Important: Wikitravel is exploring a license upgrade to CC by-sa 3.0, please give your consent or refusal here.

From Wikitravel

This is where we determine whether an article is ready for be classified as Star status. Even though the criteria are fairly objective, it's good to get some additional eyes to look over a page and confirm that it's ready before elevating it to Star. For reference, here's the general description, from Wikitravel:Article status:

The article is essentially complete. It meets all of the above criteria. It follows the manual of style exactly or is the exception that proves the rule. Prose is not only near-perfect grammatically but also tight, effective, and enjoyable. It has appropriate illustrations, such as photos and a map. Enough breadth and depth of material is presented that anyone familiar with the subject of the article would have little to point out as absent. Future changes to this kind of article would reflect changes in the subject (e.g. a museum closes, a hotel price changes, a new airport is built) more than they'd require improvements in the coverage.

Objective criteria for Star status varies depending on the kind of article it is. For more concrete guidance on this, see:

• Wikitravel:City guide status
• Wikitravel:Region guide status
• Wikitravel:Country guide status
• Wikitravel:Park guide status
• Wikitravel:Itinerary status
• Wikitravel:Travel topic status
• Wikitravel:Phrasebook status

If you feel that an article currently at Star status is no longer worthy, or never was to begin with, this is also the place to nominate to de-star an article.

[edit] Nominate

Star articles: Last minute checklist The article must be complete — See definition above. Grammar and spelling must be perfect — See definition above. Prose should be stylistically superior and effective. Illustration: the article should be appropriately illustrated with pictures and a Wikitravel-style map, with all attractions marked. Listings should be in alphabetical order — geographical order is also acceptable if it is deemed better. No duplications: a listing should appear under one section only — if there is ambiguity, put it under the section that it most applies to. Time and date formats: Use: M,Tu,W,Th,F,Sa,Su; "...daily" not "Daily..."; "midnight and noon" not "12AM and 12PM"; "AM PM" not "am pm". (Examples: "M-F noon-11PM" and "9AM-9PM daily"). Section introductions are not mandatory but should be present when they serve to improve a section. Use "—" (mdash) for breaks in thought. Use abbreviations for addresses, e.g., St, Ave, Ln, Blvd.

You can nominate any "guide" quality article you think is ready to be declared a "star". Please do not nominate an article if you know that it falls short of the criterion above — refer to the info box for a last minute checklist. If there are other nominations on this page, add yours to the bottom of the list. The basic format of a nomination is as follows:

===[[Article name]]===
This has everything we're looking for,
plus a swell kitchen sink. ~~~~

Having done this, please replace the {{guide...}} tag with

{{starnomination}}

at the bottom of the nominated article. You also need to post a note at the Wikitravel:Travellers' Pub to publicize your nomination — remember to tell people that partial critiques and even just a few quick words of support are welcome. These steps help draw attention to the article's nomination, improving the discussion as to whether it should be awarded star status.

[edit] Discuss

Please comment on whether you agree that the nominated article is ready, with a bullet point (*) and your signed opinion. If you think it's ready, a simple "Support" will do. If not, explain what you think is missing or not up to standards. You don't have to leave a detailed critique to vote on the star — partial critiques are welcome, and feel free to just voice your support for the hard work someone else has done.

===[[Article name]]===
This has everything we're looking for, plus a swell kitchen sink.  TravelNut 25:25, 31 Feb 2525 (EDT)
* The sink isn't properly formatted, and there are no "budget" places to sleep. ~~~~

After three weeks of discussion, if a consensus is reached, then that an article becomes a star, and the discussion should be archived. Note that a consensus means that all outstanding objections should have been addressed and dropped; if issues remain then the discussion should either continue or, if they cannot or will not be addressed in reasonable time, the article should be added to the slush pile. Regardless of the outcome, it is useful to copy the nomination discussion to the article's talk page.

[edit] Nominations for Star status

For an archive of previous successful nominations please see Wikitravel:Star nominations/Archives.

