|talk]]) 08:46, 9 July 2017 (EDT)
:Please know that your contribution on Las Vegas page is highly appreciated. I am glad to see that you understand that Wikitravel does not support short-time listings (especially 1 day listings) because it is difficult to maintain them. We do worry that when users post short-time listings on the site, they will not remove them once the listings become outdated. And this clearly is not beneficial for the site and the users... In this way, the site risks of becoming eventually cluttered with those outdated listings. That is why I removed your listings, leaving a message on your Talk Page to let you know that I did not mean anything bad. I was simply following the conventions.  
 
:However, when I see that you are willing to upkeep the listings and remove some of them on daily basis, I am fine with keeping them there. Again, your contribution is extremely valuable to Las Vegas site, thank you for that. Warm regards, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 13:32, 3 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
== Why are the Orbitz ads appearing on non-logged in users? ==
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== Asian pages: cleanup or not? ==
  
''Disclaimer: I wrote the following without knowing that the feature was supposed to be opt-in''
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Many articles related to south-central Asia have tables collecting country/regional symbols. See some examples [http://wikitravel.org/en/India#Holidays here], [http://wikitravel.org/en/Pakistan#Eat here] and [http://wikitravel.org/en/Tajikistan#Do here]. Does Wikitravel really need it? Is it really important to know the regional flower/plant/animal/tree/etcetera of those regions? There are even flags but apparently [http://wikitravel.org/en/File_talk:Flag_of_Islamic_Republic_of_Hindustan.png some are fake]   We're a travel-related community, the info in those tables would look better in WP. I suggest to remove all of them. Any thoughts? [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 09:26, 26 June 2017 (EDT)
: Case in point: [[Buenos Aires]], [[Hong Kong]], [[Paris]], and many other cities now have Orbitz banners in the header and the 'Get In' and 'Sleep' sections.
 
  
: I understand the need for more funding, but nobody will ever say "Oh, how convenient, now I can buy plane tickets while in the middle of reading a Wikitravel article". On its current state is useless at the best, and obtrusive at its worst.
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:I agree, the tables seem to overtake some of the articles, we are not an encyclopedia, lets stick to travel related information, and flags we usually only put in the country articles. Especially if the flags are not “official” we should remove those. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 05:38, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
  
: Sometimes this is extremely ridiculous: just look at the article on [[Orania]].
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:: Agree. Those tables don't belong here. They take up a lot of space but don't add value to Wikitravel as a world-wide travel guide. I think we should remove all those country/regional symbols.    --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 05:49, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
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:::I agree. Remove them all. They are intrusive, not important for travel, and I suspect they may have been copied from somewhere else (Wikipedia?) without attribution (I may be wrong about that point). I have seen them here before and disliked them, but were hesitant to just delete them - so I'm glad to see others feel the same way. [[User:Nurg|Nurg]] ([[User talk:Nurg|talk]]) 06:00, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
  
For those reasons I think anyway that having it as an opt-out is a terrible idea. [[Special:Contributions/190.189.234.13|190.189.234.13]] 22:57, 1 December 2012 (EST)
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::::So, shall we start deleting those tables? Any other thoughts about this issue? [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 10:14, 4 July 2017 (EDT)
:The announcement is in the section above at [[#Travel booking tool!]]. <font color="#339989">–[[User:Sumone10154|'''<font color="#339989">sumone10154</font>''']]<sup>([[User talk:Sumone10154|<font color="#339989">talk</font>]])</sup></font> 23:41, 1 December 2012 (EST)
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:::::There have been no objections, so anyone can go ahead and delete them. [[User:Nurg|Nurg]] ([[User talk:Nurg|talk]]) 04:59, 10 August 2017 (EDT)
  
::I know. But according to that announcement,
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== can't save preferences ==
:::If you log in to your Wikitravel account, you will need to go to your *preferences* in order to turn on this booking tool -- you will not see it at all unless you turn it on.
 
::These ads are appearing to me as a non-logged-in user, and the only way I found to disable them is
 
to log-in into an account, clearly making it opt-out.
 
::Was that change intentional? In that case it's a horrible decision IMO. [[Special:Contributions/190.189.234.13|190.189.234.13]] 11:37, 2 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
:This was discussed about a year ago and is one of the reasons why it is so quiet here. However ignoring question of whether a booking engine should be there, I find the implementation poor.
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I just tried to change the Internationalisation option in my preferences and change the wiki language to have the sidebar and some buttons shown in my mother language. I pressed "save" bet it's set to "english" anyway. BTW... where are the recent changes gone? can't the the recent edits. Any chance to see it? -- [[User:DerFussi|DerFussi]] ([[User talk:DerFussi|talk]]) 16:50, 9 July 2017 (EDT)
:I tried the booking banner from the [[Aberdeen]] page, trying to find a flight to there from Manchester. The article said that there were direct flights, so that was what I was expecting to be offered, but I was only offered a flight via Amsterdam, requiring an overnight stay and costing $407 return. But at Orbitz's own site, I was offered direct flights on the same dates for $184 return. There is also no easy way of finding out who Orbitz is, or of changing the currency from dollars.  
 
:Trying it on [[Orania]] gave the suggestion of Alexandria, which is a long distance away - the booking engine must know the correct airport for every page that it appears on.
 
