From Wikitravel

JZ, we're going to need your LRC account information as we do a lot of the admin discussions via LRC protocol. thanks. Majnoona

What's LRC protocol? Google shows "lazy release consistency", which doesn't sound relevant. -phma

"LRC protocol" is "living-room couch". Maj and I live together, and we talk about Wikitravel here sometimes. Little joke. --Evan 11:15, 18 Jan 2004 (EST)

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I think it should be made clear that "other" means "other than the nominator", rather than "other than the nominee", since the nominee isn't an admin, so by Grice if it meant that, the word "other" wouldn't be necessary. So if there are only two admins, it is useless for either to nominate someone, since there aren't two other admins to support him. -phma 17:21, 19 Jan 2004 (EST)

[edit] Policy Improvements

I think there may be some room for improvement in policy about nominations. Here are the items I'd like to raise for discussion:

1. Renomination protocol. When should a renomination occur? There are at least four cases of renomination I can think of: where the previous nomination was declined; where the admin bit lapsed due to inactivity or resignation; where the nomination has lapsed without the nominee acknowledging it; where the previous nomination was objected to. I kinda stepped in it when I nominated Huttite after his previous nomination was declined which maybe wasn't the best way to do it, so it'd be nice to have a bit more guidance in the rules.
2. Discussion cut short. Seven days might not be enough time to complete an active and ongoing discussion given the lags we have due to the spin of the planet. So I would suggest something like changing "After seven days of discussion" to something like "After 21 days of discussion or seven days without any additional comments/discussion being made (whichever comes first)". This way we don't accidently cut short an active discussion which hasn't really finished.
3. Unacknowledged nomination. The Nzpcmad nomination is just sitting there because we don't have a policy. Perhaps we should expire a nomination after some time since a renomination could always be done at a later time.
4. Encourage more discussion. It'd be nice if each admin could think of one or two boilerplate questions which they always ask (this is a common technique for employers doing job interviews to prevent accidental bias in interviewing.) The boilerplate questions could be attempts to find items which could do with further discussion. They would serve to ensure that each nominee is actually asked some questions. Basically, I'd like to encourage greater discussion with the nominee, and only asking some nominees some questions can feel more like an interogation (even though it's not meant to be). I'd rather it felt more like a group of folks getting to know one another at a pub.

So, I stretched the time period from 7 to 14 days, since that's the same as we do for deletions. I think that the unacked nomination for Ncpcmad expired after the regular time period, and we should renominate once we have some better idea of his/her availability.

As far as renominations: I'd suggest that we avoid nailing this down. Maybe just say, "Unlimited renominations possible immediately, preferably with outstanding issues resolved"? Maybe we can count on common sense on this one. --Evan 10:56, 29 Jun 2005 (EDT)

[edit] Voting rights

After I submitted my two cents, I noticed that the approval process requires assent by current admins. I am not an admin. I had not read the admin nomination page in a while and should have done so before chiming in. That said, Bill-on-the-Hill helped me recently when I got in over my head on a page move. He was quick to help, knowledgable, and good natured about my gaffe. Naturally, I looked up some of his contributions and was impressed with the amount and quality of his work. Sorry for blundering in. SHC 13:41, 4 May 2006 (EDT)

It is not entirely clear if voting is an open process. The agreement of at least 2 other admins is a minimum requirement but maybe everyone else can vote too. -- Ricardo (Rmx) 13:45, 4 May 2006 (EDT)

I think the discussion should be open to the entire community. As Ricardo (Rmx) said it requires a minimum of 2 other admins to approve, but as I understand it anyone can nominate and discuss nominations. See Wikitravel:Administrators. - Tom Holland (xltel) 14:03, 4 May 2006 (EDT)

Yes, that's the case. Everyone's welcome to add their voice to the discussion. Two admins for and none against is the minimal requirement, but I don't know what we'd do if there were, say, 15 non-admins for and nobody against, or two admins for and 35 non-admins against. Fortunately it hasn't come up, since we've had such great people already. --Evan 14:11, 4 May 2006 (EDT)

If admins unanimously ignore groundswells of non-admin opinion in that fashion, then we have more important problems than how admins are chosen. I'm happy to see non-admins contribute to the discussion and support. But I don't want Willy and 14 of his logins to vote an admin down -- and the only way I can foresee avoiding that is to keep the actually tallying to admins. -- Colin 18:49, 4 May 2006 (EDT)

I agree. If we come to a state where we need a policy for such situations, no policy can help us. — Ravikiran 00:58, 5 May 2006 (EDT)

[edit] Admin timeline

Of 3 recent nominations, 1 is out 16 days and another is out the minimum 14, but I don't see either Bill-on-the-Hill or Todd on the list of current admins. Hope I didn't miss the announcement. SHC 18:22, 20 May 2006 (EDT)