[edit] Diving the Cape Peninsula and False Bay/Long Beach Simon's Town

Motivation: This is the first dive site to reach the stage where star nomination is appropriate (by my criteria), so I have nominated it to get feedback so that a standard can be set for dive sites. This site is reasonably typical of one of a range of site types. Pbsouthwood 13:36, 11 October 2009 (EDT)

My proposed criteria for star status for a dive site follow:

→ Moved to Talk page (Stefan)

Some edits have been done to keep formatting in line with modifications to Diving the Cape Peninsula and False Bay/Pinnacle, also a star nomination at this time, and which has has far more attention. Also a few content improvements. Still waiting for a direct comment on this one though. Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 16:21, 26 October 2009 (EDT)

[edit] Diving the Cape Peninsula and False Bay/Pinnacle

Motivation: This is the second dive site to reach the stage where it can be considered for Star status, and it is sufficiently different from Long Beach (nominated above) to be a useful comparison. Pbsouthwood 08:11, 13 October 2009 (EDT)

We're breaking new ground here, so I imagine there will be some issues to iron out, but to kick this one of.

• The position paragraph feels a bit awkward, maybe it will look better if the coordinates are just moved to the top and the info incorporated in the introduction.
• The depth paragraph could use a rephrase.
• It's a normal star criteria, that I think also fits here, that all "attractions" should be marked on the map; in this case I'm missing the the cave, the islet and especially the entry gully - it took me a while to to see that red path, let alone figure out this is probably the one leading to entry point. Also that green line is lost on me - pebbles/sand border?

Other than that, this is awesome work! And I like the feel of this guide much better than than the other nomination btw, it reads much more easily. --Stefan (sertmann) ^Talk 10:54, 13 October 2009 (EDT)

Thanks for the comments Stefan.

• I have rewritten the position paragraph. I am not sure what you mean in your comment. Are you suggeting that the information is put into the leader paragraph with the coordinates first item on the page? (and delete the 'Position' subsection). This would be possible with this site, but for some sites it may be necessary to provide more complex information involving bearings and distances, so the idea was to keep all that sort of information in one place. Moving the position subsection ahead of the access subsection might be an improvement, so I will look at that possibility.
• I have rewritten the depth paragraph. I dont know if it is much better. It should be a little clearer at least.
• Your comments on the map are valid. I will sort this out. Add labels for attractions and landmarks and make the path clearer.
• Thanks for the appreciation. A lot of hours went into mapping this site, as I swam each of the contour lines towing a GPS to record a track. The green line is, as you assume, the border between pebbles and sand. As all the colour codes for the water are depth bands, I didnt want to confuse the issue by using a colour code for bottom type. Not sure how to improve this, but will give it some thought.
• This site is very different from the other, which is why I chose to nominate them together, as any style and layout decisions should be applicable to both. Pbsouthwood 09:12, 14 October 2009 (EDT)

I have made the changes to the map, but although the full size image is changed, the thumbnail remains the same even after purging the cache for the page. Pbsouthwood 15:01, 14 October 2009 (EDT)

The new map shows up on my PC, so it's probably a local catching issue. Anyway, went over the article again, and my biggest remaining worry is that long list of nudibranches - long lists in articles are not my cup of tea - so I thought it over, and came up with a suggestion for a different organisation on the talk page. --Stefan (sertmann) ^Talk 16:52, 14 October 2009 (EDT)

• Interesting and very well written. Stefan's suggestions about the Nudibranch section on the talk page are very apt I think. A few other comments:

• I am wondering why the Understand section comes after Get in? That jars a bit.
• As a point of grammar, initial capitals are surely wrong when giving an English name of a species? Eg: ghost nudibranch and not Ghost nudibranch.
• Internal link markup is largely absent in the article. Eg: Gordon's Bay.--Burmesedays 10:56, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

Hi Burmesedays.

• I am still trying to think of a better way to deal with the nudibranchs. I dont want to have to leave out the ones I dont have photos for, and red links in a gallery would not look good.
• Understand after Get in can be changed if there is consensus or at least a second opinion. I don't have strong feelings about it. It is something that just happened as the formatting developed.
• My position on capitalising English names of species is mildly pragmatic. If I dont capitalise, in some cases it is impossible to tell if it is a proper name for the species or just a description. Agile klipfish is the accepted common name for a particular species. How would you know this if it was written as agile klipfish? If I do it for one, I would prefer for consistency to do it for all. I am open to discussion here.
• Good point on internal links. I will sort this out. Unfortunately I have about 150 dive sites to correct, but that just means it will take a while. You get this with R&D. Pbsouthwood 13:13, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

Regarding the missing pictures of Nudibranches, have you tried looking here and here? All those a freely licensed, and egliable for upload here. I understand if you don't find it entirely kosher to have "nudi" pictures from another site, but I always find myself rooting for pragmatism :) I'll be happy to try and help locate any missing pictures if you tell me which ones you are missing. --Stefan (sertmann) ^Talk 16:30, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

I have put in internal links in the leader paragraph of all the Cape Peninsula and False Bay sites.