:It would be better to have the booking banner on the right hand side, above the adverts. This also gives the possibility of getting local bus and train companies to offer booking. I doubt that I will be looking to book a flight here, but a way of booking the bus from the airport would be useful. [[User:AlasdairW|AlasdairW]] 18:18, 3 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
::Hi Alasdair -- I am looking into why the results are different. I tried the same search and got the same results you did. We're still working the kinks out and hope it can be a very useful tool indeed for our Wikitravelers. Please let me know if you see anything else that is suboptimal. Cheers, --[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] 19:02, 7 December 2012 (EST)
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This was written almost two weeks ago, and no one has answered!
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Will someone who understands the question please provide an answer to the person asking?
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[[User:Avemario|Avemario]] ([[User talk:Avemario|talk]]) 07:24, 19 July 2017 (EDT)
  
==New administrators nomination==
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:Hey [[User:DerFussi|DerFussi]] and [[User:Avemario|Avemario]]! So sorry for the late response! There have also been issues lately when other users have tried to save their ad preferences as well. This may be a related issue.  We are currently looking into this! Thank you for bringing this to our attention! [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 18:59, 20 July 2017 (EDT)
We have a new nomination for the administrator on Wikitravel. Please have a look at [[Wikitravel:Administrator nominations|Administrator nominations]]. Best, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 20:34, 3 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
== Town of Rochester, New York ==
 
  
There is Town of Rochester (Ulster County) [http://www.ulstertourism.info/] in New York State which is different from the larger, more familiar City of Rochester (Monroe County) in New York State. How would I add (name) the Town of Rochester here? The two Rochesters are over a hundred miles apart, not related at all. [[User:Gamweb|gamweb]] 18:10, 8 December 2012 (EST)
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==Welcome==
* Reference: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rochester,_Ulster_County,_New_York] Wikipedia
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Hey all!
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So I was thinking how do you all welcome people to the site?! I usually say something like:  
  
: Hi Gamweb! Thank you for your message. The best way is to create a page for Town of Rochester from the scratch since it doesn't exist here. Please have a look [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Town_of_Rochester&action=edit&redlink=1]. You would need to select the best template and just [[ Wikitravel: Plunge forward| plunge forward]]. Don't worry if you don't know how to fill out all the sections- someone will be along to help with it later! Once the page is created, we would need to create a '''Disambiguation Page''', similar to [[Boston (disambiguation)| this one]] so that nobody will get confused with the destination. Please let me know if there is anything else i can help with. Greetings, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 13:42, 10 December 2012 (EST)
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Hello! [[Wikitravel:Welcome, newcomers|Welcome]] to [[Wikitravel:About|Wikitravel]].
 +
To help get you started contributing, we've created a [[Wikitravel:Tips for new contributors|tips for new contributors]] page, full of helpful links about [[Wikitravel:policies and guidelines|policies and guidelines]] and [[Wikitravel:Manual of style|style]] as well as some important information on [[Wikitravel:copyleft|copyleft]] and basic stuff like [[Wikitravel:How to edit a page|how to edit a page]].
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If you need help, check out [[Wikitravel:Help]], or post a message in the [[Wikitravel:travellers' pub|travellers' pub]]. -- [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]])
  
::There is already a disambiguation page at [[Rochester]]. I would suggest [[Rochester_(Ulster_County)]] might be best, county names are often used when there is more than one place of the same name in a state / country. But it worth asking "what do people say locally?", when buying a bus ticket to the town from the other side of the state, as this may suggest a better name. [[User:AlasdairW|AlasdairW]] 18:47, 10 December 2012 (EST)
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Any suggestions for a better welcome?! [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 20:30, 24 July 2017 (EDT)
  
:::Nice!--[[User:IBobi|IBobi]] 18:49, 10 December 2012 (EST)
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: Hi Tonika, I think your welcome message is perfectly fine. However,I think sometimes a bit of personal touch can be added in the message to make it more interactive.    --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 05:16, 26 July 2017 (EDT)
  
== [[Wikitravel:Requested articles| Requested articles]]==
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:: Hey Binbin! Sounds good, what would you suggest for more of a personal touch?![[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 14:28, 31 July 2017 (EDT)
User Blist has recently created a [[Wikitravel:Requested articles| page]] with a list of requested articles that still don't exist on Wikitravel. Please [[Wikitravel: Plunge_forward| plunge forward]] and help us grow! Looking forward to your contributions! Best, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 18:13, 11 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
== New Page - Kerhonkson ==
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:::I agree with [[User:Binbin|Binbin]], the welcome message is fine like that and the only thing that could be added is something personal. Usually I add the new user's name after the "Hello" and some other words if he/she made some good contributions. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:42, 1 August 2017 (EDT)
  
I just created new page for [[Kerhonkson]], New York. It's been a while since I made a new page. Please look it over to see what's missing. (Auxiliary wikilinks) [[User:Gamweb|gamweb]] 22:48, 12 December 2012 (EST)
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:::::I use the standard welcome messages that we have available, either for personal or business, and add a few personal lines if someone already made edits, if they are good just to thank them, if not following our guidelines I will mention something to point them to the right direction. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 10:45, 2 August 2017 (EDT)
: Great job! Thank you! I needed to change the headline "Go next" to "Get out" because that's still the proper name Wikitravel uses for this section. We would be changing this headline soon throughout all the articles. I'm looking forward to more contributions from you. Thank you again! Cheers! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 15:10, 13 December 2012 (EST)
 
::Sorry about that. I was working in "parallel" with another travel site at the same time (enough said). [[User:Gamweb|gamweb]] 16:04, 13 December 2012 (EST)
 
:::No worries. Thank you! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 16:35, 13 December 2012 (EST)
 
* [[Ellenville]], near Kerhonkson. Give it a look over. I still have to add some photos. [[User:Gamweb|gamweb]] 23:18, 16 December 2012 (EST)
 
