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Wikitravel talk:Climate Expedition

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Climate-info[edit]

Archived from the Pub:

I added some information about the weather and climate in Ko Chang and Antalya. There is a template(not used in those articles) called Climate, where do I put an explanation and the article template of it? Or is it a good idea at all, or should I not work on it any further? --Adestro 10:28, 2 October 2006 (EDT)

I like the look of it, but I'm not sure how to use it. Jordanmills 07:58, 9 October 2006 (EDT)
I think this could be useful for travellers, but I wouldn't have it at the top of the page... Maybe at the bottom? This is where there will be a tags box, or in the understand section... -- Tim 18:54, 26 November 2006 (EST)

step-by-step instructions to add climate info[edit]

I couldn't decipher it from the expedition page: are there any ready-to-use instructions on how for any destination to find a climate information compliant with our license requirements (or find that there's none in the known sources), and add it to a destination page in question? --DenisYurkin 09:36, 28 September 2008 (EDT)

sea temperature mapped, monthly[edit]

swept in from pub:

I wonder if anyone could suggest an online mapping service showing water average temperatures for most popular beaches, on a map, for a given month of the year? This one looks good, but doesn't allow zooming in to a country level, and doesnt have country and city labels.

Or: looking for a seaside place with comfortable weather in May/June to stay with a 1.5-year child, any suggestions preferably in/close to Europe or Asia or Nothern Africa :-). --DenisYurkin 12:29, 2 February 2010 (EST)

Update: I meant this one: http://marine(dot)rutgers.edu/opp/Temperature/Temperature1.html -- replace (dot) with ".": ---DenisYurkin 13:58, 2 February 2010 (EST)
this page is the current temps, but if you dig around a bit, you should be able to find historical data. http://www.osdpd.noaa.gov/ml/ocean/sst/contour.html TomNativenewYorker 13:27, 2 February 2010 (EST)
I've seen it also earlier, but failed to found monthly historical data. Anyone more lucky than me with this? --DenisYurkin 13:58, 2 February 2010 (EST)

Climate data - proposal[edit]

Hi fellow "wikitravelers",


1) Useful or not?

From my experience, Climate data is essential for travel planning.
Do you think this information is useful and should be included into articles?


2) Opinion and approval

I'm asking for your opinion and approval of using Climate data from Weather Atlas (e.g. Dubai) to contribute to Wikitravel articles,
(the same way I'm doing when enhancing articles on Wikipedia with Climate data and citing data source)
e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pula#Geography_and_climate
(I'm declaring potential Conflict of interest, as I'm being involved with a company whose data I'm using.
But since I know how many years and effort has been put into collecting and cross-checking data from over 200 sources, I'm trusting this source over any other.)


3) Styling of Climate data

Template:Climate has limited predefined options
Is using modified "wikitable" to show data accepted option?
Climate data for Pula, Croatia
Month Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Year
Average high °C (°F) 10.0
(50.0)
10.0
(50.0)
13.0
(55.4)
16.0
(60.8)
21.0
(69.8)
25.0
(77.0)
28.0
(82.4)
28.0
(82.4)
24.0
(75.2)
20.0
(68.0)
14.0
(57.2)
10.0
(50.0)
18.3
(64.9)
Daily mean °C (°F) 6.0
(42.8)
6.0
(42.8)
8.5
(47.3)
12.0
(53.6)
16.5
(61.7)
20.5
(68.9)
23.0
(73.4)
23.0
(73.4)
19.5
(67.1)
16.0
(60.8)
10.5
(50.9)
7.0
(44.6)
14.0
(57.3)
Average low °C (°F) 2.0
(35.6)
2.0
(35.6)
4.0
(39.2)
8.0
(46.4)
12.0
(53.6)
16.0
(60.8)
18.0
(64.4)
18.0
(64.4)
15.0
(59.0)
12.0
(53.6)
7.0
(44.6)
4.0
(39.2)
9.8
(49.7)
Average rainfall mm (inch) 78
(3.1)
64
(2.5)
65
(2.6)
70
(2.8)
56
(2.2)
53
(2.1)
48
(1.9)
75
(3.0)
85
(3.4)
85
(3.4)
80
(3.2)
112
(4.4)
871
(34.6)
Average rainy days 12.0 12.0 12.0 13.0 13.0 13.0 10.0 11.0 11.0 12.0 13.0 13.0 145.0
Mean daily daylight hours 9.0 10.0 12.0 14.0 15.0 16.0 15.0 14.0 12.0 11.0 10.0 9.0 12.3
Mean daily sunshine hours 3.0 4.0 5.0 6.0 8.0 9.0 10.0 9.0 7.0 5.0 3.0 3.0 6.0
Percent possible sunshine 33 40 42 43 53 56 67 64 58 45 30 33 49
Average sea temperature °C (°F) 11.3
(52.4)
10.4
(50.7)
11.2
(52.1)
13.7
(56.7)
18.2
(64.8)
23.0
(73.3)
25.0
(77.0)
25.2
(77.3)
23.7
(74.6)
19.6
(67.3)
16.8
(62.3)
14.2
(57.5)
17.7
(63.8)
Average UV index 1 2 3 5 7 8 8 7 5 3 2 1 4.3
Source: Weather Atlas - Pula, Croatia - Weather forecast and Climate data
Thanks for taking the time to read this lengthy proposal,
D.Nino (talk) 13:09, 9 March 2017 (EST)


Style of Climate data table now matches Wikipedia Weather box
additionally, table has more information (Sea temperature and UV index)
D.Nino (talk) 07:34, 14 March 2017 (EDT)

Comments[edit]