• I will try out Get in after Understand. It makes sense.
• I will also look at how the article looks with a gallery as suggested, using photos from other sites as placeholders. Thanks for the links, Stefan. Many of the relevant photos were taken by a friend. Not really surprising I suppose. Pbsouthwood 12:18, 22 October 2009 (EDT)

Stefan and Burmesedays:

• I have rearranged the order of sections as suggested by Burmesedays, and moved "Position" into "Understamd", where it seems a little more at home. I am still hoping for a better heading than "Topography" for that section, but still have not thought of an improvement. "Layout" is the only alternative that seems appropriate, but I am not quite happy with it. (Topography is technically accurate, but maybe a bit technical)
• I would like opinions on the new arrangement: Keep, Revert or Try again?

I'm happy with it, I follows our general guidelines as far as it's feasible without sacrificing usability for those who really need it, the divers. Topography is fine in my book, where as "Suggested Routes" could probably be renamed to our standard "Itineraries" without sacrificing anything (I think?). That nudibranch list is still a (and about the only) dealbraker for me though, for a star guide I'm not really happy with good enough. If you can come up with a different way of presenting them from my suggestion I'd be more than willing to listen, but currently it doesn't have that professional feel that we generally want from our stars - so I'd really like to see if that gallery fixes that nagging feeling. --Stefan (sertmann) ^talk 17:25, 22 October 2009 (EDT)

Thanks Stefan, How would you feel about just "Routes"? Itineraries sounds a bit grandiose for an underwater swim. Maybe someone else will venture a second opinion.

I will get out a test run of your gallery suggestion, as I cant think of anything better. Maybe it will look better than I expect. Pbsouthwood 02:23, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

I have re-arranged the section as a gallery. It does not appear to work for the printable version. Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 10:56, 26 October 2009 (EDT)

• Support cool, think I'm happy now. Once we finally get a Mediawiki upgrade and access to common.js, it should be made collapsible, until then I'll be happy to slap a star after this one - great work. And the printable version works fine for me btw. --Stefan (sertmann) ^talk 11:21, 26 October 2009 (EDT)

• Very well done Peter. Having the understand section first really does help. And the gallery works nicely. My only slight caveat is the map. I think it is compulsory that a Star article should have a Wikitravelised map? You obviously put a lot of work into getting the data for this map. I can have a go at Wikitravelising it a little if you want and upload for you to check? I see that just a png is uploaded, do you have a svg version of the map? Otherwise it is a lot of re-tracing. Otherwise, the article seems perfect to me. --Burmesedays 08:30, 7 November 2009 (EST)

Hi Burmesedays, I see you have been quite active with mapwork recently. All my maps were done on CorelDraw, so are originally vector graphics. Unfortunately I have not yet found out how to convert an output from CorelDraw to SVG. I can produce any of the file types optional to CorelDraw 9, but then I am stuck. Do you have any suggestions? Converting the map manually will be at least tens of hours of work. the original took probably over 100 hours, not counting the sitework. -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 01:10, 8 November 2009 (EST)

Hi Peter. I am not a CorelDraw user so have no idea. It is apparently possible to output svg though in version 10 or newer. Anyone else ever managed this? If not, a re-trace in Inkscape is certainly possible and I am happy to try this - I did the main land section of this map quite quickly yesterday. Perhaps though someone else should put forward a view as to whether a WT style map is necessary for the article to gain star status. As I said, apart from that, to my eye this is now a star article. --Burmesedays 01:25, 8 November 2009 (EST)

Hi Burmesedays, Your "output svg" link does not work for me. I will upload the Coreldraw file to shared when I get back home later today so anyone who wants to try the conversion can have a go. Unfortunately upgrading CorelDraw is not a financially sensible option at this stage. I dont use it enough to justify the expense just to be able to output SVG files, which I only need for Wikitravel at present. -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 02:15, 8 November 2009 (EST)