: Page looks great! Are there any other destinations you are planning to work at? Best, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 16:39, 17 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
==[[Wikitravel: Usable articles]]==
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::::::Great! Thanks peeps! I've been using the standard welcome and inserting their name seems to make a lot of sense! [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 19:12, 4 August 2017 (EDT)
Here is a list of articles that have been [[Wikitravel:Status rating | rated]] as '''Usable''' and need some attention. Please feel free to [[plunge forward| plunge forward]] and add some information. If you think that some of the articles shouldn't be there, please let us know.  See [[Wikitravel:Article status| this page]] for a description of what qualifies an article for different statuses. Thank you! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 18:32, 17 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
== Some and some ==
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==Best International Graduate Schools: Pros and Cons==
 +
I am going to grad school in the states, but have had a few friends venture out to do their study elsewhere such as Johannesburg, London, etc. What are some schools/places that you all have either attended, or encountered? Any pro's about going across the globe for studies? Cons? Semester programs?[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 18:50, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
  
I already run seahouseswebsite.co.uk for my communityI made half a dozen or so edits to the Wikitravel page about Seahouses but what now appears on-line includes only '''some''' of those edits - in some cases leaving ungrammatical sentences. What did I do wrong?  Should I try again or is there some reason why my edits were edited?
+
:I studied in my home country, but did my internship abroad, and since then have worked in different countriesA great way to learn about another country, the language, see the sights etc. I can´t help you with info about schools abroad, not experienced that myself. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 12:00, 9 August 2017 (EDT)
  
My edits included a reference to the Farne Islands.  No Wikitravel page existed so I've just written one but I'm quite sure it needs proper formatting etc.
+
::Oh cool [[User:Adzas|Adzas]]!!! Where did you do your internship? I'm thinking I would like to venture out for mine.[[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 14:08, 9 August 2017 (EDT)
  
Ideally can someone respond to mike@seahouseswebsite.co.uk?
+
:::I did my internship in Disneyland Paris, just after opening in 1992 (I´m getting old!!). Worked in all the hotels there, great experience. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 11:03, 11 August 2017 (EDT)
[[User:Bonniedougall|Bonniedougall]] 09:47, 18 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
:Dear Bonniedougall! Some of the edits you made had to be deleted because you inserted too many external links on [[Seahouses| one page]] (there were 10 links leading to the same domain). Please read our [[Wikitravel:External links| external links policies]] to get more information. A couple of links on a page is ok but it is not our aim on Wikitravel to fill up the articles with external links. Anyone reading [[Seahouses]] article will see the link even if it's only one. I hope you understand.
+
:::: Definitely should "go across the globe for studies". I've had my education in my home country, but I worked fulltime overseas for a few years immediately after my graduation. It's really the best experience I've had. So, if you have the choice, I think you should really think about going abroad for studies. Good luck!  --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 10:44, 13 August 2017 (EDT)
: I also noticed that you created [[Farne Islands]] page. We already had a page about Farne Islands, please have a [[The Farne Islands|look]]. That is why I need to ask you to merge the information on the page you created with the existing one. We do not duplicate pages on Wikitravel. Thank you! Warm regards, [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 18:22, 18 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
OK Alex, I've had another go which should be more compliant.  And I'm suggesting that the page entitled THE Farne Islands should be scrapped.[[User:Bonniedougall|Bonniedougall]] 06:34, 20 December 2012 (EST)
+
:I'm from China and dong my PhD in the states. It depends on if you are pursuing a master or PhD. For masters, it should be fine anywhere you think of. For PhD, you'd better make sure you get a good advisor and sane graduation requirements (western europe, us, oceania, japan and hong kong are safe bets, avoid mainland China due to language and paper requirements)[[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]] ([[User talk:Wkenmomo|talk]]) 21:24, 13 August 2017 (EDT)
: Bonniedougall- would you mind putting a template on the [[Farne Islands]] page you created? The page would look nicer and more organized. In this way I would be able to delete [[The Farne Islands]]. Thank you! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 11:35, 20 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
== Lindisfarne ==
+
::I studied in my home country but I worked abroad for a while, definitely something I recommend to anyone. Have you considered moving to Europe? There are many great cities you can live in while studying. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:34, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
  
Having mentioned the Holy Island of Lindisfarne on 'my' Seahouses page, and there having been no Holy Island of Lindisfarne page, I have created one - ready for the Lindisfarne folk to develop. So I have left an email with them, at[http://www.holy-island.info/], drawing their attention to the matter.
+
::: Thanks [[User:Wkenmomo|Wkenmomo]], that is super true, and helpful! [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] I actually have. One of my closest friends actually did her Master's degree there about a year ago, and she loved it. So I've been thinking about it! [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 14:27, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
[[User:Bonniedougall|Bonniedougall]] 08:47, 20 December 2012 (EST)
 
  
: There is a Lindisfarne page aleady. I made yours a redirect to that. [[User:Pashley|Pashley]] 08:56, 20 December 2012 (EST)
+
==Warning or No Warning for [[Guam]]==
 +
As the situation develops with the North Korea, we've also got quite a bit of [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Guam&action=history back-and-forth] for the warning box for [[Guam]]. I think it's time we have a discussion here. Warning or no warning? What do you guys think?  --[[User:Binbin|Binbin]] ([[User talk:Binbin|talk]]) 10:49, 13 August 2017 (EDT)
  