[edit] Nomination template

The instructions for how to nominate someone for Admin duty were recently replaced with a fairly complicated template to fill out, apparently copied and translated from the Swedish Wikitravel. Do we really need to structure the process like this? The freeform approach (nomination followed by votes/comments) seemed to me to work pretty well. But if we're going to use this template, it needs more explanation, because I don't understand it. I've already removed the "Administrator or Bureaucrat" section because it's inapplicable, but I don't even know what the "Support/Neutral/Do not support" lines are there for... is that supposed to tell us what our voting options are, are we supposed to put our votes there, or what? - Todd VerBeek 07:35, 10 July 2006 (EDT)

I don't see the point either, it's not like there's such an overwhelming flood of applicants that we need it... Jpatokal 04:11, 11 July 2006 (EDT)

[edit] Selecting a go-between for en:

Since we're moving the multilingual coordination pages from en: to shared:, it seems like an appropriate time to start doing go-between reports for en:. This would kind of suggest that we need a go-between. I'd like to start some nominations; the voting procedure for e.g. the French Wikitravel Expedition seems to be fair and not too confrontational. Should we start this on e.g. Wikitravel:Go-between nominations? --Evan 11:50, 13 August 2006 (EDT)

This is a smart idea. The voting procedure looks fine to me... Maj 12:14, 13 August 2006 (EDT)

Choosing a liaison user for en: sounds quite good to me. What I don't like about the "French" system, though, is that you end up seeing people having to decline their nominations whereas others may feel like it's against the rules to self-nominate. I'd rather see some volunteers who would really like to undertake the job fighting among themselves for this prestigious international post. --Ricardo (Rmx) 14:59, 19 August 2006 (EDT)

[edit] Reflections

I am continuously amazed by the number of Wikitravellers that become administrators. I think it's particularlly wonderful how almost all of our regular contributors have become admins or have at least been nominated for the position. While, the the sysop user rights is something that is kind of mistaken as meaning having absolute authority and righteous judgement, especially on Wikipedia, the idea of who is a Wikitravel "admin" can be extended to those who aren't even "sysops". The administrator nomination process is more of a formality saying "Hey, this person is a great contributor." Take OldPine and WindHorse for example, while they turned down the extra buttons, both are still philisophical administrators - leaders within the community, who provide an excellent service to the project and travellers from around the world.

Sure we all make mistakes like my biting when I should have barked a little longer over the edit war on the US article or everyone who voted "keep" for Congress ( just joking :} ), but we have great people who help clear our heads and we all learn from our mistakes and make sure that what we learn promotes the project and helps new users.

Unfortunately, I am unable to conclude this in the elegant manner that I had intended, but I'll give it a shot. It's been a great pleasure to help organize the project and contribute, but the only reason it's been so great is because of the other "administrators" like Evan, Maj, Tom, Colin, Ryan, Todd, Jani, Bill, David (OldPine), the anonymous WindHorse, Ravi, Hypatia, Sandy, Tim (Tsandell) and the many others that I've forgotten to mention. -- Andrew H. (Sapphire) 23:13, 23 October 2006 (EDT)

I think that qualifies as elegant and I'll bet I'm not the only one. I very much agree with the sentiments and appreciate the inclusion. There are times when I wish I had The Button or even the steenkeen badge, but I really do enjoy being "just a contributor". I do appreciate and admire the way you guys take care of business and just wanted to say so. Thanks for the opportunities... all of them... all of you. OldPine 07:11, 24 October 2006 (EDT)

I've got one of those left-wired brains that makes me not-so-good with words, but just wanted to leave a quick note saying that I appreciate being included in your list, and agree that it's pretty cool what such a diverse group has been able to do together. -- Ryan 23:03, 24 October 2006 (EDT)

I really feel bad about not including everyone who I should have included. I had to add a few names after checking the recent changes page and seeing another name and realized I forgot to add him/her! You made it really easy for me to list your name because of your advice on various topics and your edits. -- Andrew H. (Sapphire) 23:24, 24 October 2006 (EDT)

Well said Sapphire! You do a great job as a community leader above-and-beyond the 'extra button' pushing! I'm glad we got a chance to hang out at Wikimania. I'm really looking forward to meeting more of our excellent admins, superusers, daily contributors, and newbies at the Get-together. Maj 13:41, 29 October 2006 (EST)

[edit] self-check checklist for a nominant

As I still remember evaluating myself for an admin nomination, I propose to add a self-check section for a nominant, with something like this:

If you were nominated, the following can help you to evaluate how well you fit an admin role:

• you are not expected to spend more time on Wikitravel than before gaining admin role
• you are not expected to patrol all edits. If you only use WatchList, that's fine. If you don't read recent comments on a regular basis at all, it is also OK.
• understanding existing guidelines doesn't mean that you should never challenge or aim to improve them

OK to add a section like this just before the "Nominations" section? --DenisYurkin 16:55, 27 January 2008 (EST)