Thanks for your input! Personally I don´t think we should have exactly the same box as wikipedia. It looks good, but I prefer the basic info in our template that we use in our articles. Above box would take up a large part in the article, if someone wants to know indepth info about the climate it can be found online. Adzas (talk) 11:25, 14 March 2017 (EDT)
Hi Adzas,
I assumed that if Wikitravel resembles Wikipedia, and tables are constructed in identical way, appearance should be similar.
I see that colored table seams over the top if the page is "thin" (it might be better on the bottom of the page), but Climate info goes "under" Understanding.
IMO is's better to present useful information to visitors, than sending them to search for data in other place.
There is also a question on introducing external link that I'd like to discuss.
I believe reliability and stating the source is important, but it might also be a problem if it's against your policy.
I suggest this discussion should be on what kind of information is essential, and, in what form info should be presented.
and is it inline with your policy to reference source of information.
As I've declared in COI my affiliation with Weather Atlas, I can state that company is willing to legally provide Climate data free of charge, for citing source of information.
D.Nino (talk) 12:16, 14 March 2017 (EDT)
Hi guys! First, please use a continuously indenting paragraph system for discussions, rather than what you've been doing. See virtually any long WT discussion for an example. Next, with regard to the climate data, I think adding climate data to articles is a good idea. But I find the implementation shared here to be far too intrusive. This is not a weather site -- it's a travel site that could use a weather snapshot. See here for what we traditionally show on WT: http://wikitravel.org/en/Chicago#Climate. All that is lacking is the Celcius measurement.
Now, as to the association with Weather Atlas, what can you tell us? We may be interested in a free weather FORECAST box (say, "today" or "this week" with an option to see more), but we can obtain historical data on temperature and precipitation from many sources without the need for attribution, so that would not be something that interests us. Welcome to Wikitravel!IBobi (talk) 19:30, 14 March 2017 (EDT)
Hi IBobi, thanks for participating in this discussion.
1) After being involved with Wikitravel for while, I've realized that reasoning "if Wikitravel resembles Wikipedia, and tables are constructed in identical way, appearance should be similar." - is wrong.
Wiki(encyclo)pedia's and Wikitravel's philosophy are different.
To oversimplify: 'pedia collects information while citing sources, whereas 'travel is creating travel guide based on experience of editors, both trying to present info in neutral way.
Another reason (why I thought presenting full data on users is good) is "professional deformation". For me seeing weather data is like an X-Ray, where even a change of pressure and wind direction is significant. But, I've realized, for average traveller - this amount of data might not be that useful.
On the other hand, I still think, that beside temperature and precipitation, sea temperature and daylight/sunshine hours are very useful.
(And of course data should be presented in both units)
2) Regarding Forecast vs Climate box, my vote is for Climate information (with "today" or "this week" option to see more), as I find Climate more useful for users (and inline with tone of articles), and detailed (short-term/10 days) forecast should be presented elsewhere.
Climate box should be under Climate (there is no Weather ;) section, as addition to textual description.
3) "we can obtain historical data on temperature and precipitation from many sources without the need for attribution, so that would not be something that interests us". I respect that, but after 13 yrs since launch, Wikitravel's editors still haven't done that. It's tedious work in every aspect. If you let us contribute with our data, results will be immediate, without burden to editors. It will enhance articles, create base for Climate subsection (if missing) and foremost start helping travellers (and that's the point).

Conclusion[edit]

Climate Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
High (°C) 9 6 7 18 19 20 19 18 17 16 15 14
Low (°C) 6 -3 -1 8 10 11 10 8 7 6 -2 -4
Precipitation (cm) 0 2 1 8 10 7 1 4 1 1 0 0
Hours daylight 9 10 11 11 12 13 13 12 11 11 10 9
Water (°C) 13 13 13 14 14 15 15 16 14 13 13 13

Palo Alto, California, USA - Weather forecast
If I may conclude - style and necessary data should be provided only for options that are already allowed in Template:Climate. (example doesn't have real values).
After establishing that Climate data is useful, what data is useful, and in what form it should be presented, the only issue is whether it is allowed to contribute to articles by providing Climate data (and citing source or forecast like in the example).
I 'd like to thank everyone for participating and taking this proposal into consideration.
D.Nino (talk) 12:13, 15 March 2017 (EDT)
Hi IBobi (sorry to bother you, but you're also Wikitravel's Admin & Community Manager and you've already participated in this discussion)
Can you please confirm if the proposed table from the "Conclusion" (Template:Climate) is ok.
Thank you D.Nino (talk) 06:51, 27 March 2017 (EDT)
Hello! Sorry for the delay in response, as another Community Manager on the site I will say, for now (we are trying to get another climate solution added to the site that would supersede this if implemented), but if you would like to move forward with the current presented solution, that table should include ONLY:
Average monthly temp in C and F AND Average precipitation in Inches and mm.
Thanks for being proactive in this discussion! Tonikar (talk) 11:28, 30 March 2017 (PST)
Climate Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
High (°C) 9 6 7 18 19 20 19 18 17 16 15 14
Low (°C) 6 -3 -1 8 10 11 10 8 7 6 -2 -4
Precipitation (cm) 0 2 1 8 10 7 1 4 1 1 0 0

Palo Alto, California, USA - Weather forecast
Hi, thanks for your confirmation.
1. There is not (predefined) option in Template:Climate for Average temp, only High and Low. Also metric precipitation is in cm not mm.
2. ..."we are trying to get another climate solution added to the site that would supersede this if implemented"...
If you need suggestions on Programming (PHP, JS, MariaDB) or Climate/Weather data - feel free to contact me.
D.Nino (talk) 05:43, 28 March 2017 (EDT)