==Improvement Ideas==
+
:Guam government issued some emergency guidelines in case of nuclear attack (see [https://www.reuters.com/article/us-northkorea-missiles-guam-idUSKBN1AR1Z3 here]), but I can't find any "official" travel alert from other governments. I would keep the warning on Guam page anyway hoping they will settle things down quickly. [[User:GiulioC|GiulioC]] ([[User talk:GiulioC|talk]]) 05:40, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
We are planning to revitalize Wikitravel and our community! In 2013 we would like to improve technicality and usability of the site and we are open to any ideas! Please let us know of any new features you would like to have on WT and share with us your suggestions on how to make Wikitravel better. Thank you! [[User:IBAlex|IBAlex]] 14:20, 20 December 2012 (EST)
 
:Please list the appropriate pages to make suggestions. --[[Special:Contributions/118.93.73.30|118.93.73.30]] 03:16, 2 January 2013 (EST)
 
  
==Policy on free-riding tips==
+
::Agreed. Since the situation is continually developing I think its best to have a warning, because people who have planned to travel there need to know. I think adding that link would be a good start-- Just in case. [[User:Tonikar|Tonikar]] ([[User talk:Tonikar|talk]]) 14:22, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
I got some second thoughts about deleting tips on how to evade a station entrance fee in Stockholm-Arlanda Airport: [http://wikitravel.org/wiki/en/index.php?title=Stockholm&action=historysubmit&diff=1972045&oldid=1971916 Link to change log] What is Wikitravel's policy for riding transports, or entering venues, without a proper ticket? Is it a no-no, or are there circumstances when such information is allowed? /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 19:12, 23 December 2012 (EST)
+
:::As I understand, the talk was of landing missiles (presumably unarmed) 30-40 km from Guam, not on Guam. Anyway, Kim has now decided not to do it at this time. No warning needed. [[User:Nurg|Nurg]] ([[User talk:Nurg|talk]]) 04:09, 15 August 2017 (EDT)
:There is an [[Wikitravel:Illegal_activities_policy]]. [[User:AlasdairW|AlasdairW]] 19:14, 26 December 2012 (EST)
+
::::I reverted the warning box when it was removed a few days ago, but now things seem to have changed and I can´t find any official negative travel warning from other countries, so I would probably remove it now but keep a close eye on the situation. [[User:Adzas|Adzas]] ([[User talk:Adzas|talk]]) 06:27, 15 August 2017 (EDT)
:Based on the above policy I'd say it's clear that info should be deleted. It could be argued as acceptable e.g. if there's an official requirement to pay for a ticket but everybody ignores it and it isn't controlled or sanctioned - falling somewhat loosely under "Where police or public corruption mean that the written law of the land differs substantially from the practise of law enforcement." Maaaybe applicable in this case if all local U-30 people do it. [[User:Berserk|Berserk]] 23:36, 26 December 2012 (EST)
 
:: Related is [[Gävle]], where I saw the need to point out that burning the Gävle Goat is illegal, since the goats have been burnt down by foreign travellers, who were deceived by locals to commit the act, with legal consequences. /[[User:Blist|Blist]] 15:50, 27 December 2012 (EST)
 

Latest revision as of 10:32, 15 August 2017

The Travellers' pub is the place to ask questions when you're confused, lost, afraid, tired, annoyed, thoughtful, or helpful. Please check the FAQ and Help page before asking a question, though, since that may save your time and others'.

Please add new questions at the bottom of the page and sign your post by appending four tildes (~~~~) to it, but otherwise plunge forward!

You can find Archived discussions here: Travellers´pub Archives

  • If you have a question or suggestion about a particular article, try using talk pages to keep the discussion specific to that article.
wts:Wikitravel Shared:Travellers' pub

Headings[edit]

I am brand new to Wiki and created ny page, then somehow my headings lost their se parathion a and all but the first too be ame on line! I tried pasting in headings from a different site but nothing works!. They are all in a block! I have also lost the Add Listing button? Arlingham (talk) 19:02, 9 January 2017 (EST)

Hello and welcome to Wikitravel! I currently don't see anything on your userpage. Could you provide more details as to what specific page you are trying to edit? Tyen (talk) 19:05, 9 January 2017 (EST)

M page is Arly but I don't think I have puny it yet I somehow lost all the indentation and had to change the headings to make sense but need to format but can't wo ou what to do?I am having trouble replying as I am using an iPhone and can't see what I am writing! Y page title is Arlingham! Arlingham (talk) 19:24, 9 January 2017 (EST)

Arlingham I fixed it for you. Some of the headings are still non-standard but they are correctly formatted. Thanks for your additions--I know that typing on those things is a real bear. Koavf (talk) 19:48, 9 January 2017 (EST)

Hello. I'm new to editing Wikitravel. I added a new city, McHenry, Illinois, but now see that there's a empty link under the Chicagoland tab for there. I don't know how to move my page to there.Damelon (talk) 09:07, 27 June 2017 (EDT)

Hi, I have changed your article name, so you can now find it under McHenry (Illinois). Happy editing! Adzas (talk) 10:31, 27 June 2017 (EDT)

Business Listings: How Much is too Much?[edit]

Earlier today, a bus company that operates New Zealand's largest passenger transport network with daily services from Auckland to many towns and cities in the Waikato region made an account, and proceeded to add their listing to a WHOLE BUNCH of pages, which looked like spam from my end. Should we allow companies to add their listings to more than a certain number of pages? Yes? No? If we do, what could be the ramifications? What could potential questions, comments, and or snide remarks could arise? -- —The preceding comment was added by Tonikar (talkcontribs)