It seems like you cant get there from here. Shared will not upload the source file as a .cdr. If anyone wants to try converting it I will have to mail it direct. -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 02:47, 8 November 2009 (EST)

Is CDR your only available output format? If you can export it as a WMF or PDF or EPS then InkScape can open it. LtPowers 10:10, 8 November 2009 (EST)

A flat file will not be helpful. The idea here was to get Peter's CorelDraw9 file into CorelDraw10 so that it can be exported as an SVG. --Burmesedays 21:03, 8 November 2009 (EST)

My apologies for not leaving a detailed critique—I feel a little out of my depth (har har), given that I've regrettably never gone further than snorkeling ;) I do agree, though, that the map should at least approximate Wikitravel style (recognizing that it's simply amazing that you've swam the contour lines to complete it!). The article status requirements are a little disorganized, since to this date we have had very few non-city/district articles become stars, but the map in Wikitravel style with modifiable vector source has consistently been held to be a requirement. Converting the map to Wikitravel style is fairly simple—just slap on the standard WT compass arrow, title box, and scale. Converting to SVG may be harder. If you can convert it to a PDF file, that likely can be imported into Inkscape and then saved as an SVG.

On a different note, the article as it stands seems in violation of shared:Image_policy#Minimal_use_of_images. My inclination is not to simply dump the excellent, useful photos, but rather to at least make the article format more print friendly by putting the image gallery at the very bottom of the page. That will also save users who cannot print in color, since the nudibranch images won't be very useful in B&W. It doesn't solve the potential problem of low bandwidth in internet cafes, but I'm not inclined to let this hold up a star nomination. --Peter ^Talk 03:59, 9 November 2009 (EST)

Burmesedays, what do you mean by "flat file"? I'm only familiar with the term in the context of databases. LtPowers 08:55, 9 November 2009 (EST)

Sorry for the Jargon. The Adobe-familiar like me use that term to mean a file in which the layers have been flattened and are no longer editable as individually defined vectors or layers. So, I meant a file with no editable layers. Like a PDF. Please put me right if I am wrong (and I am an Inkscape novice), but I don't see how Inkscape would handle a PDF any more helpfully than the PNG which is already available? If there is way for Inkscape to determine the layering of a flat file which has been exported as a PDF from a program like CD or any of the Adobe design family, please tell me how - that would be both surprising and great to know! Cheers. --Burmesedays 09:43, 9 November 2009 (EST)

Apologies, yes; I was just thinking of vector formats without thinking about whether all of the layers are still in there or not. I don't think a PDF is necessarily flattened, but I don't actually know. LtPowers 10:35, 9 November 2009 (EST)

Yup. As far as I know you can maintain individual layer editing capabilities in PDF output, but only specific to the program which the PDF was created in. Eg you can create a PDF with Photoshop which retains the layer structure which can be edited later in Photoshop only. Not sure that it can be done generically but I am by no means an expert on this. --Burmesedays 04:00, 10 November 2009 (EST)

Hi Peter,

1. What features of Wikitravel style do you consider essential for a dive site map? A dive site is inherently a little different to a regional or city map, so there may be features not appropriate for a dive site.
2. Possibly a work-around would be to make a Wikitravel map as well, without the contours etc, which shows the basic layout of the site with the road, path, and labels for the features, and keep a slightly simplified version of the contour map, perhaps with less text? The contours are valuable information for the traveller, and I think the information should stay, but I dont know of a rule against more than one map, or that all maps must be of the same style.
3. What do you feel about putting the gallery in a sub-article to the dive site, with a link, and reduced captions, and just the text on the dive site article. This will mean that the gallery sub article would be a sub-sub-article: Diving the Cape Peninsula and False Bay/Pinnacle/Gallery and I dont know how that would fit in with policy. I think it might go against the letter of the law, but might still be a good way to deal with this type of problem, specially the bandwidth problem. Jani may have useful comment here, about how these options would fit in with printed versions through Wikitravel Press. -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 09:54, 9 November 2009 (EST)

I did not intend to open a can of worms when I suggested a Wikitravelised map would be good. I do not know what Peter might be considering as appropriate, but when I volunteered to prepare it, I had in mind:

• colour scheme to be more in line with the general look of WT maps.
• a standard WT north arrow
• road name(s) (is that a 2nd road behind the one marked R44?)
• dotted line for footpath
• a standard WT inset title box
• WT dejavu fonts
• WT scale format
• A second scale showing the extent of depth band changes
• Some indication of where the road routes out lead to ---Burmesedays 10:25, 9 November 2009 (EST)

Oh, I absolutely did not mean that you should remove the contour lines! Burmesedays' suggestions sound good to me. The standard WT color scheme might be hard to reconcile with the type of information you are displaying, but I don't think that's of critical importance. --Peter ^Talk 11:05, 9 November 2009 (EST)

I have been trying to convert the cdr file to svg. It has not been going well. So far, after about 6 hours work, I have produced what appears to be a flat image with major losses, distortions and colour changes. I downloaded and installed Python 2.6 and some other required software, installed Uniconvert, finally worked out how to get the paths sorted out and managed to get it to run using a .cdr input. It produced a distorted result, without layers, but apparently editable. I also tried exporting as an .ai file and converting that in the same way, but all I got was pages of error messages. My skills with Inkscape are also dismal, and nothing seems to work the way I would expect. Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 05:23, 10 November 2009 (EST)

Peter, please email me the cdr file (untouched - exactly as when saved from CD9). I have a few professional graphic design contacts and know that one of them will have CD10. We will get there :). If that works and we get svg output OK, I will have a go at Wiktiravelising the map a little and post it on shared for your comment. --Burmesedays 06:49, 10 November 2009 (EST)

Hi Burmesedays, I have had some success with Inkscape since my last comment. Most of the distortions and apparent losses were due to layer loss and shape order loss. All text has gone too, but that is manageable. I have managed to reconstruct most of the map, but it would be really interesting to see how it would work in a direct save from CorelDraw 10 to SVG, so I am keen to send you the file, but there does not appear to be a way to attach the file to the e-mail through Wikitravel. -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 10:42, 10 November 2009 (EST)

Pleased you have made some progress. I know very well how tricky Inkscape is when you first try to get to grips with it :). I have just sent you my email address.--Burmesedays 10:47, 10 November 2009 (EST)

Peter the export to svg worked fine from CorelDraw ver 13.0. I have made a few quick suggestions on the map (drawn a depth scale, added a standard WT inset box, direction out markers, standarised fonts, WT north arrow) and uploaded both the svg and png. The depth scale needs labelling and I notice that I missed the yellow islet label. I have no idea how to handle the sand/pebble demarcation and maybe that has to go? I will leave it in your capable hands to accept these changes or not, and to make any more you deem necessary. Cheers and I hope that is helpful. --Burmesedays 22:48, 10 November 2009 (EST)

Burmesedays,

Well done, the svg came out beautifully, Much better than my attempt with UniConvert. This is definitely the way to go. I see that the layers have been lost this way too, but I can reconstruct that if necessary. The pebble demarcation can go for the present, I may come up with a better option, but what was there was always a bit of a place marker for a better idea. I will get to touching up the map as soon as I have a bit of free time again, as I must prepare a lecture for Saturday. One thing I would like to do though is put back the compass rose, as the map is intended to be usable as a chart, for compass navigation, and that makes it much easier to read off a direction. Do you have the raw conversion svg? If so could you mail it to me direct?

I also worked out how to download the svg's. I have been left-clicking on them like I would do for any other link, and kept getting "Data not available message", which was not particularly helpful. For some reason unknown to me, I decided to right click today, and select "Save target as". Immediate success. Is this how it works for everyone or is my browser being difficult? Once I have the svg downloaded, it will open in IE no problem. There is no instruction anywhere to right-click and "save as". I will play around with the map for a while and see what looks best. -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 14:46, 12 November 2009 (EST)

Burmesedays. Thanks for the original, I have replaced the compass rose. It works quite well as it stands for colour and monochrome, but I am willing to tweak it if anyone thinks it can be improved. It is my intention to produce a PD template for dive charts once the details are settled. -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 03:06, 14 November 2009 (EST)

Update on some of the issues raised earlier:

• colour scheme to be more in line with the general look of WT maps.

