Thanks for all of the great contributions you've been making lately - much appreciated! -- Ryan • (talk) • 12:11, 6 April 2012 (EDT)
Hi, Travelpleb. You've done a great job! But I'm wondering what your plan is for the Ipoh article. Why did you delete all the posts on Ipoh foods? I also find this statement way too weak: "Like everywhere in Malaysia, the local food is sublime." Ipoh has a reputation throughout Malaysia for particularly great food, to the extent that I've known of people from KL who drive to Ipoh just to have lunch and walk around having some more snacks before driving back the same day. To give a kind of analogy, I don't think people would take a day trip from Kuantan to Kuala Terengganu just to gorge themselves on local cuisine. I look forward to your thoughts. Ikan Kekek 01:59, 31 May 2012 (EDT)
I should have done this first: I just looked at the history of the Ipoh guide, and I see you moved the regional specialties to the Perak article. I guess the names of the eateries in Ipoh specializing in them will have to be deleted, then? And a question I'd ask (but don't know the answer to) is how many of these are particularly Ipoh specialties, like Ipoh Bean Sprouts, for example? Does Taiping have its own specialties? Ikan Kekek 02:02, 31 May 2012 (EDT)
The Ipoh article had a tag saying its style was not in line with the Wikitravel style guide. As per Wikitravel:Where you can stick it, I moved this list of local cuisine to the regional article. The specialist eateries could be added back to Ipoh as restaurants listed in the correct style. If such a plan offends your sensibilities, by all means move the whole lot back to Ipoh, but I think this clutters what should be a fairly concise article. Travelpleb 02:10, 31 May 2012 (EDT)
Perhaps I am a culinary cretin but there doesn't seem to be anything particularly special about the bean sprouts in Ipoh and to say that Dim Sum is an Ipoh specialty seems perverse. The list looks like it was written by someone with a strong local affinity and needs a good overhaul to make it more useful to visitors.Travelpleb 02:23, 31 May 2012 (EDT)
Obviously, dim sum isn't solely a specialty of Ipoh, but Ipoh is certainly known for great dim sum. I'm not sure how concise an article about what I think is still the 3rd-largest city in Malaysia (unless one of the cities in East Malaysia has passed it) should be, and since the thing that Malaysians in my experience consider most special about Ipoh is its food, I think that section should be the longest and most detailed. By the way, I don't have a personal stake in this, because while I loved a brief (3 days, I think) visit to Ipoh in 2003, I've spent most of my time in Malaysia in Terengganu (mostly in a kampung), KL, and Kelantan, and I've loved the food in KL, Penang, Kota Bharu, Kuantan, and Seremban, among other places, not just Ipoh. I'm almost tempted to say the list would be better placed for now in Talk:Ipoh than in Perak, but since we agree that it needs work, maybe we should post a request for help somewhere where it's most likely to be read by more users. Where do you think would be most effective? Probably not the Travellers' Pub, as few seem to read it lately (as witness the lack of response to my post about www.airport-china). Talk:Ipoh and Talk:Perak, perhaps? Ikan Kekek 04:44, 31 May 2012 (EDT)
According to | Wikipedia, Malaysia's urban agglomerations are ranked: KL (6.1mil), Penang (1.5mil), Johor Bahru (1.3mil). Ipoh languishes in fourth place with 700,000 inhabitants.
Re concision: while it's a big place, Ipoh isn't much of a tourist hub and there isn't all that much there: pretty buildings and pomelos don't need that much describing. Therefore I think the article should be kept succinct.
I don't think we stand much chance of getting help on this but I'll stick the list in Talk:Ipoh and see if anyone cares. In the likely event we have to do this ourselves: the first five items on the list (Ipoh bean sprouts chicken, Ipoh Sar Hor Fun, Salted chicken, Ipoh White Coffee, and Pomelo) are described as Ipoh specialities, so maybe they and their descriptions should stay in the article. Establishments notable for each should be separated and listed following the style guide.
The list is then broken by "Besides these signature dishes, Ipoh is also known to have some of the best of Malaysian cuisine like:" and descriptions of more general dishes follow. These more general dishes (dim sum, banana leaf curries etc) should not listed in the Ipoh article. Any not already listed in the Malaysia article could be included there.