Good question. But I think their listing should only be added to the city where their headquarters is located (and maybe to small cities and towns where they are the only choice to get into). Just imagine if we allow this bus operator to add all its lines to Wikitravel articles, we will soon see chain restaurants, hotels, and other business add listings to all places where they operate (actually, we've seen quite a few cases like this before), which will soon turn Wikitravel to a yellow page. Plus our policy about touting is pretty clear about this: ...businesses should be listed in only one article for the town or district in which the business operates... . --Binbin (talk) 04:21, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
I agree with Binbin, we'd better stick to our touting policy. The risk of having chains adding their listings everywhere is too high (and we're not the Yellow Pages, aren't we?). GiulioC (talk) 05:24, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
If you are in New Zealand without a car, it is likely that you will use Intercity to get around. I think that there is only one other operator (Naked Bus) with a smaller national network and some regional operators (Atomic etc) and for a few destinations trains. So I think that it is fine to mention them in the get in section. However we don't need the full details about WiFi etc in every article. I would prefer that some information was added about the services to a particular destination - e.g. "X has two coaches per day from Auckland via Hamilton and one from Wellington via Napier. Coaches stop outside the post office." AlasdairW (talk) 10:55, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
AlasdairW, and Binbin bring up good points. This could be a slippery slope, but on this one occasion since they are one of the few transportation services listed on our site in some areas it seems relevant and helpful. Would it be okay if they specified amenities for travelers per each location? Tonikar (talk) 9:27, 17 March 2017 (PST)
I agree that we should stick with our policy, have the business listed once, probably best the country article, and there list some specific amenities if that adds value. In our external links policy it says clearly what not to list to, so if we make an exception for one business, soon more will follow. Adzas (talk) 12:40, 17 March 2017 (EDT)
Would it be good to review our policy, and add an addendum for the amount of posts that a company has added/ can add? Also, should we be reviewing these on a case by case basis; especially if we think it could be helpful for the traveler? Like AlasdairW, had said that it is likely you will come across this company's transportation system in NZ if travelling without a car... Tonikar (talk) 1:42, 17 March 2017 (PST)

I'm torn on this one too. First, I love Alasdair's point that a business should take the time, if they are going to try this, to make EACH listing specifically relevant to that page. If they don't want to take the time to point out the relevancy of their business to that particular destination (and they ought to be encouraged by us to do so), they should not have the privilege of being listed here.

Second, I am at a loss to find something wrong with listing a business on multiple pages, if those pages do not contain any (or a very small number) similar options. In this case, if you are considering traveling to a small town in NZ that is only served by this bus company, we ought to provide details as to how to catch a bus into/out of there if we have them. What is the harm? Now, if this is, say, New York City, where there are interminable bus and other transportation options for getting in and out, I would say that allowing companies to list all of them would be disastrous for Wikitravel, and of limited to zero use for the traveler. And don't even get me started on chain restaurants!

So perhaps there is a middle ground? Where there are many existing options, disallow the listing; where there are none or very few, allow them; and when allowed, the listing must be customized to that destination. And when we see a company engaging in this behavior, we ought to make contact with them as soon as possible, guide them, and have them provide a proposed list of everywhere they are intending to add their listing, as well as the specifics of how they will customize their listing to the page, BEFORE they spam it out everywhere publicly. How's that sound? IBobi (talk) 19:29, 22 March 2017 (EDT)

I agree. In principle, listing on multiple pages is not allowed , except where similar choices are limited and/or there're none or only a few similar listings (we do have this "something is better than nothing" policy). Yes, a prior communication with the companies who want to put their listings on multiple page sounds even better so that on one hand they can do it properly with our help, on the other we can kind of make sure things don't go out of control. I think we can start with this bus operator in NZ. What do you guys think? --Binbin (talk) 01:40, 23 March 2017 (EDT)

Watchlist[edit]

Hello, for a month or so i've been pressing the star shaped sign in pages i liked, and now i can find how to access them. how can i see it? (Asked by Nir6668 at 21:47, 1 April 2017).

The star shaped sign (next to View History near the top right of the page) adds an article to your watchlist. You can see this by clicking on the link "Watchlist" at the top right of the page (when you are logged in). This will display a list of any of the pages in your watchlist which have been edited in the past few days - the number of days can be changed on the watchlist tab of Preferences. You can also set things so that every page that you edit is automatically added to your watchlist, and you can choose to get an email when a page on your watchlist is changed. AlasdairW (talk) 19:12, 1 April 2017 (EDT)

Tours listing[edit]

how can i list my tours businessEastland adventures (talk) 10:37, 4 April 2017 (EDT)

Hey Eastland Adventures! You can list your tour business on the destination pages of the locations you service: consider viewing our rules on where to post in on either our Wikitravel:Activity listings or the Wikitravel:Where you can stick it page. Also, be sure to acknowledge our Wikitravel:Don't tout policy as well. Tonikar (talk) 010:13, 5 April 2017 (PST)
Hi, I have noticed that in Pune, heritage walk has been listed, even though it is also a walking tour, the policy should be uniformly applied on all, having said that I am not asking to turn down their listing. I appreciate the policy but it must modify with time, considering the practicality, wikitravel should understand that it is a self-guided tour platform and walking tours are guided tour platform, both are different and guided tours does not conflict with wikitravel because taking a walking tour does not restrict or encourage a person from using wikitravel any less, rather if a person explores a place on a walking tour that he has earlier seen listed on wikitravel, it provides him a reassurance of the quality and depth of wikitravel guides.Even lonely planet lists walking tours and so are all the other travel guide providers, it is a shame that with a fear of competition (which is actually not in reality) a portal like wiki travel is not passing on all the relevant information to the travelers about what and how to explore the city. For europe, walking tours have become very popular and so it is understandable that listing too many of such tours can actually confuse the travelers as to which one to use, but for developing nations like India, where the Indian people don't even know what are walking tours, listing the same would mean that a great deal to help travelers. A venture that i experienced recently called as Yo Tours is providing such great walking tours in india, which is highly appreciated by travelers and i tried to list those for different cities but the same has been removed. I believe case to assessment is necessary which even the tour listing policy suggests, it never says not to list walking tours. I would appreciate if i can get a solution for the same. —The preceding comment was added by Ava2011 (talkcontribs)
Hello, thank you for your input. As you can see in our policies, in general we don´t allow walking tours in our articles, see activity listings. When we check the latest edits and we see something that would be against those policies, we would remove it. It is correct that it could happen that other listings were previously added and gone unnoticed, but in general we do try to have a look at the existing listings as well to see what has slipped through overtime. But this is up to everyone who contributes to Wikitravel. If you still feel your tour would add value and needs to be included, then it should be discussed on the talk page of the article itself, see what feedback you get from other users. I hope this helps! Looking forward to further edits from you. Adzas (talk) 11:10, 1 June 2017 (EDT)