I dont think this will work, but will consider suggestions.

• a standard WT north arrow

This does not provide the navigation information in a compass rose. If there are cosmetic changes recommended for the compass rose I will modify it.

• road name(s) (is that a 2nd road behind the one marked R44?)

Road name added, road at the back is a service road of no importance to a diver. I could put information with arrows if anyone thinks it is worth the effort and of any use. The road is from the R44 to a pump station and filtration plant on the mountainside treating water from the Steenbras dam.

• dotted line for footpath

Done by Burmesedays. Looks good to me.

• a standard WT inset title box

Done by Burmesedays, I have moved it to a legend box at the side. This appears to be compatible with Wikitravel map style, and looks cleaner to me. Negotiable.

• WT dejavu fonts

Done: I used DejaVu Sans Condensed Bold mostly, Is seems to have good legibility. Colours chosen to give good contrast on colour and monochrome display.

• WT scale format

Is this necessary with the scales on the edges? I would prefer to keep these as I think they are more useful to the user. Only reason I can see for other scale is to include feet.

• A second scale showing the extent of depth band changes

Done by Burmesedays

• Some indication of where the road routes out lead to

Done. Made new style arrow, which looks better to me.

I have used the blue numbered WT icons for the points of interest instead of text on the body of the chart as they are more legible and less intrusive. Awaiting comments. Cheers, -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 03:06, 14 November 2009 (EST)

Support. Sorry it has taken me so long to unequivocally state that. You have broken new ground here and set the bar for diving articles and deserve huge credit for that. Very well done.--Burmesedays 09:32, 16 November 2009 (EST)

Hey, its a tough job but somebody's got to do it:-) Seriously, though, your help has been of great value and is much appreciated. I wouldn't have got so far without it. -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 14:18, 16 November 2009 (EST)

I have also done an experimental sub-article gallery for the nudibranch images as I suggested in item 3 above, leaving the text in the Pinnacle article. This will reduce the bandwidth problem and looks quite pracical to me. I quite like the result, but would like comment or consensus to leave it this way, as it is a significant precedent. There is some duplication of text content, but I think this is necessary for clarity. -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 04:35, 14 November 2009 (EST)

[edit] Teaching English

This was nominated some time back and rejected. It would have been our first star travel topic, and one of the issues was that we weren't entirely clear on criteria for a star topic. The same issue may come up for the dive site topics.

Some of the other issues raised in the earlier rejection have been addressed. Others, like not being "complete" in a sense that requires a book, have been ignored. Is it ready now? Pashley 21:46, 13 October 2009 (EDT)

Some of Gorilla Jones' concerns do not seem to have been addressed, but I think he made some valid points. This article doesn't offer much for those actually teaching it, nor does it offer much comparative information between countries/regions. I also think this article has an Asia focus that the title does not imply. There are scattered references to the Middle East and Europe, but a lot more could be said about these, I imagine. Latin America is on the list as a "popular" place for teaching English yet if I am considering doing this in Latin America, the article doesn't offer me much (absolutely nothing specific about this supposedly popular choice). If I am considering teaching English in Africa, the article is definitely not going to help. I think most people do end up in Asia, but the article should still mention the full scope of possibilities, because "Teaching English" is done elsewhere. Including these atypical destinations would also put our guide above most others, that are also focused around China, Japan, and Korea. ChubbyWimbus 02:21, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

A few observations:

1. Does the article have to provide much for those actually teaching? There are links to sites which presumably do just that. What information for people actually teaching would be considered appropriate?
2. Requiring equal representation for all possible places where English may be taught by a traveller might be an excessive requirement, and perhaps would prevent the article from ever reaching star status. One possible way around this might be to have the main article "Teaching English", and regional sub articles. In this way the main article could be rated a star if at least one region is a star. Also it might be useful to the user if it is split into regions.
3. Is "Teaching English" the best title? A large number of teachers of English do it with no connection to travelling except their daily commute. OK, I realise that this is Wikitravel and anything in it will automatically be assumed to have some connection with travel, but there may be a better title. Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 02:55, 3 November 2009 (EST)