While I'd happily accept a compromise and leave the five "local" specialities, each one doesn't seem all that local and so I'd be inclined to be against inclusion.
1. Ipoh bean sprouts chicken - in the name of discovery I made sure I have bean sprouts for lunch in Ipoh today. They were perfectly ordinary and not "very fat, short and tastier than those produced outside Ipoh".
2. Ipoh Sar Hor Fun - the noodle soups here are like any other Chinese noodle soup I've had on this continent.
3. Salted chicken - everyone knows that the colonel was the first to add salt to chicken skin.
4. Ipoh White Coffee - Old Town White coffee is a big national chain (admittedly originating in Ipoh). They run coffee shops selling Ipoh White Coffee in all the big cities, it's even hit Borneo.
5. Pomelo - Pomeloes from Ipoh seem to be available far beyond Ipoh. Wikipedia even has a picture of Ipoh Pomelos for sale in Singapore.
From what I understand, the pomelos are grown just outside of Ipoh. I saw street-side stalls selling tremendous numbers of huge pomelos near Sam Poh Tong (which I notice is listed on the Ipoh guide as "within Ipoh," but which I thought was beyond the city limits). But wait: You're actually in Ipoh now? Are you there long enough to try some of the recommended eateries and find out more information about their location, contact info, etc.? That would be great, though it sounds like you aren't so thrilled with the food so far. Ikan Kekek 16:15, 31 May 2012 (EDT)
I will check out one or two of the places listed. But a brief bit of Googling yields reviews and full contact information for some of the places, so actually having to gorge systematically through the list won't be necessary. I'm apathetic about chronicling the food here because it's all outstanding. I've been in Malaysia for about 5 weeks now and haven't had anything remotely bad: Chinese, Malay, Indian... all great. Perhaps too concise for a travel guide, my advice for good eating here would just be: eat. Travelpleb 22:41, 31 May 2012 (EDT)
Yeah, most food in Malaysia is at least good, though you may have to watch your digestive system now and then. Where else are you going to hit on your trip? By the way, I had some of the best samosas I've ever had when I walked through the Indian neighborhood in Ipoh and walked into a shop at random. So moist and delicious! Ikan Kekek 03:23, 1 June 2012 (EDT)
1. chicken and beansprouts - I ate at one of the recommended places. It was very tasty and the meat was tender. I'm not going to rave about it because tasty here is not some magic combination of herbs and spices; tasty here is just heaps of salt and fat, which is great to eat but not exactly a sign of skilled preparation. I've listed both recommended chicken and beansprout places. I've also added brief descriptions of the five Ipoh specialities. Do you think any of the others should be included?
I'm probably going to head to the Camerons tomorrow.
 seems to have blogged about most of these recommended places and lists their addresses and opening times so anyone can put listing together... any volunteers?
In case you were wondering, the beansprouts are not some super amazing local secret treasure... they're beansprouts like any other.Travelpleb 06:36, 1 June 2012 (EDT)
I think the ideal solution is to list only foodstuffs that are known to be local specialties plus those that are originally from elsewhere but known in Malaysia to be particularly good in Ipoh (which is the basis under which dim sum could be mentioned, though I won't fight hard for that). And then list eateries alphabetically by name (and price category, where relevant), mentioning in the entry for the eatery what it specializes in. I'll try to look at the blog you link to later. Enjoy the Cameron Highlands. I've never been there. Ikan Kekek 16:06, 1 June 2012 (EDT)
I had some dim today in Georgetown (not the Cameron Highlands). They were very good and so disincline me further from mentioning dim sum in the Ipoh article. I'm gradually working down the list of restaurants, finding their details and adding listings to the article. We'll have a fairly decent Eat section soon enough. I'm also tempted to move this thread to Talk:Ipoh. Travelpleb 23:56, 2 June 2012 (EDT)
Feel free. But do keep in mind that Penang is also renowned for its dim sum in Malaysia. I have also had wonderful dim sum in KL (and in Kuantan as well, though back in the mid 70s), but Penang and Ipoh have traditionally been most famous for dim sum in the peninsula, I believe. It would be good to have input from some Malaysians. Ikan Kekek 00:32, 3 June 2012 (EDT)