Help[edit]

Hi! I tried to post a message at the Romanian Travellers' pub. Apparently, that page is protected from any edit. I also tried to talk to user Vlad (talk, contribs) who is an active administrator there. But it seems he had protected his own talk page from any edit. Is that normal to protect such pages and be unable to contact anyone there? Thank you, Wintereu (talk) 08:30, 9 April 2017 (EDT)

Hello, thank you for your message. I don´t have an account on the Romanian site, but looking at it it has been inactive for quite some time (the travellers pub). I will check with corporate and see what the reason was for the protection of the page. Thanks for bringing this up. Adzas (talk) 16:01, 9 April 2017 (EDT)
As far as I can see, the Romanian Wikitravel appear to have been frozen in time ... Wintereu (talk) 13:32, 10 April 2017 (EDT)
Yep. As for my talk page, some time ago wikitravel was a target for SPAM bots, and that included my talk page. All I did was this: 23 noiembrie 2008 20:13‎ Vlad (Discuție | contribuții | blochează)‎ m . . (14.577 de octeți) (0)‎ . . (A protejat "Discuţie Utilizator:Vlad" [edit=autoconfirmed:move=sysop]) (anulare): only autoconfirmed users may edit the talk page (and of course only admin can move it), but I admit that I haven't the slightest idea what autoconfirmed users mean in wikitravel's context. --Vlad (talk) 14:06, 10 April 2017 (EDT)
Hello Wintereu! Thank you for reaching out! Here is a list of protected pages on RU WT. As mentioned by Vlad above, the main reason behind protecting pages (or sometimes the entire site) is to avoid spam attacks for those versions of Wikitravel that don't have many active admins. Sometimes the spam attacks are so "forceful" and sneaky that don't get catch by our spam filters. Therefore, in a good faith to protect what has been already created we sometimes protect the pages.
Are you planning to work actively on RU WT? If yes, I would be happy to lift the protection for RU pages. Hopefully, the spammers let go as well in a meantime. Cheers, IBAlex (talk) 03:54, 18 April 2017 (EDT)
Wintereu, I just read a discussion on your Talk Page and realized you're not willing to work on RU. You made fair points. If you change your mind, however, please let me know:) Have a great day, IBAlex (talk) 04:02, 18 April 2017 (EDT)

Hi IBAlex (talk, contribs). I just tried to (re)fix the number of days and edits to be shown within the recent changes page at RO WT (from the Preferences --> Recent changes). It must be a soft problem, because I simply can't change the values there (the max days suggested there and 1000 edits to show by default). And that's only one from many issues I noticed here. Also, it seems I can't be connected on both the EN WT and RO WT at the same time... Thank you for replying and reading the discussion from my talk page. There isn't much more to say. Since the e-mail option doesn't seem to work either, if you (or any one else) feel like sending me any more message or comment, you'll find me on "copycats" projects under the very same user name. Happy Easter ;) Wintereu (talk) 13:34, 18 April 2017 (EDT)

One more thing. Can you imagine I had to log in several times just to write the message above?! Wintereu (talk) 13:37, 18 April 2017 (EDT)

Deletion and Login/Funky Stuff[edit]

Hey everyone! So lately there have been some issues with login-- Wikitravel has been logging people out frivolously, and deleted pages are still showing up in Recent Changes. We are currently working to resolve these issues. If there are any other problems or bugs you find please let us know on here or through email! Thanks! Tonikar (talk) 3:10, 18 April 2017 (EDT)


Bangkok/Thonburi will not load on my browser.

Avemario (talk) 04:05, 19 April 2017 (EDT) The "Understand.Get In.Get Around etc" banner from the top of the page on places where there is a pic at the top, has fallen to the bottom of the article (at least in Thailand) Avemario (talk) 04:19, 19 April 2017 (EDT)

Issue[edit]

Hi, On my talkpage when I remove the "If you feel that I have reverted" box as well as try to archive the page I keep getting "This action has been automatically identified as harmful, and therefore disallowed. If you believe your action was constructive, please inform an administrator of what you were trying to do. A brief description of the abuse rule which your action matched is: TS Page Title Block",
Not being familiar with the site as such I have no idea who to ask or where to find any admins,
Thanks, Davey2010 (talk) 16:20, 20 April 2017 (EDT)

Probably running into a vandalism protection filter. Just write on Tonikar's page and she can help you with that. IBobi (talk) 18:50, 20 April 2017 (EDT)
Hi IBobi, Not sure why tho as I've never had the issue before ?, Forgot to mention but I'm constantly being logged out aswell which I assumed was a site issue, Anyway I'll ask them thanks for your help much appreciated. Davey2010 (talk) 18:57, 20 April 2017 (EDT)

Removal question[edit]