Well, it is called "Teaching English", so it's not a stretch to think that someone might expect to find pointers and suggestions for those already teaching it. As far as number 2 is concerned, I think it is completely reasonable to expect an article to cover the topic fully in order to be a star, and no article is entitled to star status. If no one adds information about Latin America, Africa, Middle East, or Europe, then I don't see why it should be a star. If the New York City article only mentioned Manhattan, would we call it a star? If star status articles are supposed to be the best guide Wikitravel (or any source) could offer on a particular subject, then I don't think we can expect this article to ever be a star if we make assumptions about where people do or should teach English. I'm not sure if splitting it by region/continent/country would be better or not. ChubbyWimbus 19:10, 3 November 2009 (EST)

I've rewritten the "Destinations" section and made a few changes elsewhere to better cover other places. Comments? Pashley 06:48, 5 November 2009 (EST)

Hi ChubbyWimbus,

1. Your first point and my third point relate. If it had a different title which did not imply that information for people already teaching English should be expected, then that requirement would disappear. I am not advocating such a change, just pointing it out as an option. I dont know or care enough about the subject to have strong opinions on the content.
2. My point is that it should be reasonably practicable for any article to be improved to star status if it is intended for this to be a target. If the idea is that only some classes of article can have the potential to become stars that is different. Technically, requiring that an article is complete may mean that it is complete regardless of the status of sub-articles or other articles lower in the geographical hierarchy, or that the status of subordinate articles is a criterion. This appears to be the case for regions, countries etc, where if I understand correctly, a significant portion of the subordinate articles must be at star or guide level for the high level article to be considered. This is reasonable, as requiring all subordinate articles to be star or guide would make it almost impossible for any other than the lowest level to gain and retain star status. I dont suggest that all non-star subordinate articles be deleted from mention, just that at least some percentage other than all should be required to be at star and guide level. -- Peter (Southwood) ^Talk 01:10, 8 November 2009 (EST)

[edit] Walt Disney World/Animal Kingdom

I believe this article is now up to the standards established with Epcot and Hollywood Studios. All attractions are listed, as well as all restaurants and hotels. I believe the map is about as good as possible, although I'm not 100% happy with it; suggestions are welcome. (Suggestions are also welcome for the rest of the article, too, of course.) LtPowers 15:35, 20 November 2009 (EST)

• Support. A very well written and formatted article. One small comment on the map - you might want to show a label with a directional arrow for Rafiki's Planet Watch on the main map. It took me a while to figure out where Rafiki's was in relation to the main map. --Burmesedays 05:13, 22 November 2009 (EST)

[edit] Bali

Although the bar for star region status is set very high, I think Bali is now up that standard. There are no articles to use as comparative benchmarks as this would be WT's first ever star region article if the nomination is successful. Indeed there are only two guide region articles here of which Bali is one.

Apart from the usual star considerations, star region status requires that all sub-region articles and all linked city/other destination articles are guide or better. Bali meets those structural requirements - all five sub-region articles are guides as are 19 of the 29 individual city/destination articles (and the other 10 are all usable). I realise that this is an ambitious nomination but it is one that I think is warranted. The requirements have been considered and extensively discussed in advance of this nomination. All comments are of course very welcome. --Burmesedays 01:37, 22 November 2009 (EST)

In general, I support the nomination — Bali is a major destination and we have a lot of good information, well-written & well-organised — but, as I read the requirements and text above, there are 10 articles that need to be brought up to guide before the top-level one can be promoted to star. Pashley 01:57, 22 November 2009 (EST)

Initially that is how I read it as well and that would in fact be near-impossible. However, it is the 7+2 cities and other destinations linked from the top level article that need to be at guide status. In the case of Bali there are nine of each and all 18 articles (plus one other) are at guide status together with the 5 sub-regions. This is discussed here and here--Burmesedays 02:27, 22 November 2009 (EST)

OK, full support from me, then. Pashley 03:37, 22 November 2009 (EST)

[edit] Nominations to remove Star status

Whenever possible, articles should be fixed rather than "de-starred". Only nominate articles which cannot be easily elevated/restored to "star" quality. Replace the Star status tag on the article with {{destarnomination}}. Vote "Star" or "Not Star".

[edit] Failed nominations

See Wikitravel:Star nominations/Slush pile for nominations that failed or were withdrawn. Articles should only be renominated when they address criticisms from the previous nomination. Please add the {{starpotential}} to the top of the article's discussion page.