Hi, If for instance a hotel is closed down do we remove the listing or do we put something like "this has since closed down" ?, Not sure if we preserve the history or not, Thanks, Davey2010 (talk) 22:49, 21 April 2017 (EDT)

Hi, thanks for your question. Yes, you can just remove the info (after verifying) and just leave a comment in the summary field when you publish. You can add/edit any info, as long as it is clear to all why something was removed. Happy editing! Adzas (talk) 06:08, 22 April 2017 (EDT)
Hi Adzas, Okie dokie thanks very much - I didn't want to remove incase we preserve that was all, Anyway thanks for your much much appreciated :), Happy editing, Davey2010 (talk) 10:17, 22 April 2017 (EDT)

Cleanup![edit]

I do believe that I have read "please remove the clutter.................." Wikitravel has more than 20 articles going back a loooooooooooooooooooooooooooong time!

When I write here, I remove the article afterwards after a "reasonable" time!

So will someone in authority please move this old stuff to where it belongs?

I would do it myself, but at 74 years of age, I do not know where to put it all.

Avemario (talk) 07:02, 27 April 2017 (EDT)

Hi Avemario, thank you for pointing this out. But can you be more specific on which articles you are talking about? You are always welcome to drop me an email (you know my email address). Thank you! --Binbin (talk) 09:55, 27 April 2017 (EDT)

Cleanup![edit]

Hi!!

Is someone going to do something about "sweeping the Pub" at all? I did mention it in the above article.

Avemario (talk) 03:24, 5 May 2017 (EDT)

Hi Avemario, thank you for raising this again. You are right, the Pub contains too many topics now, I agree that it should be archived. Maybe to here? --Binbin (talk) 05:41, 6 May 2017 (EDT)
Just archived all topics raised in 2016 here. And our Wikitravellers' pub archive page is here. --Binbin (talk) 09:20, 15 May 2017 (EDT)

Map based wikitravel[edit]

Hello!

I wish to introduce a map based wikitravelish website impressionmap.org

I'm an avid reader and planned all trips based on info here. A big thanks first! However, articles are organized by meaningless place names (it's the only choice though), and it's not straightforward to figure out which place is where. Thus, planning bigger trips involves going back and forth between here and Google Maps, taking a long time.

It may be better to organize info by map itself and attach it to the map as snippets which will appear or disappear based on zoom level. More info and links can be added as popups. So I made the aforementioned website. You can zoom in to Amherst, MA or NYC (worse option as not much info is added) to see how it works. By the way, the website doesn't seem to work on IE and renders a bit ugly on browsers released before March 2017

Asking for advice and opinions! If you would, edit it as well!

Hopefully this is the right place to do such introduction. No bad intention, just wish to make travel info presentation more intuitive and trip planning easier Wkenmomo (talk) 14:16, 1 June 2017 (EDT)

Sorry for such a late response! We appreciate your time spent on Wikitravel -- especially for adding edits to the Liaocheng page. We hope to see more thoughtful edits like the ones you have provided. Thanks for the info! --Tonikar (talk) 01:50, 06 June 2017 (PST)
Hey Wkenmomo! I finally got a chance to check out the website you had created, and I think its pretty cool! I like that it sums up exactly where I may want to travel if I want to shop, or find out more about American history! I was wondering -- and you kind of explained already-- but your purpose for creating a map that works as so? How would this help benefit Wikitravel users? Thanks! --Tonikar (talk) 012:39, 07 June 2017 (PST)
Hey Tonikar, sorry for the late reply. Why I create it is that I want a more direct way of accessing geo info. I used to read here, search on Google Map, write what it is about and save it in my maps to compare with others. A great hassle and Google maps aren't designed for this. My purpose is to make designing "optimized" trips easier and I really hope to plan my next trip to Canada intuitively and effortlessly. Do wikitravel need a dynamic map? Wikitravel is welcome to host this map and embed it to the right zoom and boundary. The map is itself editable.Wkenmomo (talk) 13:45, 10 June 2017 (EDT)
Tonikar, Wkenmomo I think it would be a great idea to include links to Wikimapia. I'm working on US Hwy 2 between Monroe and Stephens Pass. Here is an example of what you get for Skykomish_(Washington) [1]. We could actually provide links to WikiTravel on the WikiMapia page. Ideas? Kgrr (talk) 08:46, 9 July 2017 (EDT)

Asian pages: cleanup or not?[edit]

Many articles related to south-central Asia have tables collecting country/regional symbols. See some examples here, here and here. Does Wikitravel really need it? Is it really important to know the regional flower/plant/animal/tree/etcetera of those regions? There are even flags but apparently some are fake We're a travel-related community, the info in those tables would look better in WP. I suggest to remove all of them. Any thoughts? GiulioC (talk) 09:26, 26 June 2017 (EDT)

I agree, the tables seem to overtake some of the articles, we are not an encyclopedia, lets stick to travel related information, and flags we usually only put in the country articles. Especially if the flags are not “official” we should remove those. Adzas (talk) 05:38, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
Agree. Those tables don't belong here. They take up a lot of space but don't add value to Wikitravel as a world-wide travel guide. I think we should remove all those country/regional symbols. --Binbin (talk) 05:49, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
I agree. Remove them all. They are intrusive, not important for travel, and I suspect they may have been copied from somewhere else (Wikipedia?) without attribution (I may be wrong about that point). I have seen them here before and disliked them, but were hesitant to just delete them - so I'm glad to see others feel the same way. Nurg (talk) 06:00, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
So, shall we start deleting those tables? Any other thoughts about this issue? GiulioC (talk) 10:14, 4 July 2017 (EDT)
There have been no objections, so anyone can go ahead and delete them. Nurg (talk) 04:59, 10 August 2017 (EDT)

can't save preferences[edit]

I just tried to change the Internationalisation option in my preferences and change the wiki language to have the sidebar and some buttons shown in my mother language. I pressed "save" bet it's set to "english" anyway. BTW... where are the recent changes gone? can't the the recent edits. Any chance to see it? -- DerFussi (talk) 16:50, 9 July 2017 (EDT)

This was written almost two weeks ago, and no one has answered! Will someone who understands the question please provide an answer to the person asking? Avemario (talk) 07:24, 19 July 2017 (EDT)

Hey DerFussi and Avemario! So sorry for the late response! There have also been issues lately when other users have tried to save their ad preferences as well. This may be a related issue. We are currently looking into this! Thank you for bringing this to our attention! Tonikar (talk) 18:59, 20 July 2017 (EDT)


Welcome[edit]

Hey all! So I was thinking how do you all welcome people to the site?! I usually say something like:

Hello! Welcome to Wikitravel. To help get you started contributing, we've created a tips for new contributors page, full of helpful links about policies and guidelines and style as well as some important information on copyleft and basic stuff like how to edit a page. If you need help, check out Wikitravel:Help, or post a message in the travellers' pub. -- Tonikar (talk)

Any suggestions for a better welcome?! Tonikar (talk) 20:30, 24 July 2017 (EDT)

Hi Tonika, I think your welcome message is perfectly fine. However,I think sometimes a bit of personal touch can be added in the message to make it more interactive. --Binbin (talk) 05:16, 26 July 2017 (EDT)
Hey Binbin! Sounds good, what would you suggest for more of a personal touch?!Tonikar (talk) 14:28, 31 July 2017 (EDT)
I agree with Binbin, the welcome message is fine like that and the only thing that could be added is something personal. Usually I add the new user's name after the "Hello" and some other words if he/she made some good contributions. GiulioC (talk) 05:42, 1 August 2017 (EDT)
I use the standard welcome messages that we have available, either for personal or business, and add a few personal lines if someone already made edits, if they are good just to thank them, if not following our guidelines I will mention something to point them to the right direction. Adzas (talk) 10:45, 2 August 2017 (EDT)
Great! Thanks peeps! I've been using the standard welcome and inserting their name seems to make a lot of sense! Tonikar (talk) 19:12, 4 August 2017 (EDT)

Best International Graduate Schools: Pros and Cons[edit]

I am going to grad school in the states, but have had a few friends venture out to do their study elsewhere such as Johannesburg, London, etc. What are some schools/places that you all have either attended, or encountered? Any pro's about going across the globe for studies? Cons? Semester programs?Tonikar (talk) 18:50, 8 August 2017 (EDT)

I studied in my home country, but did my internship abroad, and since then have worked in different countries. A great way to learn about another country, the language, see the sights etc. I can´t help you with info about schools abroad, not experienced that myself. Adzas (talk) 12:00, 9 August 2017 (EDT)
Oh cool Adzas!!! Where did you do your internship? I'm thinking I would like to venture out for mine.Tonikar (talk) 14:08, 9 August 2017 (EDT)
I did my internship in Disneyland Paris, just after opening in 1992 (I´m getting old!!). Worked in all the hotels there, great experience. Adzas (talk) 11:03, 11 August 2017 (EDT)
Definitely should "go across the globe for studies". I've had my education in my home country, but I worked fulltime overseas for a few years immediately after my graduation. It's really the best experience I've had. So, if you have the choice, I think you should really think about going abroad for studies. Good luck! --Binbin (talk) 10:44, 13 August 2017 (EDT)
I'm from China and dong my PhD in the states. It depends on if you are pursuing a master or PhD. For masters, it should be fine anywhere you think of. For PhD, you'd better make sure you get a good advisor and sane graduation requirements (western europe, us, oceania, japan and hong kong are safe bets, avoid mainland China due to language and paper requirements)Wkenmomo (talk) 21:24, 13 August 2017 (EDT)
I studied in my home country but I worked abroad for a while, definitely something I recommend to anyone. Have you considered moving to Europe? There are many great cities you can live in while studying. GiulioC (talk) 05:34, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
Thanks Wkenmomo, that is super true, and helpful! GiulioC I actually have. One of my closest friends actually did her Master's degree there about a year ago, and she loved it. So I've been thinking about it! Tonikar (talk) 14:27, 14 August 2017 (EDT)

Warning or No Warning for Guam[edit]

As the situation develops with the North Korea, we've also got quite a bit of back-and-forth for the warning box for Guam. I think it's time we have a discussion here. Warning or no warning? What do you guys think? --Binbin (talk) 10:49, 13 August 2017 (EDT)

Guam government issued some emergency guidelines in case of nuclear attack (see here), but I can't find any "official" travel alert from other governments. I would keep the warning on Guam page anyway hoping they will settle things down quickly. GiulioC (talk) 05:40, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
Agreed. Since the situation is continually developing I think its best to have a warning, because people who have planned to travel there need to know. I think adding that link would be a good start-- Just in case. Tonikar (talk) 14:22, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
As I understand, the talk was of landing missiles (presumably unarmed) 30-40 km from Guam, not on Guam. Anyway, Kim has now decided not to do it at this time. No warning needed. Nurg (talk) 04:09, 15 August 2017 (EDT)
I reverted the warning box when it was removed a few days ago, but now things seem to have changed and I can´t find any official negative travel warning from other countries, so I would probably remove it now but keep a close eye on the situation. Adzas (talk) 06:27, 15 August 2017 (EDT)